M6 toll road

31 Aug 2010

Quote by kentswingers777
Cyclists should be forced to pay for their road usage anyway....
They are a bloody nuisance.

We do Ken...like drivers we pay an amount related to how much we pollute,how much we damage the road,how much congestion we cause........go on guess...no go on....go on...you know you want to...oh alright I'll tell you ....... ......I do pay tax for the car though...perhaps I should ask for some back ,for the days I cycle..........*wonders off to DVLC web-site*
You left out the most important one............the accidents they cause!
I wonder if people have any idea what happens if a cyclist either causes you to crash or actually hits and damages your car.
With NO insurance the scene of getting any money out the arses is near impossible.
IF anyone uses the road they should at the very least have third party insurance to cover any problems.
Just like the toll road NOBODY forces you to use a car or to use the toll road.
If anyone is that bothered by the damage a car does, how hypocritical to then use one.........cycle everywhere or get one of those big things called a .........bus!
No I think you'll find I mentioned accidents in an earlier post...many cyclist have insurance I know I do...and the only accident I ever had was caused by the driver who supplied me with false details..as I'm sure you'll mention later buses,cycles,trains planes and auto-mobiles are not always practical for every journey...I always find it best to fit my transport to the journey in hand...not hypocrisy more practicality prudence and planning

31 Aug 2010

Quote by Ben_welshminx
Honest building more roads doesn't solve congestion. Don't matter if they are free or tolls.
The only thing that solves congestion is fewer private vehicles.
The easiest way to reduce private vehicle use is the provision of decent public transport.
The first step for improving public transport is school buses. After that you just tax the hell out of motorists to fund investment. Its gonna happen anyway as the oil runs out I reckon.

Well, they have obviously got half of it right. We are already taxed to hell and now propsals to tax us for parking in existing parking spaces on our own company's land.
Unfortunately they (the government, councils or whoever) are not providing - anything - whatsoever - of any form - or style - of public transport.
There's no such thing as public transport anyway. All 'public' transport is provided by private, profit-driven comapnies. So any route that doesn't make a profit has been or soon will be closed. Leaving people who need the transport without any at all - unless you count taxis - does anyone fancy paying £20 to go shopping or to the hospital (they hardly ever provide drivers nowadays)? That's what a taxi to town costs the people round here.
We need the buses first - then they can tax the cars off the roads. Not what they are doing now.

31 Aug 2010

In support of the card weilding majority of Socialist Citizens of the Socialist Republic of Swinging Heaven - I would like to agree that a large scale investment in public transport is well overdue and further...............
Congestion charges should be levied on all roads and to all people so as to get the working classes out of their cars and back on public transport and free up the roads a bit for people who can afford it. :twisted:

31 Aug 2010

Quote by Ben_welshminx
Honest building more roads doesn't solve congestion. Don't matter if they are free or tolls.
The only thing that solves congestion is fewer private vehicles.
The easiest way to reduce private vehicle use is the provision of decent public transport.
The first step for improving public transport is school buses. After that you just tax the hell out of motorists to fund investment. Its gonna happen anyway as the oil runs out I reckon.

1)it wont happen in our lifetime
2)electric or hydrogen when it does
that's sorted then flipa

31 Aug 2010

Quote by foxylady2209
Bicycles should be banded from many busy roads! They are a danger to them selves and other road users.

:thumbup:
There is a cycle group in the area and they regularly have time trial races up and down the local MAIN ROAD!!!!!! They have zero regard for the rules of the road, swinging round the roundabouts without a look, pause or even a signal. They overtake each other - again without signals or in fact any acknowldgement of the tonnes of cars, lorries and buses attempting to use the road safely and legally. They are, quite simply, a bloody menace. And guess who'se fault it would be if one of them got wiped out while carrying out one of their 'maneouvers'.
There have been moves to get this ridiculous 'event' banned from the roads and moved onto a more suitable location like a small airfield or industrial estate where the other traffic can be stopped for the duration. It's a race for crying out loud - and no race has a justification for happening on a busy main road.
Cycles need cycle paths, along all main roads and they need to cycle sensibly, wherever they go. I know most do - it's not the majority that are the problem. It only takes one to ruin my life forever - and yes it is MY life I am concerned for. If they want to fly out of a Give Way junction without looking or giving way, so be it - just one of many ways to commit suicide - but not in front of MY car please.
yes and point make prizes these buggers are always harder to knock off
:twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

31 Aug 2010

Quote by Lizaleanrob
Bicycles should be banded from many busy roads! They are a danger to them selves and other road users.

:thumbup:
There is a cycle group in the area and they regularly have time trial races up and down the local MAIN ROAD!!!!!! They have zero regard for the rules of the road, swinging round the roundabouts without a look, pause or even a signal. They overtake each other - again without signals or in fact any acknowldgement of the tonnes of cars, lorries and buses attempting to use the road safely and legally. They are, quite simply, a bloody menace. And guess who'se fault it would be if one of them got wiped out while carrying out one of their 'maneouvers'.
There have been moves to get this ridiculous 'event' banned from the roads and moved onto a more suitable location like a small airfield or industrial estate where the other traffic can be stopped for the duration. It's a race for crying out loud - and no race has a justification for happening on a busy main road.
Cycles need cycle paths, along all main roads and they need to cycle sensibly, wherever they go. I know most do - it's not the majority that are the problem. It only takes one to ruin my life forever - and yes it is MY life I am concerned for. If they want to fly out of a Give Way junction without looking or giving way, so be it - just one of many ways to commit suicide - but not in front of MY car please.
yes and point make prizes these buggers are always harder to knock off
:twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
They have numbers on their backs. I'm assuming some kind of scoring for getting them?
bolt

31 Aug 2010

Quote by foxylady2209
Bicycles should be banded from many busy roads! They are a danger to them selves and other road users.

:thumbup:
There is a cycle group in the area and they regularly have time trial races up and down the local MAIN ROAD!!!!!! They have zero regard for the rules of the road, swinging round the roundabouts without a look, pause or even a signal. They overtake each other - again without signals or in fact any acknowldgement of the tonnes of cars, lorries and buses attempting to use the road safely and legally. They are, quite simply, a bloody menace. And guess who'se fault it would be if one of them got wiped out while carrying out one of their 'maneouvers'.
There have been moves to get this ridiculous 'event' banned from the roads and moved onto a more suitable location like a small airfield or industrial estate where the other traffic can be stopped for the duration. It's a race for crying out loud - and no race has a justification for happening on a busy main road.
Cycles need cycle paths, along all main roads and they need to cycle sensibly, wherever they go. I know most do - it's not the majority that are the problem. It only takes one to ruin my life forever - and yes it is MY life I am concerned for. If they want to fly out of a Give Way junction without looking or giving way, so be it - just one of many ways to commit suicide - but not in front of MY car please.
yes and point make prizes these buggers are always harder to knock off
:twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
They have numbers on their backs. I'm assuming some kind of scoring for getting them?
bolt

no but i like the odds and evens game :twisted: :twisted:

31 Aug 2010

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
No I think you'll find I mentioned accidents in an earlier post...many cyclist have insurance I know I do...and the only accident I ever had was caused by the driver who supplied me with false details..as I'm sure you'll mention later buses,cycles,trains planes and auto-mobiles are not always practical for every journey...I always find it best to fit my transport to the journey in hand...not hypocrisy more practicality prudence and planning

As I have already said....hypocritical. A typical middle class attitude. lol

Your just using it as a feeble attempt to justify it.
You slag the car off by saying the damage it does, and then when it suits you, you then turn the key and do the very damage you have run down.
Yes I can see exactly where you are coming from.

Quote by Staggs
related to how much we pollute,how much we damage the road,how much congestion we cause

I presume you was talking about the car there, you know the one you get into to do a journey in? As a bicycle does none of these...........

31 Aug 2010

Quote by foxylady2209
Bicycles should be banded from many busy roads! They are a danger to them selves and other road users.

:thumbup:
There is a cycle group in the area and they regularly have time trial races up and down the local MAIN ROAD!!!!!! They have zero regard for the rules of the road, swinging round the roundabouts without a look, pause or even a signal. They overtake each other - again without signals or in fact any acknowldgement of the tonnes of cars, lorries and buses attempting to use the road safely and legally. They are, quite simply, a bloody menace. And guess who'se fault it would be if one of them got wiped out while carrying out one of their 'maneouvers'.
There have been moves to get this ridiculous 'event' banned from the roads and moved onto a more suitable location like a small airfield or industrial estate where the other traffic can be stopped for the duration. It's a race for crying out loud - and no race has a justification for happening on a busy main road.
Cycles need cycle paths, along all main roads and they need to cycle sensibly, wherever they go. I know most do - it's not the majority that are the problem. It only takes one to ruin my life forever - and yes it is MY life I am concerned for. If they want to fly out of a Give Way junction without looking or giving way, so be it - just one of many ways to commit suicide - but not in front of MY car please.
We also have to suffer these
I am not sure who are the worst, the above motioned or the weekend cyclist, wobbling up the road at dusk with no lights.

31 Aug 2010

If it wasn't so funny it would be tragic.....lmao
Just noticed this could be misread so in capitals for clarity......LMAO

31 Aug 2010

The Dartford tolls were due to become free once the tunnels and bridge were paid for, but the powers that be soon realised it was too lucrative an opportunity to pass up.
Never gonna happen.

31 Aug 2010

True Essex and now they have just upped the charges.
Last year the Tolls turned over 70 million quid, and that is before the rises.
It is tragic that before it was built they said it would be free when paid for, which it was years ago.
Then it was sold to I think a French company.
It would not be so bad if the tolls eased the traffic in the area but.....it gets worse with each passing month and last month there was a 27 yes 27 mile tail back.
The police apparently forced the owners to open up the tolls so people were not charged so as to ease the huge congestion.
It really is daylight robbery.

1 Sep 2010

All toll roads are highway robbery. Our road tax supposedly covers the building of new roads. Tolls are yet another tax on the already taxed to death motorist.

1 Sep 2010

Quote by Ben_welshminx
Building new roads doesn't improve congestion.
Investment in public transport does.
Unfortunately our love affair with the motor car blinds us to these facts.
We need to wake up and smell the petrol fumes.
I do think infrastructure, be it roads or anything else ought to belong to everybody.

Tell that to the people in Edinburgh who are currently having to put up with a tram project that's costing millions and will benefit very few. confused

1 Sep 2010

Believing in the benefits of public transport doesn''t mean that all public transport projects are well planned.

1 Sep 2010

Believing in the benefits doesnt mean that ANY are well planned.
As it happens public transport round here isn't too bad for the odd time, but it's far from usable on a regular basis. Apart from it being far more expensive than using the car, its slow, infrequent (1 bus an hour) and badly timed for commuting (10 to the hour cant get people to work on time) and just generally inconveinient. It would take me 2 buses, not much change from a fiver and an hour to get into Hull city centre, (not at rush hour) or 30 minutes in car or 20 minutes on my bike. No wonder public transport doesn't ease congestion.

1 Sep 2010

Yet near me a 4 week unlimited travel pass covering a 7 mile radius costs about a tenner a week for an adult. That's 500 quid a year. And that is less than road tax n insurance on a car for a lot of folk never mind fuel, maintenance and depreciation. Funnily enough single tickets are outrageously bad value for money and a weeks journeys to work say would stack up to about £25.
I suppose you pays yer money and takes yer choice. I happen to like my cars n bikes but I believe that cars are a luxury and waste an enormous amount of limited resources.
To put the waste into perspective I like to use an example. If your car breaks down 30 miles from home it would take you 3 months to push it home. You could walk that distance in about 8 hours. So driving a car 30 miles on your own with no cargo wastes about 3 months worth of human work. Seems to me we would be wise to consider those wasted resources and rather than planning for increased personal motor vehicle use we should be planning to reduce it by providing good public transport.
One of the problems we face is that we are so reliant on the personal motor car . Look back 50 years, we didn't use cars to go to work very much, we didnt use em to do the monthly shop (in fact I am not sure monthly shops was a widespread concept), we didnt use them to ferry the kids to school and we didnt use them to go to out of town shopping malls.
This reliance stems from perceived convenience and wealth, we can afford to run a car so we do. This situation is not sustainable and we should be planning for the end of the private car rather than propping up the obvious shortcomings of our current car culture.

1 Sep 2010

Quote by Ben_welshminx
Yet near me a 4 week unlimited travel pass covering a 7 mile radius costs about a tenner a week for an adult. That's 500 quid a year. And that is less than road tax n insurance on a car for a lot of folk never mind fuel, maintenance and depreciation. Funnily enough single tickets are outrageously bad value for money and a weeks journeys to work say would stack up to about £25.
I suppose you pays yer money and takes yer choice. I happen to like my cars n bikes but I believe that cars are a luxury and waste an enormous amount of limited resources.
To put the waste into perspective I like to use an example. If your car breaks down 30 miles from home it would take you 3 months to push it home. You could walk that distance in about 8 hours. So driving a car 30 miles on your own with no cargo wastes about 3 months worth of human work. Seems to me we would be wise to consider those wasted resources and rather than planning for increased personal motor vehicle use we should be planning to reduce it by providing good public transport.
One of the problems we face is that we are so reliant on the personal motor car . Look back 50 years, we didn't use cars to go to work very much, we didnt use em to do the monthly shop (in fact I am not sure monthly shops was a widespread concept), we didnt use them to ferry the kids to school and we didnt use them to go to out of town shopping malls.
This reliance stems from perceived convenience and wealth, we can afford to run a car so we do. This situation is not sustainable and we should be planning for the end of the private car rather than propping up the obvious shortcomings of our current car culture.

not if ya self employed buddy lol

:lol:

1 Sep 2010

Actually company car and no fuel to pay for, plus put the insurance through the company, so actually I think I get a pretty good deal meself.
Plus no hanging around in the pissing rain for a bus.

1 Sep 2010

Quote by Ben_welshminx
Yet near me a 4 week unlimited travel pass covering a 7 mile radius costs about a tenner a week for an adult. That's 500 quid a year. And that is less than road tax n insurance on a car for a lot of folk never mind fuel, maintenance and depreciation. Funnily enough single tickets are outrageously bad value for money and a weeks journeys to work say would stack up to about £25.
I suppose you pays yer money and takes yer choice. I happen to like my cars n bikes but I believe that cars are a luxury and waste an enormous amount of limited resources.
To put the waste into perspective I like to use an example. If your car breaks down 30 miles from home it would take you 3 months to push it home. You could walk that distance in about 8 hours. So driving a car 30 miles on your own with no cargo wastes about 3 months worth of human work. Seems to me we would be wise to consider those wasted resources and rather than planning for increased personal motor vehicle use we should be planning to reduce it by providing good public transport.
One of the problems we face is that we are so reliant on the personal motor car . Look back 50 years, we didn't use cars to go to work very much, we didnt use em to do the monthly shop (in fact I am not sure monthly shops was a widespread concept), we didnt use them to ferry the kids to school and we didnt use them to go to out of town shopping malls.
This reliance stems from perceived convenience and wealth, we can afford to run a car so we do. This situation is not sustainable and we should be planning for the end of the private car rather than propping up the obvious shortcomings of our current car culture.

Join the AA? lol

:bolt:

1 Sep 2010

Comes to a pretty pass when one has to repost simply to avoid juvenile remarks and be heard does it not. If you have nothing intersting to say silence never offends.

Quote by Ben_welshminx
Yet near me a 4 week unlimited travel pass covering a 7 mile radius costs about a tenner a week for an adult. That's 500 quid a year. And that is less than road tax n insurance on a car for a lot of folk never mind fuel, maintenance and depreciation. Funnily enough single tickets are outrageously bad value for money and a weeks journeys to work say would stack up to about £25.
I suppose you pays yer money and takes yer choice. I happen to like my cars n bikes but I believe that cars are a luxury and waste an enormous amount of limited resources.
To put the waste into perspective I like to use an example. If your car breaks down 30 miles from home it would take you 3 months to push it home. You could walk that distance in about 8 hours. So driving a car 30 miles on your own with no cargo wastes about 3 months worth of human work. Seems to me we would be wise to consider those wasted resources and rather than planning for increased personal motor vehicle use we should be planning to reduce it by providing good public transport.
One of the problems we face is that we are so reliant on the personal motor car . Look back 50 years, we didn't use cars to go to work very much, we didnt use em to do the monthly shop (in fact I am not sure monthly shops was a widespread concept), we didnt use them to ferry the kids to school and we didnt use them to go to out of town shopping malls.
This reliance stems from perceived convenience and wealth, we can afford to run a car so we do. This situation is not sustainable and we should be planning for the end of the private car rather than propping up the obvious shortcomings of our current car culture.

1 Sep 2010

Quote by kentswingers777
It would not be so bad if the tolls eased the traffic in the area but.....it gets worse with each passing month and last month there was a 27 yes 27 mile tail back.
The police apparently forced the owners to open up the tolls so people were not charged so as to ease the huge congestion.

And that is not a one-off either, that's happened on a few occasions, but sadly, things will not change for the better, it is too lucrative for the owners.
And yes, they are French.

1 Sep 2010

Quote by Ben_welshminx
Comes to a pretty pass when one has to repost simply to avoid juvenile remarks and be heard does it not. If you have nothing intersting to say silence never offends.
Yet near me a 4 week unlimited travel pass covering a 7 mile radius costs about a tenner a week for an adult. That's 500 quid a year. And that is less than road tax n insurance on a car for a lot of folk never mind fuel, maintenance and depreciation. Funnily enough single tickets are outrageously bad value for money and a weeks journeys to work say would stack up to about £25.
I suppose you pays yer money and takes yer choice. I happen to like my cars n bikes but I believe that cars are a luxury and waste an enormous amount of limited resources.
To put the waste into perspective I like to use an example. If your car breaks down 30 miles from home it would take you 3 months to push it home. You could walk that distance in about 8 hours. So driving a car 30 miles on your own with no cargo wastes about 3 months worth of human work. Seems to me we would be wise to consider those wasted resources and rather than planning for increased personal motor vehicle use we should be planning to reduce it by providing good public transport.
One of the problems we face is that we are so reliant on the personal motor car . Look back 50 years, we didn't use cars to go to work very much, we didnt use em to do the monthly shop (in fact I am not sure monthly shops was a widespread concept), we didnt use them to ferry the kids to school and we didnt use them to go to out of town shopping malls.
This reliance stems from perceived convenience and wealth, we can afford to run a car so we do. This situation is not sustainable and we should be planning for the end of the private car rather than propping up the obvious shortcomings of our current car culture.

ok bengy
50 years ago everyone had a local butcher 'greengrocer' and general store
now off course we don't
with that in mind
i think that's sorted

1 Sep 2010

It was meant in humour Ben, not to offend.

1 Sep 2010

Quote by Ben_welshminx
Yet near me a 4 week unlimited travel pass covering a 7 mile radius costs about a tenner a week for an adult. That's 500 quid a year. And that is less than road tax n insurance on a car for a lot of folk never mind fuel, maintenance and depreciation. Funnily enough single tickets are outrageously bad value for money and a weeks journeys to work say would stack up to about £25.
I suppose you pays yer money and takes yer choice. I happen to like my cars n bikes but I believe that cars are a luxury and waste an enormous amount of limited resources.
To put the waste into perspective I like to use an example. If your car breaks down 30 miles from home it would take you 3 months to push it home. You could walk that distance in about 8 hours. So driving a car 30 miles on your own with no cargo wastes about 3 months worth of human work. Seems to me we would be wise to consider those wasted resources and rather than planning for increased personal motor vehicle use we should be planning to reduce it by providing good public transport.
One of the problems we face is that we are so reliant on the personal motor car . Look back 50 years, we didn't use cars to go to work very much, we didnt use em to do the monthly shop (in fact I am not sure monthly shops was a widespread concept), we didnt use them to ferry the kids to school and we didnt use them to go to out of town shopping malls.
This reliance stems from perceived convenience and wealth, we can afford to run a car so we do. This situation is not sustainable and we should be planning for the end of the private car rather than propping up the obvious shortcomings of our current car culture.

See I knew there was something I meant to say

1 Sep 2010

Quote by vampanya
Our road tax supposedly covers the building of new roads.

This hasn't been the case for a number of years.
'Road Tax' is a generic term, but it is actually known as Vehicle Excise Duty, in other words, 'vehicle tax'. The idea that monies raised from 'road tax' is for the building and maintenance of roads is long outdated, as tax rose and infrastructure spending decreased.

1 Sep 2010

Quote by Ben_welshminx
.........snip
To put the waste into perspective I like to use an example. If your car breaks down 30 miles from home it would take you 3 months to push it home. You could walk that distance in about 8 hours. So driving a car 30 miles on your own with no cargo wastes about 3 months worth of human work.
Can't say I follow this logic Ben?
One of the problems we face is that we are so reliant on the personal motor car . Look back 50 years, we didn't use cars to go to work very much, we didnt use em to do the monthly shop (in fact I am not sure monthly shops was a widespread concept), we didnt use them to ferry the kids to school and we didnt use them to go to out of town shopping malls.
The world is a vastly different place now to what it was 50 years ago. We are so reliant on many things now that we weren't back then.......the internet being a prime example. There really is no point comparing then to now.

1 Sep 2010

Quote by Ben_welshminx
snip
To put the waste into perspective I like to use an example. If your car breaks down 30 miles from home it would take you 3 months to push it home. You could walk that distance in about 8 hours. So driving a car 30 miles on your own with no cargo wastes about 3 months worth of human work.

That's wrong logic - entirely wrong - driving the car doesn't waste the 3 months it would take to push it. Why would you push a car that doesn't work? The alternative to driving the car is the walking for 8 hours.
So driving the car without cargo is saving an 8 hour walk - NOT a 3 month push. And - I don't know about how you value your time - but 8 hours of mine is worth a damned site more than the cost of owning/driving the car.

1 Sep 2010

The energy in a gallon of petrol is equivalent to a human being working for 3 months. Does that make it any more understandable?
We use a gallon of petrol to do the work a human being does in 8 hours. The problem is exacerbated because as well as transporting a human being we are transporting a ton of car.
Therefore we are wasting 89 days worth of work.

1 Sep 2010

Quote by Ben_welshminx
The energy in a gallon of petrol is equivalent to a human being working for 3 months. Does that make it any more understandable?
We use a gallon of petrol to do the work a human being does in 8 hours. The problem is exacerbated because as well as transporting a human being we are transporting a ton of car.
Therefore we are wasting 89 days worth of work.

Or are we saving 89 days worth of work dunno

Too deep for me Ben wink

What would you prefer us to have?