Is an apology enough ?

20 Oct 2012

Quote by flower411
yesterdays news with no real outcome means and apology was sufficient :rotflmao::rotflmao:

Seems it wasn`t after all lol

hardly a media frenzied public flogging................some weeks later he resigns with minimum fuss and a big thanks to jimmy saville for saving him from a full scale witch hunt.
any bets on a return in the near future wink

No doubt they`ll try to sneak him in to some job in the not to distant future, but it`s all down the to voters in Sutton Coldfield. We`ll to wait and see about that one.
TBC lol

21 Oct 2012

I'm sorry what was the question?

27 Oct 2012

Of course before the next election he may be deselected by the party and not permitted to run for re-election, rest assured if his party believe they will lose the seat if he runs they will deselect him as quickly as they did Margaret Thatcher.

28 Oct 2012

Quote by MidsCouple24
Of course before the next election he may be deselected by the party and not permitted to run for re-election, rest assured if his party believe they will lose the seat if he runs they will deselect him as quickly as they did Margaret Thatcher.

:confused::confused::confused:
Margaret Thatcher was not deselected by her Constituency Party.....
She lost the leadership vote in the second round to John Major in the Parliamentary Party vote (consisting only of MP's) after failing to secure a majority n the first round.
It is the Party's Central Office which adds a candidate to the national selection list but the local Constituency Party which selects a candidate from a short list. A sitting Conservative MP rarely, if ever, faces re-selection. That is the province of Labour candidates.

28 Oct 2012

Quote by flower411
I have no knowledge whatsoever of the Sutton Coldfield Conservative Association but in my limited experience of other Associations I`d say that their candidate being a sneaky, lying, pompous asshole is not going to have any of them making any great effort to find a replacement.

:laughabove: it's the nature of the beast flower. Well put.

18 Dec 2012

So - In fact there does appear to have been a little more to the story and the abuse directed at Mr Mitchell may have been (shock horror) media hype all along.

Should be interesting what transpires as Mr Miutchell has always maintained the quotes attributed to him were false and malicious.

18 Dec 2012

oh dear this is not going to look good for the police if the officer in question has been telling fibs :huh:

18 Dec 2012

Quote by Lizaleanrob
oh dear this is not going to look good for the police if the officer in question has been telling fibs :huh:

An officer of the law ? surely not

19 Dec 2012

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
oh dear this is not going to look good for the police if the officer in question has been telling fibs :huh:

An officer of the law ? surely not
one wonders how long it will be before lying becomes a requirement for employment in her Majesty's police force

19 Dec 2012

Quote by flower411
oh dear this is not going to look good for the police if the officer in question has been telling fibs :huh:

An officer of the law ? surely not
one wonders how long it will be before lying becomes a requirement for employment in her Majesty's police force
You mean it isn`t already ?
most likely an unspoken requirement blink

19 Dec 2012

Quote by flower411
oh dear this is not going to look good for the police if the officer in question has been telling fibs :huh:

An officer of the law ? surely not
one wonders how long it will be before lying becomes a requirement for employment in her Majesty's police force
You mean it isn`t already ?
most likely an unspoken requirement blink

or anything you say will be ignored and something more dynamic and totally fabricated will be used against you in a court of law :twisted:

19 Dec 2012

Not a good day for the Police is it.
The damning video evidence shown on Ch4 last night puts them in a very bad light and if the allegations that they stitched Mr Mitchell up are proven, I can see some very hefty claims on the horizon.
An then if that wasn't enough, the High Court today reverses the accidental death verdicts on the Hillsborough victims after damning evidence that Police 'massaged' their reports.
If you can no longer trust a policeman, who can you trust?

19 Dec 2012

Seems this is a bash the police thread now.
Remember.......you may well need them one day. rolleyes

How many serving police officers are there in the UK?
There were 135,838 police officers in September 2011 - 6,012 (4.2%) fewer than the 141,850 of a year earlier.
You only ever hear about the 1% of bad officers and very little about the 99% of good police officers. People who moan constantly about the police, do me a favour eh? Contact some other body when you are burgled or are in any trouble. Don't want you getting caught up with the 1% now do we. banghead

19 Dec 2012

Quote by starlightcouple
Seems this is a bash the police thread now.
Remember.......you may well need them one day.
How many serving police officers are there in the UK?
There were 135,838 police officers in September 2011 - 6,012 (4.2%) fewer than the 141,850 of a year earlier.
You only ever hear about the 1% of bad officers and very little about the 99% of good police officers. People who moan constantly about the police, do me a favour eh? Contact some other body when you are burgled or are in any trouble. Don't want you getting caught up with the 1% now do we.

So, let me get this right star.
It's perfectly acceptable for police officers to fabricate evidence and destroy people's lives.

19 Dec 2012

Quote by GnV
So, let me get this right star.
It's perfectly acceptable for police officers to fabricate evidence and destroy people's lives.

Now your twisting what I said. I did not say that, I merely stated that there are a few bad officers out of a force of predominately brilliant police officers. Anyway.......how many lives have politicians destroyed in the process of getting to a Minister status?
Bliar has ruined thousands of lives by sending our boys to Afghanistan in the name of peace. Or what was it again? Oh yes WMD on the basis of a lie. So you see politicians ruin far more of peoples lives.

19 Dec 2012

Quote by GnV
Seems this is a bash the police thread now.
Remember.......you may well need them one day.
How many serving police officers are there in the UK?
There were 135,838 police officers in September 2011 - 6,012 (4.2%) fewer than the 141,850 of a year earlier.
You only ever hear about the 1% of bad officers and very little about the 99% of good police officers. People who moan constantly about the police, do me a favour eh? Contact some other body when you are burgled or are in any trouble. Don't want you getting caught up with the 1% now do we.

So, let me get this right star.
It's perfectly acceptable for police officers to fabricate evidence and destroy people's lives.
It is if you can turn the thread round so you can bash the "Tory Toffs"
;-)

19 Dec 2012

Quote by starlightcouple

So, let me get this right star.
It's perfectly acceptable for police officers to fabricate evidence and destroy people's lives.

Now your twisting what I said. I did not say that, I merely stated that there are a few bad officers out of a force of predominately brilliant police officers. Anyway.......how many lives have politicians destroyed in the process of getting to a Minister status?
Bliar has ruined thousands of lives by sending our boys to Afghanistan in the name of peace. Or what was it again? Oh yes WMD on the basis of a lie. So you see politicians ruin far more of peoples lives.
You expect politicians to lie star, just as much as used car salesmen.
You don't expect the guardians of the Queen's peace to lie though, do you star. Not a single one of them doing so is acceptable.

19 Dec 2012

Quote by flower411
Seems this is a bash the police thread now.
Remember.......you may well need them one day.
How many serving police officers are there in the UK?
There were 135,838 police officers in September 2011 - 6,012 (4.2%) fewer than the 141,850 of a year earlier.
You only ever hear about the 1% of bad officers and very little about the 99% of good police officers. People who moan constantly about the police, do me a favour eh? Contact some other body when you are burgled or are in any trouble. Don't want you getting caught up with the 1% now do we.

Where do you get these percentages from ?
That they are very very good at not getting caught ?
Seriously though I support our police force and believe that the majority are good, honest people, I have only once met a bad Police Officer and he was part time, after I sorted him out he never bothered me again.
I have met Police Officers in all aspects of life, accidents, crime, social etc, all treated me with respect, these encounters include being arrested, temporarily imprisoned and serving time as a convicted criminal and also working alongside them in other situations.
The majority of thier time is spent working with scum, people with low intelligence and drunk or drug related aggressive behaviour, it is difficult to be Mr Nice Guy at all times but for the most part they do it well.
All that said I do not condone what appears to have occurred in this instance and hope the guilty are punished accordingly.
That said I have to ask, if the MP was as innocent as is now being said (and I believe that all is not as was reported) why on earth did he appologise and resign ? I don't know the latest facts but remember saying at the time that he was guilty by his own admission.

19 Dec 2012

Quote by flower411
Seems this is a bash the police thread now.
Remember.......you may well need them one day.
How many serving police officers are there in the UK?
There were 135,838 police officers in September 2011 - 6,012 (4.2%) fewer than the 141,850 of a year earlier.
You only ever hear about the 1% of bad officers and very little about the 99% of good police officers. People who moan constantly about the police, do me a favour eh? Contact some other body when you are burgled or are in any trouble. Don't want you getting caught up with the 1% now do we.

Where do you get these percentages from ?
I pick them out of a big yellow hat.
But just for you Flour I was actually being a bit generous with the 1% as it is so much obviously less than that. Have a read.

Now you know where I get the percentages from, any further questions please refer to Google. :doh:

19 Dec 2012

Quote by starlightcouple
Seems this is a bash the police thread now.
Remember.......you may well need them one day.
How many serving police officers are there in the UK?
There were 135,838 police officers in September 2011 - 6,012 (4.2%) fewer than the 141,850 of a year earlier.
You only ever hear about the 1% of bad officers and very little about the 99% of good police officers. People who moan constantly about the police, do me a favour eh? Contact some other body when you are burgled or are in any trouble. Don't want you getting caught up with the 1% now do we.

Where do you get these percentages from ?
I pick them out of a big yellow hat.
But just for you Flour I was actually being a bit generous with the 1% as it is so much obviously less than that. Have a read.

Now you know where I get the percentages from, any further questions please refer to Google. :doh:
i doubt you see the bigger picture star
anyone convicted on the evidence of this police officer may literally be privy to a get out of jail free card
that of course will be followed by the obligatory compensation claim.... of course all at the cost to the tax payer :doh:

19 Dec 2012

Quote by Lizaleanrob
i doubt you see the bigger picture star
anyone convicted on the evidence of this police officer may literally be privy to a get out of jail free card
that of course will be followed by the obligatory compensation claim.... of course all at the cost to the tax payer :doh:

Rob I was prosecuted by a dodgy speed camera and proved that camera was set wrong. I did not see them letting off every past driver who was flashed by this faulty camera.
I think you are somewhat ahead of yourself with the insinuation that every person this officer convicted, or gave evidence against is going to be freed, that ain't going to happen my friend.
My point was Rob that there are serving police officers and if 1% were corrupt, that by my maths would be around 1350 officers every year being convicted of one crime or another. There is no way ever that that amount has been anywhere near reached, and anyone who wants to try and prove that to be wrong then good luck.
I was just proving my point Rob that 99% plus are decent honest officers, and like on any website or in the force, you always get fucking wankers who spoil it for the rest. See where I am coming from Rob? :bounce:

20 Dec 2012

Quote by starlightcouple

i doubt you see the bigger picture star
anyone convicted on the evidence of this police officer may literally be privy to a get out of jail free card
that of course will be followed by the obligatory compensation claim.... of course all at the cost to the tax payer :doh:

Rob I was prosecuted by a dodgy speed camera and proved that camera was set wrong. I did not see them letting off every past driver who was flashed by this faulty camera.
I think you are somewhat ahead of yourself with the insinuation that every person this officer convicted, or gave evidence against is going to be freed, that ain't going to happen my friend.
My point was Rob that there are serving police officers and if 1% were corrupt, that by my maths would be around 1350 officers every year being convicted of one crime or another. There is no way ever that that amount has been anywhere near reached, and anyone who wants to try and prove that to be wrong then good luck.
I was just proving my point Rob that 99% plus are decent honest officers, and like on any website or in the force, you always get fucking wankers who spoil it for the rest. See where I am coming from Rob? :bounce:
Bad train of thought. We do not live in a Police State, the Police do not make the rules and by definition they all have to be head and shoulders above the law. The Police did not like football hooligans and they covered up a national tragedy for 23 years by blaming the fans for their own deaths. The Police do not like the incumbent Government because they feel that they do not deserve to have cutbacks that everyone else is putting up with. So one Policeman takes it upon himself to create a story to publicly discredit a cabinet Minister, provides false evidence and basically stitched the Minister up for a big fall, knowing absolutely that the Press and Opposition would lap it up.
No matter how small the percentages are - the damage is exponentially greater because of the level of trust that is normally pl;aced in them.
This time it was a Government Minister - next time it could be you...

20 Dec 2012

Quote by starlightcouple

i doubt you see the bigger picture star
anyone convicted on the evidence of this police officer may literally be privy to a get out of jail free card
that of course will be followed by the obligatory compensation claim.... of course all at the cost to the tax payer :doh:

Rob I was prosecuted by a dodgy speed camera and proved that camera was set wrong. I did not see them letting off every past driver who was flashed by this faulty camera.
I think you are somewhat ahead of yourself with the insinuation that every person this officer convicted, or gave evidence against is going to be freed, that ain't going to happen my friend.
My point was Rob that there are serving police officers and if 1% were corrupt, that by my maths would be around 1350 officers every year being convicted of one crime or another. There is no way ever that that amount has been anywhere near reached, and anyone who wants to try and prove that to be wrong then good luck.
I was just proving my point Rob that 99% plus are decent honest officers, and like on any website or in the force, you always get fucking wankers who spoil it for the rest. See where I am coming from Rob? :bounce:
I can see where you are coming from Star, 1 bad apple etc.
But the thing is the police force isn't a job, it's a career (a very big difference) the code of conduct is very much different. Therefore, they should be beyond reproach in their duties.
This also applies to MP's, members of any religious orders, teachers etc etc...
So anyway back to your stats and the interesting article you linked to. Having read through it all, I gleaned the following information;
1. Of the 8,542 allegations of corruption, 837 of them were serious enough to pass to the IPCC.
2. The IPCC does not have sufficient resources to deal with this so only 13 cases were dealt with
3. NO corruption cases were started by serving officers only members of the public.
4. In 87% of the cases the allegations of corruption were upheld these ranged from and sexual assault, the fraudulent use of corporate credit cards, perverting the course of justice, the provision of false statements, and the misuse of police databases. Eleven of those found guilty were constables, one was a sergeant and the other a commander.
5. Of those 87% only 14% were dismissed!
So thank you for the stats, it appears to me the police force closes ranks to protects its own instead of policing from within. With the little interaction the public have with the officers where they are privy to the corruption it is down tot he police themselves to speak out and they do not. These 8542 referrals could be much, much more!

20 Dec 2012

Quote by Too Hot
Bad train of thought. We do not live in a Police State, the Police do not make the rules and by definition they all have to be head and shoulders above the law.

No you are right Too Hot in that the police do not make the rules, it is those corrupt MP's who make the rules. The police are of course doing a job but not a single one of them was voted into that job by any member of the public, and yet our MP's as part of this countries democracy are voted in, and still abused their positions over the expenses scandal. Now of course MP's who commit fraud were a small amount, and yet all MP's were looked at as thieves and crooks.
My point is that as yet nothing has been proven as to this officer not seeing anything, there is an then a thread could have been started but my point all along is of course one bad police officer is not good, but out of the it is a tiny amount of police officers. People are so quick to knock the police force when it suits, until a time arrives when they are the people you want knocking at your door the most or to see on the street.

Quote by Too Hot
The Police did not like football hooligans and they covered up a national tragedy for 23 years by blaming the fans for their own deaths. The Police do not like the incumbent Government because they feel that they do not deserve to have cutbacks that everyone else is putting up with. So one Policeman takes it upon himself to create a story to publicly discredit a cabinet Minister, provides false evidence and basically stitched the Minister up for a big fall, knowing absolutely that the Press and Opposition would lap it up.

Are you not getting three steps ahead of yourself Too Hot? Yes the original verdicts have been quashed but can we wait for a new inquest to arrive at a decision, instead of jumping the gun eh? :doh:

Quote by Too Hot
No matter how small the percentages are - the damage is exponentially greater because of the level of trust that is normally pl;aced in them.
This time it was a Government Minister - next time it could be you...

The trust placed on a police officer doing their job, is more important than the MP's voted into a democratic Parliament who MAKE the laws? And yet some have also been proved to be corrupt. I think an elected MP is worse to be honest.
What has been a Government Minister? Has this been proved Too Hot? Do you know something the rest of us do not know? No of course not, you do unfortunately a lot of this in your posts, jumping ahead of the starting gun. If you was a runner you would be halfway down the running track before the gun had even got out of the starters bag. Slow down small pony.

20 Dec 2012

Quote by Stevie_and_Kitty
But the thing is the police force isn't a job, it's a career (a very big difference) the code of conduct is very much different. Therefore, they should be beyond reproach in their duties.

No Steve, MP's should be the ones beyond reproach as they are elected members of Parliament,voted in by you and me. They should be at the highest of the chain of people who should not be beyond reproach, and should be seen to be honest and fair, and yet some have been given prison sentences recently and others vilified for blatant theft from the public purse.

Quote by Stevie_and_Kitty
So thank you for the stats, it appears to me the police force closes ranks to protects its own instead of policing from within. With the little interaction the public have with the officers where they are privy to the corruption it is down tot he police themselves to speak out and they do not. These 8542 referrals could be much, much more!

Sorry Steve but it may well appear to YOU, but have you got a shred of evidence to back up your ludicrous claims at all?

Quote by Stevie_and_Kitty
These 8542 referrals could be much, much more!

Have you noticed the rather important word highlighted Steve? I shall await your evidence that suggests that police are covering up other police officers, to stop them getting arrested and charged with crimes please. Could any claims be a possibility that members of the public sometimes make up allegations against the police? No perish the thought that could ever happen eh?

20 Dec 2012

I think the evidence from he Hillsborough enquiry did just that star.

20 Dec 2012

Quote by GnV
I think the evidence from he Hillsborough enquiry did just that star.

GnV.......I am not saying some police officers are not corrupt or that in rare circumstances the police not not fabricate evidence or ' stitch people up '. We all know that does happen, but people on here would have us believe that our police force is riddled with corrupt officers, where there is not a shred of evidence to support those claims, purely personnel opinion based.
The Hillsborough inquiry I have my own personnel feelings and thoughts on, and I believe that yesterdays decision was a right and proper one to make. I think there is certainly enough evidence to hold another inquiry and am sure that this time the real facts will come out. If any officer of the law fabricated evidence or altered statements and lied to the original inquiry which is what is being allured to gets found guilty, I would hope that the courts come down on them and sets a positive example of them, in other words proper and just prison terms.
I shall wait for a new inquest and hope that this time the families get to hear all of the evidence, as it has been claimed that a lot of evidence was covered up at the original hearing, and that this time the ' new ' evidence could be explosive for the police.
For me I find it inconceivable that a police officer would cover things up about that match where all those poor people perished, to save their own skin. But it seems that for a judge to quash the original verdicts certainly seems grounds that the evidence was tampered with in some way. If that is true GnV I would think for me it would be one of the worst possible acts anyone could do, let alone a police officer.

20 Dec 2012

Quote by starlightcouple
I shall await your evidence that suggests that police are covering up other police officers, to stop them getting arrested and charged with crimes please. Could any claims be a possibility that members of the public sometimes make up allegations against the police? No perish the thought that could ever happen eh?

Jean Charles de Menezes
Hillsborough
Lance Corporal Mark Aspinall
Ian Tomlinson
Andrew Mitchell
...evidence
or may be I made it up
well no I didnt, as I'm not a copper!

20 Dec 2012

Quote by starlightcouple
............My point is that as yet nothing has been proven as to this officer not seeing anything, there is an investigation............

The officer has been suspended. He was not at the scene, he could not possibly have heard what was said because of this and he has made up a story to discredit an MP. Yes, there is an investigation but that investigation will not see him somewhere where he was not. He has lied and a mans career has been damaged as a result. If you lie, you are not ruining someones career but a Policeman lying can ruin a career, put people in prison, give people criminal records and do untold damage to families and to society in general.

Quote by Too Hot
The Police did not like football hooligans and they covered up a national tragedy for 23 years by blaming the fans for their own deaths.

Quote by starlightcouple
Are you not getting three steps ahead of yourself Too Hot? Yes the original verdicts have been quashed but can we wait for a new inquest to arrive at a decision, instead of jumping the gun eh? :doh:

Keep up with news Star, there has just been an enquiry that proved systematic cover up by the Police. The truth is out there and in the public domain - you surely can't have missed that?....

Quote by starlightcouple
..What has been a Government Minister? Has this been proved Too Hot? Do you know something the rest of us do not know? No of course not, you do unfortunately a lot of this in your posts, jumping ahead of the starting gun. If you was a runner you would be halfway down the running track before the gun had even got out of the starters bag. Slow down small pony.

Not sure what this was supposed to be about, so can't really answer.
Not sure why you are being so contrary Star, no one is Police bashing but the behaviour of this one officer is scandalous given the amount of media and political coverage that his fabricated story resulted in.

20 Dec 2012

Quote by Too Hot
Not sure why you are being so contrary Star, no one is Police bashing but the behaviour of this one officer is scandalous given the amount of media and political coverage that his fabricated story resulted in.

People are police bashing Too Hot. I shall wait and see the results of this police investigation before I jump on the usual bandwagon. If the evidence is as clear cut as you are believing, then it will be a no brainer for the courts eh?
Also when an investigation of any kind is ongoing, the police officer will be suspended following inquiries. Even in the Post Office if an allegation of a serious nature is leveled at a member of staff, that member is suspended on full pay until the investigation is complete. Standard practice Too Hot. No need to look into it any more than that at this stage.