We have all heard about the horrific deaths of Fiona Pilkington and her Daughter.
The police have now come out and appologised ( as usual after a death )and it seems that the police now think that some forms of anti social behavour should be left to the local councils to deal with. :shock:
This kind of thing is going on in so many streets up and down the country, but on this occasion the Mother after 33 calls to the police, was finally tipped over the edge.
Should we not expect the police now to turn up on occasions where ferel thugs are causing misery to law abiding citizens? Why was nothing done to stop this, or do the police now think this kind of crime is so far down the scale of being serious, that they now want to pass the buck onto the local councils ( who are only interested in bin revenues ).
The police have a duty and a responsibility to protect the general public, or they always used scream all the time about diversity and if a racist or homophobic attack was happening they would be there within five minutes, and rightly so but.....why when a member of the general public is not being harassed racially or whatever else, that the police on many occasions fail to respond?
It is too late now for this family for the police to say " sorry ", they should have acted at the time.
It seems families and kids like this have a free reign nowadays to do as they please, without any involvement from the police. At least the papers have taken this on board and printed pictures of the worst offending thug, but it will not make a blind bit of difference.
The police should have answered her cries for help, as they should to anyone in this situation, but are they not interested anymore in crimes like this?
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What are the police for now?
Sex God
But if they waste their time on such worthless problems Kenty, who will be free to hide behind a tree and catch & fine people driving at 32 in a 30 zone? 
I was listening to Nicky Campbell's phone in on Radio 5 this morning and an autistic lady called to say that she had been suffering similar problems on the waste ground next to her house, where kids would congregate to drink and take drugs. She said that she hasn't had a decent nights sleep on a Friday and Saturday night for years due to the noise these kids make and had complained regularly to the police. She also said that one of the symptoms of her autism is that she is either very calm or hopping mad...no middle ground, so when she is complaining to the police she is always the latter. The police's response?...to threaten her with an ASBO!!! :shock:
Unfortunately you are on the nail Meaty. The police only want to know when it is something they can record towards their targets, so the Chief Constables can "prove" what a good job they are doing.
Unfortunately you are on the nail Meaty. The police only want to know when it is something they can record towards their targets, so the Chief Constables can "prove" what a good job they are doing.
What they've always been for: To clear-up the mess after parents fucked things up.
It isn't the POLICE who allow 12 year-olds to wander about at one in the morning.
It isn't the POLICE who fail to lock-up repeat or serial offenders.
Something wrong with kids ?
Look first to those who are PRIMARILY responsible for children: Parents.
Then you can move-on to examine the social situation that empowers children.
Like the inability of other adults to stop kids misbehaving, because the first recourse of out-of-control kids is to complain they've been "assaulted".
(incidentally, a complaint of sexual assault is ALWAYS going to result in the arrest of the adult. Said arrest will remain on record for the remainder of that persons life)
You work it out. Any way you do: It isn't the fault of the police.
It isn't the POLICE who allow 12 year-olds to wander about at one in the morning.
It isn't the POLICE who fail to lock-up repeat or serial offenders.
Something wrong with kids ?
Look first to those who are PRIMARILY responsible for children: Parents.
Then you can move-on to examine the social situation that empowers children.
Like the inability of other adults to stop kids misbehaving, because the first recourse of out-of-control kids is to complain they've been "assaulted".
(incidentally, a complaint of sexual assault is ALWAYS going to result in the arrest of the adult. Said arrest will remain on record for the remainder of that persons life)
You work it out. Any way you do: It isn't the fault of the police.
Warming the Bed
Really, I don't know what you lot are complaining about.
The Police are still here to stop any black man driving a car less than 5 years old.
The Police are still here to stop any black man driving a car less than 5 years old.
Quote by JTS
What they've always been for: To clear-up the mess after parents fucked things up.
It isn't the POLICE who allow 12 year-olds to wander about at one in the morning.
It isn't the POLICE who fail to lock-up repeat or serial offenders.
Something wrong with kids ?
Look first to those who are PRIMARILY responsible for children: Parents.
Then you can move-on to examine the social situation that empowers children.
Like the inability of other adults to stop kids misbehaving, because the first recourse of out-of-control kids is to complain they've been "assaulted".
(incidentally, a complaint of sexual assault is ALWAYS going to result in the arrest of the adult. Said arrest will remain on record for the remainder of that persons life)
You work it out. Any way you do: It isn't the fault of the police.
I have copied and pasted an article on a report published last week. Will the following instances have resulted in an arrest?
POLICE forces in the North have come under fire over the way officers investigate rapes.
Around half of all complaints made to Northumbria Police and Durham Constabulary are not recorded in Government reports.
Statistics released under the Freedom of Information Act reveal 172 of the 382 allegations received by Northumbria were not recorded in Home Office reports.
In Durham, of 130 allegations made, 83 were not recorded.
Durham say the figures have been misinterpreted and Northumbria say they are changing procedures.
However, the Northumbria and Durham figures are the highest in the UK and have revealed large discrepancies as some forces’ figures detail all allegations.
The revelation has sparked criticism from the Fawcett Society, which campaigns for better justice for women.
Campaigns and Policy Officer Sharon Smee attacked the high levels of “no criming†and the inconsistencies between forces.
She added: “A previous review of cases in 2007, revealed that 31.8 per cent of cases recorded as “no crimes†were non-compliant with recording rules.
“Victim withdrawals or cases where the police thought victims lacked credibility were being incorrectly classified as no-crimes.
“The figures suggest this practice is continuing in many police areas.
Whilst I agree with you that it is the parents who are primarily responsible for the out of control kids and they are not the fault of the police, the police should be taking action against them if they are breaking the law....but it's probably too much paperwork!
This afternoon when Brown will be trying to save his neck, he will be bleating on about their records and that they ARE the party for law and order. :shock:
They have not got a clue have they?
It is them who we have to thank because under their Government things have got worse....much is all about targets and bloody graphs, but that is in their world and not in the general publics world. The one that we have to live in.
I do not blame the bobbies as they are just told what to do, I blame the suited and booted mob upstairs, whose only objectives are figures. Hence why the motorist is targeted so much.
If you was burgled you would be lucky if anyone turned up after three days.
Yes I am aware that bad parents equal bad kids, but why did the police not respond to this womans cries for help? Too much bother and a lot of coppers have this thing so much now, that the paperwork to attend just ain't worth the hassle.
Shame on those responsible for this tragic waste of life, they said " sorry " which means they are to blame, and therefore should be held accountable.
They have not got a clue have they?
It is them who we have to thank because under their Government things have got worse....much is all about targets and bloody graphs, but that is in their world and not in the general publics world. The one that we have to live in.
I do not blame the bobbies as they are just told what to do, I blame the suited and booted mob upstairs, whose only objectives are figures. Hence why the motorist is targeted so much.
If you was burgled you would be lucky if anyone turned up after three days.
Yes I am aware that bad parents equal bad kids, but why did the police not respond to this womans cries for help? Too much bother and a lot of coppers have this thing so much now, that the paperwork to attend just ain't worth the hassle.
Shame on those responsible for this tragic waste of life, they said " sorry " which means they are to blame, and therefore should be held accountable.
Once a report of is made the party alleged to have committed the (if he can be identified) WILL be arrested. That is procedure. It will be followed.
The person complaining about being will be treated very differently today than they would have been a few years ago.
Immediate medical assistance will be available in specialist suites, along with trained "companions" to accompany them at all times,if they want them.
The arrested person will have their clothing removed and be given a "boiler suit (paper)" to wear until other clothes can be obtained. If time has elapsed after the , the accused persons accommodation will be searched for evidence.
At all times the police will be operating with the prosecution service knowledge. What goes-on after all the evidence (if any) has been gathered is out of police hands.
Again: Once the case leaves the police and proceeds to the prosecutors it is little to do with the police.
Also: many cases depend on one persons word against another persons word. Those cases are hard to proceed with. But even then, the accused will be arrested. If released the accused person will be on bail, and many times with severe restrictions on movement and in practically every case that person will be denied travel abroad and will have to report to police at intervals. Probably every day. Little of the police work is influenced by political events, lots of it is influenced by various laws, and the accused person has rights as well. These have to be followed because if they are not then that will be grounds for either appeal or for the court to refuse the case. Take your pick. you can whinge forever about it being "labour", "conservatives" or "lib-Dems"....
In the real world it is the law. Not only national law, but international law.
The arrested person will have that fact on their record for the rest of their life. It will show when they are crb or vetting and safeguarding checked. It will be considered when they are checked by the ISA and even not guilty is paid no attention to.
In checking for suitability for contact with children/vulnerable adults only "reasonably probable" is taken into account.
An accusation of will end a persons easy life. If they work with children then their work will end. Full stop.
The person complaining about being will be treated very differently today than they would have been a few years ago.
Immediate medical assistance will be available in specialist suites, along with trained "companions" to accompany them at all times,if they want them.
The arrested person will have their clothing removed and be given a "boiler suit (paper)" to wear until other clothes can be obtained. If time has elapsed after the , the accused persons accommodation will be searched for evidence.
At all times the police will be operating with the prosecution service knowledge. What goes-on after all the evidence (if any) has been gathered is out of police hands.
Again: Once the case leaves the police and proceeds to the prosecutors it is little to do with the police.
Also: many cases depend on one persons word against another persons word. Those cases are hard to proceed with. But even then, the accused will be arrested. If released the accused person will be on bail, and many times with severe restrictions on movement and in practically every case that person will be denied travel abroad and will have to report to police at intervals. Probably every day. Little of the police work is influenced by political events, lots of it is influenced by various laws, and the accused person has rights as well. These have to be followed because if they are not then that will be grounds for either appeal or for the court to refuse the case. Take your pick. you can whinge forever about it being "labour", "conservatives" or "lib-Dems"....
In the real world it is the law. Not only national law, but international law.
The arrested person will have that fact on their record for the rest of their life. It will show when they are crb or vetting and safeguarding checked. It will be considered when they are checked by the ISA and even not guilty is paid no attention to.
In checking for suitability for contact with children/vulnerable adults only "reasonably probable" is taken into account.
An accusation of will end a persons easy life. If they work with children then their work will end. Full stop.
Must admit, I don't blame the police.
The police are normally pretty good at catching the bad guys, it's the courts that let people down.
It appears the local chav family are the ones to blame in this case, and I will bet the family were known to the police.
Time to stop the namby pamby PC bollocks and let the police do thier jobs.
The police are normally pretty good at catching the bad guys, it's the courts that let people down.
It appears the local chav family are the ones to blame in this case, and I will bet the family were known to the police.
Time to stop the namby pamby PC bollocks and let the police do thier jobs.
Quote by browning
Must admit, I don't blame the police.
The police are normally pretty good at catching the bad guys, it's the courts that let people down.
It appears the local chav family are the ones to blame in this case, and I will bet the family were known to the police.
Time to stop the namby pamby PC bollocks and let the police do thier jobs.
That is exactly what the majority of police officers want to do. It is the overpaid suited mob that just have to leave their mark.
I would say bring the head of this police force before the courts, as the buck has to stop with him over this.
Maybe just maybe lessons can and will be learned over this, but with diversity now taking top priority in the police, lessons learnt is something I very much regret they will learn.
Quote by kentswingers777
JTS.....are you posting in the right thread?
Pay attention man.
He's responding to my post Kent, apologies for the hijack.
JTS, the article that I copied and pasted was dated 27th September and is about the latest figures which have just been obtained under the Freedom of Information Act. My point is that in your previous post you stated that allegations of sexual assault will always result in arrest but according to these figures, 255 out of 512 reported rapes ( 50%) in Durham and Northumberland were not recorded in Home Office reports. Seems strange to me if 257 people were to be arrested but the figures not recored.
Quote by flower411
Must admit, I don't blame the police.
The police are normally pretty good at catching the bad guys, it's the courts that let people down.
It appears the local chav family are the ones to blame in this case, and I will bet the family were known to the police.
Time to stop the namby pamby PC bollocks and let the police do thier jobs.
I think you`re right there ...it`s all very well blaming the police ....but if the courts refuse to prosecute criminals because of political agendas ...
What can the police do other vote with their feet ....not turning up to crimes because the courts won`t prosecute because their political masters tell them not to....
The police force in question in this case have admitted they were at fault and have apologised. No amount of apologies will atone for what happened to the unfortunate lady and her daughter.
The police should investigate ALL crimes....we are on a slippery slope when we allow them to decide which crimes they want to investigate.
Quote by flower411
Must admit, I don't blame the police.
The police are normally pretty good at catching the bad guys, it's the courts that let people down.
It appears the local chav family are the ones to blame in this case, and I will bet the family were known to the police.
Time to stop the namby pamby PC bollocks and let the police do thier jobs.
I think you`re right there ...it`s all very well blaming the police ....but if the courts refuse to prosecute criminals because of political agendas ...
What can the police do other vote with their feet ....not turning up to crimes because the courts won`t prosecute because their political masters tell them not to....
The police force in question in this case have admitted they were at fault and have apologised. No amount of apologies will atone for what happened to the unfortunate lady and her daughter.
The police should investigate ALL crimes....we are on a slippery slope when we allow them to decide which crimes they want to investigate.
We are on a slippery slope when the wife of the prime minister is an apologist for criminals and "appoints" his successor without a vote !!!
Think about it !
I won't argue with you on that score Flower......I have no time for Gordon Brown.
The warmth expressed towards the victim of these crimes surprises me. Is it her tragic death that has elevated her from the "benefit scrounging scum" label that Im pretty sure would have been used had she been the subject of a Sun expose while she was alive.
She was, from what I have read, a single unemployed mum living on a council estate.
You cant blame the police. Society is to blame for destroying the lives and hopes of millions. This lady just happened to get the shittiest end of a very shitty stick.
She was, from what I have read, a single unemployed mum living on a council estate.
You cant blame the police. Society is to blame for destroying the lives and hopes of millions. This lady just happened to get the shittiest end of a very shitty stick.
A speech by Margaret Thatcher:
Not the police at fault: parents.
Too much freedom and too little responsibility.
If parents do not exercise control, and do not allow other adults to exercise control: Then all the control there is remaining is the law. And that way lies failure.
But it went too far:
"If children have a problem, it is society that is at fault"
There is no such thing as society ! There is living tapestry of men and women and people and the beauty of that tapestry and the quality of our lives will depend upon how much each of us is prepared to take responsibility for ourselves and each of us prepared to turn round and help by our own efforts those who are unfortunate. And the worst things we have in life, in my view, are where children who are a great privilege and a trust—they are the fundamental great trust, but they do not ask to come into the world, we bring them into the world, they are a miracle, there is nothing like the miracle of life—we have these little innocents and the worst crime in life is when those children, who would naturally have the right to look to their parents for help, for comfort, not only just for the food and shelter but for the time, for the understanding, turn round and not only is that help not forthcoming, but they get either neglect or worse than that, cruelty.
Not the police at fault: parents.
Too much freedom and too little responsibility.
If parents do not exercise control, and do not allow other adults to exercise control: Then all the control there is remaining is the law. And that way lies failure.
Quote by Ben_welshminx
The warmth expressed towards the victim of these crimes surprises me. Is it her tragic death that has elevated her from the "benefit scrounging scum" label that Im pretty sure would have been used had she been the subject of a Sun expose while she was alive.
She was, from what I have read, a single unemployed mum living on a council estate.
You cant blame the police. Society is to blame for destroying the lives and hopes of millions. This lady just happened to get the shittiest end of a very shitty stick.
Sorry Ben, no one is blaming society's ills on the police, I am laying the blame on them for not doing the job that they are paid to do...at least 33 times in this instance.
And as for your crass comment on the "warmth" being extended to the victim, I shall treat that with the contempt it deserves.
Quote by Max777
The warmth expressed towards the victim of these crimes surprises me. Is it her tragic death that has elevated her from the "benefit scrounging scum" label that Im pretty sure would have been used had she been the subject of a Sun expose while she was alive.
She was, from what I have read, a single unemployed mum living on a council estate.
You cant blame the police. Society is to blame for destroying the lives and hopes of millions. This lady just happened to get the shittiest end of a very shitty stick.
Sorry Ben, no one is blaming society's ills on the police, I am laying the blame on them for not doing the job that they are paid to do...at least 33 times in this instance.
And as for your crass comment on the "warmth" being extended to the victim, I shall treat that with the contempt it deserves.
:laughabove: :laughabove: :laughabove:
Sex God
When there's no such thing as society there are no social mores..no rules ,we live in a decadent world decadence has its price
Twenty years ago Mrs Pilkington would have had a much better service than she got in the years leading up to 2007. There were many thousands less police officers. In March this year there were 144,000 police officers. In March 1987 there were 120,000.
We have 24,000 more police officers yet those available for front line policing have been slashed dramatically. I don’t have access to any figures for the amount of officers available for day-to-day policing calls so I can only go by my own experience. In 1987 one division I worked in paraded 18 officers split between 4 police stations. This did not include 3 rural cars which covered the villages, 1 officer in every neighbourhood beat & a rural officers who shared all the villages between them. We put out 9 patrol cars in the division plus a walker in each of the town centres & the police stations were open 24 hours a day.
Now those same 4 towns have a maximum of 8 officers between them, we are lucky if they can put out 5 cars in the whole division, all of the police stations are closed longer than they are open.
Back in the day the village bobby lived on the patch & knew everyone & everything there was to be known. He probably looked after 2 or 3 villages. Every estate had a neighbourhood officer who lived on their patch, they often had a little police office attached to their house, they too knew everyone, they were a vast source of information. What they knew & what they did couldn’t be recorded in an exel spreadsheet yet their value to policing was enormous.
Then someone in a wendy house somewhere decided that the only way to measure the success of an organisation was to match its performance against a written down set of criteria & the way to do this was to count beans. Suddenly, the value of everything was measured in beans & rural/neighbourhood officers didn’t grow any beans on their patches. Add to that the fact that they lived in expensive police houses.
The theory went that if you did away with neighbourhood & rural officers not only could you pull them all back to the nick where they could produce a few beans, you could also save the expense of maintaining their houses, sell them off & plough lots of lovely lolly into all the new & dynamic projects which were about to hit the world of UK policing. We lost a generation of intelligence which we are only now getting back, amazingly enough, through local PCSOs, who will, within a few years, be just as valuable a tool to police intelligence as the old village bobby.
It made good political – read voting – sense to increase the number of bobbies, so every government promised more. More bobbies means more votes ‘cos we all want more bobbies on the streets, only they never made the streets. They all went into disparate little ‘remit’ teams. You know the teams, they are the ones you ask for help when you’re struggling to meet all the frontline priorities who turn round & say “sorry, mate, not my remitâ€.
So we had the burglary squad, set up to specifically target burglary beans, the robbery squad busy collecting robbery beans, sexual offences squad, squad, computer crime squad, diversity squad, more officers means more potential for naughty goings-on so the rubber heel squad was boosted. We had the serious crime units, the bloody serious crime units, organised crime, it goes on. Then there are the units who monitor the other units, who count the beans, who supervise those who count the beans, who make sure the right beans are being counted.
So every time an Inspector of Constabulary comes a-calling & says, “now look here Mr Chief Constable, your force is doing particularly low in detections of spanner-wielding credit-card thieves†we have to have a department whose soul aim is to reduce spanner-wielding credit card thefts.
The problem for those on the front line is that most of the calls we get don’t lead to all the remit-beans. Nobody measures the prevention of crime, nobody measures kids who piss up your garage & chuck eggs through your windows, nobody measures depressed people who threaten suicide but never go through with it. You don’t get a bean for sitting outside a row of shops stopping the kids from spitting at people with special needs.
And if they’re not measured, they’re not important.
If the next Inspector of Constabulary comes round & says “Now look here Mr Chief Constable, the behaviour of teenage yobs in this area is apalling, this chart shows a 150% increase in bad language in front of old ladies, get it sorted†you’ll have so many shiny-arses out of their offices that the problem could be sorted in a year.
It ain’t gonna happen, though.
Thanks for the link JTS......makes for very interesting reading. I thought the previous blog which I have copied and below pasted said things a little more eloquenltly.
The dreadful case of Fiona Pilkington whose life was blighted by anti social youths on her estate to such an extent that she took her own child’s life & committed suicide by setting fire to her car as they sat in it, will have some far-reaching repurcussions. The surprise is that, in the two years since this tragic event happened, there has been just about zero change in the way police deal with anti-social behaviour.
I spend every late shift in every town I control not sending police officers to anti social youths. This is despite the fact that I know what an effect it can have on people’s lives let alone their peace. I’m almost ashamed to say but I have anti social behaviour in my street & I never report it to the police, the reason purely & simply is, I know there is little chance of the police arriving before the youths have moved on. If it’s gotten too bad I have gone out there myself & given some ‘advice’, though I don’t like doing this in my own street. (I tend to climb over my back fence & appear from somewhere not near my house so they don’t know where I live).
The apalling crux of the matter is one of mathematics. We have X-amount of officers & we get Y-amount of jobs which take Z-amount of time. When Y x Z > X we cannot possibly get to all the jobs on time, if at all. We either have to make people wait, in some cases days, or we just don’t go.
The problem with antisocial behaviour is that it doesn’t fit in with any targets & we don’t get to tick any boxes. When Jay sends a text message to his ex-girlfriend Leah saying she’s a slag, that’s threats to violence or damage, malicious communications or a domestic, all of which are recordable & may result in a detected crime. When Mrs Miggins is fed up to the back teeth with a bunch of teenage yobs who spend every night shouting & swearing outside her bedroom & pissing up against her fence, that’s just a bit of ASB. Guess which one gets an officer sent to it whether they want one or not & which one gets closed off 2 hours after the youths have gone elsewhere with a ‘no officer available’ closing.
Mrs Pilkington did not have the protection afforded to certain groups within society. Had she been black or Asian, Jewish or gay, she would have had an officer every single occasion she phoned. There are teams within each police force whose sole job it is to look at ‘hate’ crimes against minority groups. I well remember a case of some kids throwing snowballs at a Jewish shop, on a day when the kids were throwing snowballs at everyone & anyone & we didn’t have the resources to deal with all the accidents & crime let alone kids chucking snowballs. Most of the snowball jobs just got closed off because there was absolutely no chance of us sending anyone; we had more important & immediate things to do. The Jewish shop had to remain open because the racism word had been mentioned. Within an hour the Inspector in charge of the diversity unit was on the phone to the control room inspector demanding to know why this racist incident hadn’t been assigned within the 1 hour requirement of force policy.
Nobody phoned up from any police unit who sit on their arses looking at logs in some office somewhere at HQ on behalf of all the other people being taunted by kids with snow. The fact that Mrs Pilkington had a disabled daughter, much of which taunting was aimed at, doesn’t seem to have cut any ice with the local constabulary.
I’ve blogged before about the unfairness of diversity policy & have argued that everyone should be treated on their own merits only. It completely baffles me that, for instance, a 6′6 Afro-Caribbean nightclub bouncer with years in the nighttime entertainment trade, who gets called a rude name is entitled to a better service than a vulnerable teenage girl who may be, unknowingly to us, considering suicide because of some bullying. How can a rule written on a policy somewhere at police HQ possibly differentiate between the effect on these two people & class one as somehow more deserving of a higher response than the other. Where is the leeway to attend based on the individual potential effect on the victim?
Just occasionally, someone will come up with a local operation to target antisocial behaviour. Extra resources will be called in & they will be tasked for ASB jobs alone, unavailable for RTCs, assaults or domestics. This is a clear acceptance of the importance of tackling such behaviour, but if it is important, why isn’t important all the time & on every estate.
Antisocial behaviour is the key to so many more problems in society. Someone who grows up not having consequences for their behaviour will learn that they are entitled to do what they want, when they want, to whom they want. They will grow up with a me, me, me attitude & will spend the rest of their lives demanding everything they can get. A child who grows up to respect other peoples needs & rights will end up as net givers to society.
When I was on the street I actually enjoyed helping to make other people’s lives a little better. One of the reasons I wanted to join the police was to help people who couldn’t help themselves. I held that belief until the day I retired. I still believe it. I am unable to do it because I do not have the resources nor the will from those who run the show to sort the matter out.
After the story of Mrs Pilkington, I will be wondering if the next job I fail to send an officer to will end up with someone murdering their child & topping themselves. That’s simply not fair & I don’t have the power to address it properly.
Time will tell whether the fallout from Mrs Pilkington will make any difference.
Think that says it all!
The dreadful case of Fiona Pilkington whose life was blighted by anti social youths on her estate to such an extent that she took her own child’s life & committed suicide by setting fire to her car as they sat in it, will have some far-reaching repurcussions. The surprise is that, in the two years since this tragic event happened, there has been just about zero change in the way police deal with anti-social behaviour.
I spend every late shift in every town I control not sending police officers to anti social youths. This is despite the fact that I know what an effect it can have on people’s lives let alone their peace. I’m almost ashamed to say but I have anti social behaviour in my street & I never report it to the police, the reason purely & simply is, I know there is little chance of the police arriving before the youths have moved on. If it’s gotten too bad I have gone out there myself & given some ‘advice’, though I don’t like doing this in my own street. (I tend to climb over my back fence & appear from somewhere not near my house so they don’t know where I live).
The apalling crux of the matter is one of mathematics. We have X-amount of officers & we get Y-amount of jobs which take Z-amount of time. When Y x Z > X we cannot possibly get to all the jobs on time, if at all. We either have to make people wait, in some cases days, or we just don’t go.
The problem with antisocial behaviour is that it doesn’t fit in with any targets & we don’t get to tick any boxes. When Jay sends a text message to his ex-girlfriend Leah saying she’s a slag, that’s threats to violence or damage, malicious communications or a domestic, all of which are recordable & may result in a detected crime. When Mrs Miggins is fed up to the back teeth with a bunch of teenage yobs who spend every night shouting & swearing outside her bedroom & pissing up against her fence, that’s just a bit of ASB. Guess which one gets an officer sent to it whether they want one or not & which one gets closed off 2 hours after the youths have gone elsewhere with a ‘no officer available’ closing.
Mrs Pilkington did not have the protection afforded to certain groups within society. Had she been black or Asian, Jewish or gay, she would have had an officer every single occasion she phoned. There are teams within each police force whose sole job it is to look at ‘hate’ crimes against minority groups. I well remember a case of some kids throwing snowballs at a Jewish shop, on a day when the kids were throwing snowballs at everyone & anyone & we didn’t have the resources to deal with all the accidents & crime let alone kids chucking snowballs. Most of the snowball jobs just got closed off because there was absolutely no chance of us sending anyone; we had more important & immediate things to do. The Jewish shop had to remain open because the racism word had been mentioned. Within an hour the Inspector in charge of the diversity unit was on the phone to the control room inspector demanding to know why this racist incident hadn’t been assigned within the 1 hour requirement of force policy.
Nobody phoned up from any police unit who sit on their arses looking at logs in some office somewhere at HQ on behalf of all the other people being taunted by kids with snow. The fact that Mrs Pilkington had a disabled daughter, much of which taunting was aimed at, doesn’t seem to have cut any ice with the local constabulary.
I’ve blogged before about the unfairness of diversity policy & have argued that everyone should be treated on their own merits only. It completely baffles me that, for instance, a 6′6 Afro-Caribbean nightclub bouncer with years in the nighttime entertainment trade, who gets called a rude name is entitled to a better service than a vulnerable teenage girl who may be, unknowingly to us, considering suicide because of some bullying. How can a rule written on a policy somewhere at police HQ possibly differentiate between the effect on these two people & class one as somehow more deserving of a higher response than the other. Where is the leeway to attend based on the individual potential effect on the victim?
Just occasionally, someone will come up with a local operation to target antisocial behaviour. Extra resources will be called in & they will be tasked for ASB jobs alone, unavailable for RTCs, assaults or domestics. This is a clear acceptance of the importance of tackling such behaviour, but if it is important, why isn’t important all the time & on every estate.
Antisocial behaviour is the key to so many more problems in society. Someone who grows up not having consequences for their behaviour will learn that they are entitled to do what they want, when they want, to whom they want. They will grow up with a me, me, me attitude & will spend the rest of their lives demanding everything they can get. A child who grows up to respect other peoples needs & rights will end up as net givers to society.
When I was on the street I actually enjoyed helping to make other people’s lives a little better. One of the reasons I wanted to join the police was to help people who couldn’t help themselves. I held that belief until the day I retired. I still believe it. I am unable to do it because I do not have the resources nor the will from those who run the show to sort the matter out.
After the story of Mrs Pilkington, I will be wondering if the next job I fail to send an officer to will end up with someone murdering their child & topping themselves. That’s simply not fair & I don’t have the power to address it properly.
Time will tell whether the fallout from Mrs Pilkington will make any difference.
Think that says it all!
Max.....thats makes for grim reading, but I knew that was happening anyway and did not need a copper to write that down.
Diversity eh? Their own diversity department...yeah right.
I have always stated colour should never ever be used, but we know it should be treated on merit like this guy says, but it is not.
Diversity eh? It works wonderfully well. :shock:
This woman was let down because they felt her complaints were not serious enough but....had she of been in one of their " diversity " categorys they would have turned up, and that is what is disgusting.
Diversity eh? Their own diversity department...yeah right.
I have always stated colour should never ever be used, but we know it should be treated on merit like this guy says, but it is not.
Diversity eh? It works wonderfully well. :shock:
This woman was let down because they felt her complaints were not serious enough but....had she of been in one of their " diversity " categorys they would have turned up, and that is what is disgusting.
Warming the Bed
i think they must be over staffed today in my local high street eltham 5 cars 2 motorcycles all with blue lights blazing and several police officers chased young lad for shop lifting a bottle of orange juice and a packet of crisps he out smarted the cops by running straight up the side of the police station you had been there you could see the funny side of doughnuts lads more exercise lol
Warming the Bed
i think they must be over staffed today in my local high street eltham 5 cars 2 motorcycles all with blue lights blazing and several police officers chased young lad for shop lifting a bottle of orange juice and a packet of crisps he out smarted the cops by running straight up the side of the police station you had been there you could see the funny side of doughnuts lads more exercise lol
Warming the Bed
i think they must be over staffed today in my local high street eltham 5 cars 2 motorcycles all with blue lights blazing and several police officers chased young lad for shop lifting a bottle of orange juice and a packet of crisps he out smarted the cops by running straight up the side of the police station you had been there you could see the funny side of doughnuts lads more exercise lol
Quote by Ben_welshminx
The warmth expressed towards the victim of these crimes surprises me. Is it her tragic death that has elevated her from the "benefit scrounging scum" label that Im pretty sure would have been used had she been the subject of a Sun expose while she was alive.
She was, from what I have read, a single unemployed mum living on a council estate.
You cant blame the police. Society is to blame for destroying the lives and hopes of millions. This lady just happened to get the shittiest end of a very shitty stick.
Coming from a family of 6 that were raised on a council estate by a single parent I just love it when people tar us all with the same brush.
I don't know anything about Fiona Pilkington other than the fact she killed herself two years ago along with her daughter and her rabbit. I suspect she didn't have quite the array of problems that Patricia Levy has. But I also suspect that Patricia will end up meeting a similarly grisly end, and I am sure the police will be blamed when she does. One thing I do know is that anyone who torches themselves and their child to death in a car is mentally ill, and that has nothing to do with kids harassing them (although it probably doesn't help).
A teenager who beat a lorry driver to death with a hammer in Northamptonshire after a row over anti-social behaviour, will probably serve only 58 months in prison. Four other youths who admitted involvement in the attack were also jailed
At the moment Bedfordshire police are seriously concerned about people having sex in a wood.
So much so that they have posted notices in the wood warning that they are patrolling said wood. Another notice has been posted warning that covert cctv will be used to deter "criminal activity" (sex)
This is apparently SO serious that the wood is regularly patrolled at one in the morning by uniformed officers....4 of them.
This has been going-on now for about 2 months ....meanwhile....there is at least one stabbing in the county town every weekend....
So much so that they have posted notices in the wood warning that they are patrolling said wood. Another notice has been posted warning that covert cctv will be used to deter "criminal activity" (sex)
This is apparently SO serious that the wood is regularly patrolled at one in the morning by uniformed officers....4 of them.
This has been going-on now for about 2 months ....meanwhile....there is at least one stabbing in the county town every weekend....
