Coal production in the UK is rising, in 2010 alone almost half the coal we use came from the UK, we just found a better way to get at it than killing miners in the long term by using open cast mining techniques.
Rugeley never was much of a town, when they started large mining operations back in the 50s with the openining of it was a basic mining town and not much more, it got a little bigger in the 60s when the National Coalboard opened things up more and the town got two power stations but was never much more than a mining town.
Since the closure of the pits there has been a marked increase in the size and diversity of the town, life is getting better for the residents, they now have two railways stations giving access to the whole of the UK (when the pits/Rugely A power Station were open they had only 4 rail services a day to Stafford and Rugby) The 70s and early 80s were not great times for the town, miners worked hard for low pay, the poor rail and road links deterred other manufacutrers from the area, now with lottery funding and other help the town is becoming a good place to live and businesses like Amazon are locating there.
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Celebrate a Death ?
Personally I found the closure of the Rugeley pits a "nice little earner" I was selling fitted kitchens back then and got a lot of business from the miners using redundancy pay to buy their council houses and renovate them, not everything was as black as some would have us believe, I am sure there were casualties but many people got out of a dangerous trade and into new ones often their own busineses.
Quote by MidsCouple24
the town is becoming a good place to live and businesses like Amazon are locating there.
no, it isn't, its a shit hole!
The town is dead.
All my family live in Rugeley, I was bought up there. Half my family were miners.
I was one of the lucky ones who managed to escape. It's a rife, nasty drug den of a town with a static population.
It was a market town and was around for many hundreds of years with Horse Fairs and Sheep Fairs. It thrived as a market town. The colliery enhanced it further with immigrants coming from Tyne & Wear and Scotland to support the very rich seams beneath the Trent going towards Burton.
There was no need to close Rugeley colliery, short sightedness in the extreme.
Quote by deancannock
I would never celebrate someones death.....but coming from a mining family, living in a mining town, being part, of what once was, a mining community, with a mining tradition....I am damned sure I shall be shedding NO tears.
Ask the mothers and fathers if they are truly sad that their sons no longer have to go miles underground to earn a paltry living in a dangerous and unhealthy environment. I was brought up in Wigan and St Helen's and six of my school friends were on apprenticeships with the coal board. Whilst they were all strikers and agitated at the time, not one of them is now mourning the loss of a filthy and dangerous industry and none would have been happy for their kids to be going down the mines now.
I do not believe that anyone can be saying this kind of stuff about Mrs Thatcher could have been an adult between 1976 and 1979 when this country truly was on its knees and real poverty existed.
Surprise surprise....my name gives it away, I am from Cannock. The Cannock Chase coal seam, had 5 pits operating it. Littleton Colliery was the most productive man for man in the whole of Europe. But Mrs Thatcher, chose to close it down....not because it was not making money, not because its reserves were running out, but out of vindictivness. Littleton Came out on strike, and didn't operate during the miners strike. She simply wanted her own back. Short sighted and vindictive. It destroyed a community, and it destroyed lives. I have said it before but I shall tell you again...I actually consider Mrs Thatcher to have my families blood on her hands. My younger brother worked down Littleton, when it closed ; he was devasted. He couldn't find alternative work. He had a wife and 3 young chilren to try and feed and put clothes on their back. He felt a failure for not being able to sustain his family. He was found hanging from the rafters of the loft. Thats the legacy of Mrs Thatcher...destruction of communities and families. Thats why although not celebrating her death, I shall not be shedding any tears!!
Dean, it's understandable that you have very strong emotions on this subject. I know nothing about Littleton Colliery so have done a little research. From what I can see online, it was designated a 'core' colliery by the then Conservative Government in 1992 but then closed in December 1993. If this is correct, whatever the reason was for the colliery's closure , it couldn't have been due to Thatcher's vindictiveness as she left office in 1990.
Max....if you read below from local newspaper....you will see and read who announced the closure of Littleton Colliery.....It was then saved by being listed as a core colliery....then the Tory Government changed back to orginal plan. 2000 out of work .. Working down the pit was not nice....but there was a tradtion and a comaradry amonst the men. Both my Great grandfather and grandfather lost limbs in rock falls, so trust me the family knew the risks. However my father though not down the pit, worked for the Coal Board...and my brother carried on the tradition and went down the pits. I was the only one in 5 generations to have never worked for the coal board. The closure killed a community.
Says it all Max you say you know nothing about the closure of Littleton Colliery so you have done a LITTLE research and now you are an expert and preach that closing of the collieries were nothing to do with Thatcher. A little knowledge is as dangerous as no knowledge at all and you should not preach about things that you know sod all about.
Quote by deancannock
Max....if you read below from local newspaper....you will see and read who announced the closure of Littleton Colliery.....It was then saved by being listed as a core colliery....then the Tory Government changed back to orginal plan. 2000 out of work .. Working down the pit was not nice....but there was a tradtion and a comaradry amonst the men. Both my Great grandfather and grandfather lost limbs in rock falls, so trust me the family knew the risks. However my father though not down the pit, worked for the Coal Board...and my brother carried on the tradition and went down the pits. I was the only one in 5 generations to have never worked for the coal board. The closure killed a community.
Sorry Dean but I see no reference to any announcement of of the closure of the colliery within the article, only the closure date itself. The author is clearly wrong in stating Thatcher closed the mine. The articles I read also stated the number of miners that lost their job was 600 to 800, not 2000.
Sex God
my underlying thoughts would be if all these mines where so viable, why are they not all working now as a thriving privately owned industry ?????
Quote by AlanStone
Says it all Max you say you know nothing about the closure of Littleton Colliery so you have done a LITTLE research and now you are an expert and preach that closing of the collieries were nothing to do with Thatcher. A little knowledge is as dangerous as no knowledge at all and you should not preach about things that you know sod all about.
I'm not an expert but I can read and also understand what I have read, which is obviously more than you can do. Please tell me where I have said that the closure of the COLLIERIES was nothing to do with Thatcher.
Maybe you should try practising what YOU preach!
These taken from the article in todays Birming post linked above say it all for me
"It was spawned by coal. The black stuff fed and clothed families.
Littleton Colliery provided work for the majority of men who would emerge, black-faced, from the earth’s bowels and into pit pubs The Littleton Arms and White Lion. Huntington’s foundations were built on coal.
The miners’ cottages, dubbed ‘Monkey Row’, remain. The coal and the men who gouged it from the ground do not.
Littleton Colliery closed in 1993, the last of Cannock Chase’s many mines to succumb to Thatcher. "
"The scars created on the very soul of Huntington and neighbouring Cannock – a town littered with chipboard covered empty shops – are still vivid. They still sting.
Maggie’s ‘victims’ won’t forget. For that reason, they won’t mourn. "
I said in my orginal post...I would never celebrate another persons death, but neither will I be sheading any tears... I and my family as indeed most of Cannock are victims of Maggie ....and no we won't ever forget !!!!
"It was spawned by coal. The black stuff fed and clothed families.
Littleton Colliery provided work for the majority of men who would emerge, black-faced, from the earth’s bowels and into pit pubs The Littleton Arms and White Lion. Huntington’s foundations were built on coal.
The miners’ cottages, dubbed ‘Monkey Row’, remain. The coal and the men who gouged it from the ground do not.
Littleton Colliery closed in 1993, the last of Cannock Chase’s many mines to succumb to Thatcher. "
"The scars created on the very soul of Huntington and neighbouring Cannock – a town littered with chipboard covered empty shops – are still vivid. They still sting.
Maggie’s ‘victims’ won’t forget. For that reason, they won’t mourn. "
I said in my orginal post...I would never celebrate another persons death, but neither will I be sheading any tears... I and my family as indeed most of Cannock are victims of Maggie ....and no we won't ever forget !!!!
But as has been stated, Littleton colliery was one of the few to remain open long after her resignation in 1990 for another 3 years in fact.
So many like to blame her for everything that happens in Industry since she was PM, she is an easy scapegoat, politicians blame her, the media love to blame her it sells papers and make people watch TV and film, those that fought against her on picket lines blame her and anyone who listens to mom and dad but were not even born back then, please don't fall for propaganda, if a colliery can survive for 3 years after she left politics it could not be her fault.
The Tory Party thought it should stay open, British Coal thought otherwise.
Most of those who accepted redundancy (they voted 5-1 to accept it in a very quick meeting) were paid around £30,000 in severence pay, they were also offered jobs in other pits albeit 70 miles away.
Some found it interesting to see the Sun, not something you get to see a lot of 800 feet underground. During the Miners Strike Littleton Colliery had more than 2000 workers eligable to join the strike, I don't know how many went out on strike in support of their Yorkshire colleagues but at the end of the strike there were less than 200 still striking, most had returned to work.
The day the pit closed many miners said they were sad to see it end but that their families welcomed their new found safety and job security that would come with a change of employment.
Personally I sympathised with the miners but also with the Nation, we simply could not afford to subsidise the mines like some Countries did, many of which are now in dire straits financially.
So many like to blame her for everything that happens in Industry since she was PM, she is an easy scapegoat, politicians blame her, the media love to blame her it sells papers and make people watch TV and film, those that fought against her on picket lines blame her and anyone who listens to mom and dad but were not even born back then, please don't fall for propaganda, if a colliery can survive for 3 years after she left politics it could not be her fault.
The Tory Party thought it should stay open, British Coal thought otherwise.
Most of those who accepted redundancy (they voted 5-1 to accept it in a very quick meeting) were paid around £30,000 in severence pay, they were also offered jobs in other pits albeit 70 miles away.
Some found it interesting to see the Sun, not something you get to see a lot of 800 feet underground. During the Miners Strike Littleton Colliery had more than 2000 workers eligable to join the strike, I don't know how many went out on strike in support of their Yorkshire colleagues but at the end of the strike there were less than 200 still striking, most had returned to work.
The day the pit closed many miners said they were sad to see it end but that their families welcomed their new found safety and job security that would come with a change of employment.
Personally I sympathised with the miners but also with the Nation, we simply could not afford to subsidise the mines like some Countries did, many of which are now in dire straits financially.
Sex God
Quote by Mids
Yes totally stupid but her stupidity was giving the councils the ability to use too much of the money gained from selling council houses on other projects and not replacing the stock, it was the Councils who actually spent too much of the revenue on other projects more than a little naive of her and her advisors
I've seen you post this before. Where on earth do you get this from? My understanding is that the bulk of the take from the sale of council housing went straight to Treasury. The Thatcher Govt forced them to use the proceeds to pay off Local Authority debt to Central Govt, debt that had arisen in large part thanks to Central Govt slashing their bloody budgets. Nothing to do with local councils being frivolous with it, which is precisely why so many were up in arms about it.
If I have that wrong I'd love to see the evidence showing that to be the case.
Quote by MidsCouple24
The day the pit closed many miners said they were sad to see it end but that their families welcomed their new found safety and job security that would come with a change of employment.
Personally I sympathised with the miners but also with the Nation, we simply could not afford to subsidise the mines like some Countries did, many of which are now in dire straits financially.
New found safety and job security.....you taking the P**S or what. It was new found Unemployment. If you worked down the pits for past 10/20 years, what you going to do, become an accountant or maybe a merchant banker...oh I know I'll re-train as a hairdresser !! If you lived in the area affected you would know the devestation the closure of pits caused. A total community was killed off. The total lack of hope and the sence of loss. As mentioned before, I know from personal experiance the consequences of this.
You also say we we could not afford to subsidise the pits. First Littleton was thriving pit , highest productivity levels man for man in europe. It was more than viable. Even if it hadn't been, these miners employed were paying tax....close pits and they don't pay tax and claim unemployment payments. yes..we could at the time ( short sightness again, as once we closed our pits..the price shot up, as they knew they had us over a barrel ) but cheap coal from Poland. This was because their government subsided the production.
Quote by deancannock
The day the pit closed many miners said they were sad to see it end but that their families welcomed their new found safety and job security that would come with a change of employment.
Personally I sympathised with the miners but also with the Nation, we simply could not afford to subsidise the mines like some Countries did, many of which are now in dire straits financially.
New found safety and job security.....you taking the P**S or what. I don't think I said it so how you can accuse me of taking the piss I don't know, I said that it was reported in the media the Independant to be exact, I don't know I wasn't there but a number of reports I googled said the same thing. certainly the miners themselves decided not to fight the redundancies and closure when it was announced voting 5-1 to accept it without a fight and two weeks after the announcement was made the pit was closed, As I said the redundancy payments most quite considerable helped many to find a new vocation in life, no worse for them than the thousands of armed forces personnel being made redundant every year. It was new found Unemployment. If you worked down the pits for past 10/20 years, what you going to do, become an accountant or maybe a merchant banker...oh I know I'll re-train as a hairdresser !! Not a bad idea but most forces personnel have that same problem when leaving through redundancy or other reasons especially those who have suffered loss of limbs, there are more of them than there were miners at Littleton. If you lived in the area affected you would know the devestation the closure of pits caused. A total community was killed off. The total lack of hope and the sence of loss. More than half the workforce at Littleton were migrant workers from Scotland and other Northern pits who moved to Littleton when their own pits played out, probably quite easy for them to migrate to the next area, all those made redundant were offered jobs just 70 miles away, As mentioned before, I know from personal experiance the consequences of this.
You also say we we could not afford to subsidise the pits. First Littleton was thriving pit , highest productivity levels man for man in europe. It was more than viable. Even if it hadn't been, So please, tell me why the coalboard chose to close this pit, I cannot seem to find a reason these miners employed were paying tax....close pits and they don't pay tax and claim unemployment payments. yes..we could at the time ( short sightness again, as once we closed our pits..the price shot up, The Coal Board didn't give a rats ass wether they paid tax or not, it was not the Government that closed the pit it was the coalboard, the Government of the time wanted that pit to stay open and declared it as a primary site to stay open as they knew they had us over a barrel ) but cheap coal from Poland. This was because their government subsided the production.
As I said I sympathised with the miners as I sympathise with car workers and forces personnel and all others who face mass redundancies, but I do find it strange that so many blame the Government and only the Government for what happened to the mines, just recently many on here said we had to expect horsemeat because we wanted cheap meat, could not the same be said for coal, ships, steel, cars ? could it have been the people of Britain demanding cheap fuel or the Coalboard with some agenda for closing pits perhaps in favour of open cast mining ?
Some people did better out of the miners than others, Arthur Scargill for example kept his job as the President of the NUM until 2002 though he did keep the title of Honouray President (and the salary he was paid up until 2010 when he was informed he was no longer qualified as an NUM member.
In 2012 he won £13000 from the NUM for car expenses, also in 2012 he lost his case against the NUM who finally decided to stop paying for his London flat (£34,000 a year)
In 2012 he won £13000 from the NUM for car expenses, also in 2012 he lost his case against the NUM who finally decided to stop paying for his London flat (£34,000 a year)
Sex God
I have to be honest and say that I fail to see how Baroness Thatcher can be blamed for the closure of a mine three years after she left office.
For me a great Politian should be known for uniting a country together, not dividing it.
They should have a long term foresight not a short term power gain.
It seems Thatcher won the short term power gain as many see her as one of the most powerful Politian’s in this country.
Long term foresight tells me she had short term aims. I also believe she wreaked the chances of another woman becoming MP. As there hasn’t been one since.
There are far better Politian’s that have helped in trying to uniting this country than Thatcher ever tried to do.
For that reason I don’t think her funeral should be paid from the tax payer’s purse, she earned her wages at the time doing her job and should have saved like the rest of us to pay for her own funeral.
They should have a long term foresight not a short term power gain.
It seems Thatcher won the short term power gain as many see her as one of the most powerful Politian’s in this country.
Long term foresight tells me she had short term aims. I also believe she wreaked the chances of another woman becoming MP. As there hasn’t been one since.
There are far better Politian’s that have helped in trying to uniting this country than Thatcher ever tried to do.
For that reason I don’t think her funeral should be paid from the tax payer’s purse, she earned her wages at the time doing her job and should have saved like the rest of us to pay for her own funeral.
Quote by Trevaunance
A number of my "friends" on a well known social networking site are celebrating her death...
How very sad that someone should feel that the right thing to do...
Steve, I think you are absolutely correct. No person should celebrate the death of another. It is barbaric.
I never really liked the Lady but I agree totally with your words barbaric Trev.
People that feel that way are just as bad as the person that causes such hatred in my eyes.
Quote by Trevaunance
I have to be honest and say that I fail to see how Baroness Thatcher can be blamed for the closure of a mine three years after she left office.
Have you ever heard of the chaos theory?
Decissions made can ripple down for years to come before calm appears again. I think this country has been rippling for years since the Thatcher era and its impacts are still feeling felt today. Prior to Thatcher people never lived on credit for instance. It just wasn't the way people lived. We are all still feeling the impact of thatchers time. It had many known on effects in my view including both parents having to work. Before Thatchers time many mum's never worked full time.
People would blame woman's right but many woman wouldn't make that choice. Many have had to as there are no affordable housing to rent or buy.
The only people I believe that gain from her are private landlords that have book loads of properties and control the rental price.
People would always say thatcher has long gone, but I believe we are still living from the legancy she created. I don't think she meant it possibly to go the way it has.
I think in many ways she sold this country down the river and we are still drifting on the wages and under currents that she left.
Quote by Theladyisaminx
For me a great Politian should be known for uniting a country together, not dividing it.
They should have a long term foresight not a short term power gain.
It seems Thatcher won the short term power gain as many see her as one of the most powerful Politian’s in this country.
Long term foresight tells me she had short term aims. I also believe she wreaked the chances of another woman becoming MP. As there hasn’t been one since.
There are far better Politian’s that have helped in trying to uniting this country than Thatcher ever tried to do.
For that reason I don’t think her funeral should be paid from the tax payer’s purse, she earned her wages at the time doing her job and should have saved like the rest of us to pay for her own funeral.
Baroness Thatcher served 3 terms of office hardly in something to be considered short term power in British Politics, only one PM had done better than that back in the 17OOs no PM has managed it since.
She was unique in British Politics our first Woman Prime Minister at a time when despite what people said, Women in business were still considered by the "establishment" as a bit of a joke, let alone leading a Nation and in Politics.
Most Politicians think to last a full term these days is a good sign, it is not easy to please the Nation even less easy to please the people in your party who can oust you anytime they choose with or without the backing of the voters.
If Baroness Thatcher had short term aims please give me some examples of which of her policies were only short term and are no longer valid and which policies of her predecessors and even her successors which are still in operation. I mean is it was all so short term thinking subsequent PMs must have done away with the policies, right ?
It is really quite amazing how Baroness Thatcher is blamed for everything that has happened since she took power, even more amazing how she is blamed for things that happened before she came to power, such as "on the knock" and "from the tallyman" "HP" and the like.
She took Government Debt from 43.6% (1979) to 25.7% (1990) it is currentlly running at 90% (2012) of GDP.
We are talking about horrendous National Debt in 1979 of just less than half of our GDP, at 88 billion pounds being reduced to around 56 billion pounds.
Today it is around 90% of our GDP at AbHHfOqjaj6aWLT1 pounds
So much of what we put into the Nations coffers is paid out in debt repayments and interest repayments and you talk about the public living on HP
]
She took Government Debt from 43.6% (1979) to 25.7% (1990) it is currentlly running at 90% (2012) of GDP.
We are talking about horrendous National Debt in 1979 of just less than half of our GDP, at 88 billion pounds being reduced to around 56 billion pounds.
Today it is around 90% of our GDP at AbHHfOqjaj6aWLT1 pounds
So much of what we put into the Nations coffers is paid out in debt repayments and interest repayments and you talk about the public living on HP
]
This country is surviving and although we are struggling many around us are near bankruptcy, most of that which was sold was failing anyway because cheaper alternatives were available from countries like China and Korea and India, our money was being used to prop up those busineses and pay massive interest on what we owed, this may or may not have been the right policy, it if was so wrong why didn't the Labour party re-nationalise the businesses when it came to power as they had promised they would prior to election, why have subsequent governments outlawed the selling of council houses or done away with the poll tax instead to return to the rates system instead of just re-naming it, the only action Baroness Thatcher instigated that has been reversed is that of our national debt which is not only back to the original figures when she took power but double it.
Therefore you must be able to justify to me why national debt is now double and why thatcher was wrong to reduce national debt and inflation.
Surely history gives us many answers to actions of the past, we all say we have to learn from history, her policies are history, if we have learnt anything why haven't we changed anything ? or did we learn that her policies were right for the UK at the time and only she had the intelligence and guts to see them through ?
3 terms in office - that speaks volumes
Therefore you must be able to justify to me why national debt is now double and why thatcher was wrong to reduce national debt and inflation.
Surely history gives us many answers to actions of the past, we all say we have to learn from history, her policies are history, if we have learnt anything why haven't we changed anything ? or did we learn that her policies were right for the UK at the time and only she had the intelligence and guts to see them through ?
3 terms in office - that speaks volumes
Thatcherite = Supports much of what she did but admits she made some mistakes.
Anti-Thatcherite = Cannot believe anything she did was right whatsoever and believe her to be a witch and rejoice at her death or act indiferent to someones tradegy and spit in the face of a families grief, sing songs about her death.
Right or Wrong this is one occasion when I don't care if what I believe is wrong, I would rather be the former as a person than the latter.
Anti-Thatcherite = Cannot believe anything she did was right whatsoever and believe her to be a witch and rejoice at her death or act indiferent to someones tradegy and spit in the face of a families grief, sing songs about her death.
Right or Wrong this is one occasion when I don't care if what I believe is wrong, I would rather be the former as a person than the latter.
Quote by flower411
Thatcherite = Supports much of what she did but admits she made some mistakes.
Anti-Thatcherite = Cannot believe anything she did was right whatsoever and believe her to be a witch and rejoice at her death or act indiferent to someones tradegy and spit in the face of a families grief, sing songs about her death.
Right or Wrong this is one occasion when I don't care if what I believe is wrong, I would rather be the former as a person than the latter.
I would agree with much of what she did if there had been a coherent plan for the future. There was none and consequently the country was left without assets.
Where on earth could subsequent governments have raised the money to renationlise ?
And three terms in government just means she was able to fool a lot of people for a lot of the time. Being in the majority doesn`t make things right.
Well let's see, if they had wanted to they could have borrowed the money after all under Thatcher we had cleared half our debt making 30 billion available for borrowing, oh hang on they did to that didnt they taking our borrowing up to, what was that figure in TRILLIONS ? strange though, they didnt use it to re-nationalise did they, maybe they quietly thought that would be a bad idea, what did they spend over a pounds on thern ?
Why will nobody answer the question .... if her policies were so bad why has no government since reversed them, why havent we bought back the national companies, why havent we reduced forces pay, why haven't we stopped the sale of council houses, why havent we gone back to a rates per house system instead of a tax per person ? if your all right then someone must have an answer to this
That is crap, I have answered every question you ask you have answered none because you cant so you try to turn the tables
You asked where a government would get the money from to buy back the Companies that Baroness Thatcher sold off.
I answered you - borrow it because she had reduced the nations borrowings by half
You cannot comment on that or will not because it is true they could have raised the money had they not thought that she was right to do what she did
I asked why if her policies were so terrible has no government since done anything about changing her policies, why poll tax was not returned to rates, why councils were not banned from further house sales, why the unions were not given back the powers she took away, why the armed forces did not have their salaries cut back to the same % they were before she raised them, why not one single one of her policies has been overturned even though the Labour party promised to do so and the Tories that ousted her said she was wrong.
The truth is they all believe she was right in what she did but makes a good scapegoat for politicians and everyone else to blame
ANSWER THE QUESTION dont accuse me of not answering it your hiding is not working your bluff has failed. tell me why ......... you know everything else
You asked where a government would get the money from to buy back the Companies that Baroness Thatcher sold off.
I answered you - borrow it because she had reduced the nations borrowings by half
You cannot comment on that or will not because it is true they could have raised the money had they not thought that she was right to do what she did
I asked why if her policies were so terrible has no government since done anything about changing her policies, why poll tax was not returned to rates, why councils were not banned from further house sales, why the unions were not given back the powers she took away, why the armed forces did not have their salaries cut back to the same % they were before she raised them, why not one single one of her policies has been overturned even though the Labour party promised to do so and the Tories that ousted her said she was wrong.
The truth is they all believe she was right in what she did but makes a good scapegoat for politicians and everyone else to blame
ANSWER THE QUESTION dont accuse me of not answering it your hiding is not working your bluff has failed. tell me why ......... you know everything else
According to Flower Baroness Thatcher started Hire Purchase in the UK and quote "This one I dont agree with, again by no means knowlegeable on this subject but I did see her clear our National Debt and pay off the USA what we owed them for the WWII lend lease debt."
The final payment of which was paid to the USA in 2006
She was one amazing woman she managed to be resonsible for creating things as far back as the early 1800s and repaying debts as late as 2006, pleas remind me Flower how long was she actually in office ?
The final payment of which was paid to the USA in 2006
She was one amazing woman she managed to be resonsible for creating things as far back as the early 1800s and repaying debts as late as 2006, pleas remind me Flower how long was she actually in office ?
Sex God
Quote by flower411
According to Flower Baroness Thatcher started Hire Purchase in the UK and quote "This one I dont agree with, again by no means knowlegeable on this subject but I did see her clear our National Debt and pay off the USA what we owed them for the WWII lend lease debt."
The final payment of which was paid to the USA in 2006
She was one amazing woman she managed to be resonsible for creating things as far back as the early 1800s and repaying debts as late as 2006, pleas remind me Flower how long was she actually in office ?
Where on earth did you get that from ?
And yet again you are off on a tangent!
I think that previous governments had suffered at the hands of the unions
3 day weeks,mass power cuts,refuse collections then the miners.
If all this had been a business that anyone of us has run then we too would have sold it off!!! Unions had the public terrified and something needed to be done
British leyland was making huge losses,and of all the pits we now only have twelve in England and wales that are considered viable with the biggest employing 120 miners??
coal was never going to be a commodity with central heating on tap in the late 70's early 80's in the new gas age
And as for communities being destroyed then the likes of and Morrison's put paid to that
Thatcher only changed the banking system from the bowler hat brigade to the digital age but I'm afraid change was needed, the biggest mistake was made by brown who de-regulated the banks giving them a free reign to take massive risks with others money.
unfortunately like flower says its not what she did its the fact she couldn't see the future harm of things she didn't do
I got it from the statements flower made and if Prime Ministers not doing things means we should sing songs about their deaths and rejoice in their deaths in front of their families the I better start sorting out my songbook cos there have many many others in the past who didnt do things they should have done and all those of the future who wont do things they should do
and I have said that not everything she did was right or good for the nation, but that can be said of almost every prime minister throughout our history and will be said about everyone to come.
Will we dance and sing at the death of every PM ?
What I am saying is her family will be grief stricken they don't deserve what is being done, the PM said it today in the House of Commons where many Labour MPs showed their usual selves and did not even turn up. He said he didn't like her policies but had to respect her.
They all put her down but haven't got the balls to either do what she did and stand up to be counted for their policies or change the ones she made, the only reason for not changing them is that they quietly agree with them but will not take the flak that might come with admitting it.
I did not witness the hatred and singing or parties I witness now when Bin Laden was killed or when Saddam was hanged.
I didnt witness those things when murderers, rapists and paedophiles were caught and imprisoned, I just think that whatever you think about her this is wrong, ignore her death, show sorrow for it but not this.
We all know I get passionate about some things, this is one of them not for Baroness Thatcher but for the dismay it brings about the British People that they would treat someone this way and that they allow themseles to be hoodwinked by the Political Propaganda machine that blames her for everything
Will we dance and sing at the death of every PM ?
What I am saying is her family will be grief stricken they don't deserve what is being done, the PM said it today in the House of Commons where many Labour MPs showed their usual selves and did not even turn up. He said he didn't like her policies but had to respect her.
They all put her down but haven't got the balls to either do what she did and stand up to be counted for their policies or change the ones she made, the only reason for not changing them is that they quietly agree with them but will not take the flak that might come with admitting it.
I did not witness the hatred and singing or parties I witness now when Bin Laden was killed or when Saddam was hanged.
I didnt witness those things when murderers, rapists and paedophiles were caught and imprisoned, I just think that whatever you think about her this is wrong, ignore her death, show sorrow for it but not this.
We all know I get passionate about some things, this is one of them not for Baroness Thatcher but for the dismay it brings about the British People that they would treat someone this way and that they allow themseles to be hoodwinked by the Political Propaganda machine that blames her for everything
