Will the Euro collapse

29 Nov 2011

its looking more and more likely the collapse of the Euro single currency will happen
many think this will benefit the uks economy in the long term but the short term consequences could be catastrophic not just to the uk but world wide (2012 anyone ????)
any thoughts dunno

29 Nov 2011

Where does that view come from rob?
Prior to last US Presidential Elections the same was talked about the USD amd how the new Presindent (whoever it was going to be) would default on debt and change from the USD back to cutting notches in sticks.
It didn't happen of course - nor will it.
The same can be said of the Euro. Lots of scaremongering going on and when Merkel and Sarkozy 'save' the currency from collapse everyone will think they are the good guys.
Politicians need the populace (aka the electorate) to live in fear. There are no significant world wars going on, Gadaffi is dead as is Saddam and other than making people walk through security at airports stark bollock naked there is no other way to induce fear other than that they will loose all their money.
Hence the Euro crisis.
I'm waiting for the day when the £/€ re-attains the heady heights of 3€ for every £ sterling.
Maybe George Osborne should give an autumn statement every day... look how the markets jumped.

29 Nov 2011

Quote by GnV"Where does that view come from rob?
Prior to last US Presidential Elections the same was talked about the USD amd how the new Presindent (whoever it was going to be) would default on debt and change from the USD back to cutting notches in sticks.
It didn't happen of course - nor will it.
The same can be said of the Euro. Lots of scaremongering going on and when Merkel and Sarkozy 'save' the currency from collapse everyone will think they are the good guys.
Politicians need the populace (aka the electorate) to live in fear. There are no significant world wars going on, Gadaffi is dead as is Saddam and other than making people walk through security at airports stark bollock naked there is no other way to induce fear other than that they will loose all their money.
Hence the Euro crisis.
I'm waiting for the day when the £/€ re-attains the heady heights of 3€ for every £ sterling.
Maybe George Osborne should give an autumn statement every day... look how the markets jumped.

really just looking at where things are at the moment gnv
very few countries in the euro zone have any control over their economy. the fact that france germany and a few others are doing ok im not sure their doing well enough to drag the others through with them in these hard times
there's no room to raise interest rates ect where years ago this was considered a way of obtaining foreign investment etc
my personal opinion is that the likes of italy, spain, greece, and protugal will all withdraw from the euro if for no other reason than to appease their public
much of the talk in spain at the moment for the public is they blame the euro for the mess Spain's in
we're all aware of just how much the cost of living has spiraled in europe since the introduction of the euro and this is just one example

30 Nov 2011

I honestly feel that there is nothing fundamentally wrong with the Euro.
What is wrong with Europe centres mainly on the Commission rather than individual Member States necessarily.
At a time when Europe is seeking regime change through the Arab Spring to remove unelected dictatorships, it should remind itself that the European Commission too exercises unelected and unaccountable Governance and is a massive drain on the whole European economy. They are just out of control, spending money like it is going out of fashion (it has a very real danger of doing that!) and in many cases duplicates what Member States already provide - Baroness Ashton's Foreign Policy Department is a clear example - Euros for 2011, and that is just for her European External Action Service! She earns 265k Euros basic salary plus expenses. In comparison, the UK PM receives the equivalent of 100k Euros less.
And that is just one (small) part of the whole Commission.
The money saved by binning the Commission would go a long way to resolving some of the financial problems in the Eurozone.

2 Dec 2011

Quote by GnV
I honestly feel that there is nothing fundamentally wrong with the Euro.
What is wrong with Europe centres mainly on the Commission rather than individual Member States necessarily.
At a time when Europe is seeking regime change through the Arab Spring to remove unelected dictatorships, it should remind itself that the European Commission too exercises unelected and unaccountable Governance and is a massive drain on the whole European economy. They are just out of control, spending money like it is going out of fashion (it has a very real danger of doing that!) and in many cases duplicates what Member States already provide - Baroness Ashton's Foreign Policy Department is a clear example - Euros for 2011, and that is just for her European External Action Service! She earns 265k Euros basic salary plus expenses. In comparison, the UK PM receives the equivalent of 100k Euros less.
And that is just one (small) part of the whole Commission.
The money saved by binning the Commission would go a long way to resolving some of the financial problems in the Eurozone.

so the bank of england have prewarned the uk banks to stockile cash for the probable collapse of the euro
is there something he knows that we dont dunno

2 Dec 2011

Quote by Lizaleanrob
so the bank of england have prewarned the uk banks to stockile cash for the probable collapse of the euro
is there something he knows that we dont

It just adds to the drama and gives Cameron an excuse for a rather nice lunch today in the Élysée Palace. Boiled beef and carrots in the Downing Street dining room is sooo boring when you can drool over Carla's svelte form whilst she is serving les petits pois avec le Sole meunière (accompanied by a rather nice Sancerre no doubt!)
The forecast collapse won't happen. Nicolas said so yesterday evening in Toulon. The worst that will happen is France and Germany restructuring the Euro zone to exclude those that can't keep up with it. Each Member State in the Euro prints its own money anyway and the exchange rate to the 'home' currency is fixed.

2 Dec 2011

Quote by GnV
so the bank of england have prewarned the uk banks to stockile cash for the probable collapse of the euro
is there something he knows that we dont

It just adds to the drama and gives Cameron an excuse for a rather nice lunch today in the Élysée Palace. Boiled beef and carrots in the Downing Street dining room is sooo boring when you can drool over Carla's svelte form whilst she is serving les petits pois avec le Sole meunière (accompanied by a rather nice Sancerre no doubt!)
The forecast collapse won't happen. Nicolas said so yesterday evening in Toulon. The worst that will happen is France and Germany restructuring the Euro zone to exclude those that can't keep up with it. Each Member State in the Euro prints its own money anyway and the exchange rate to the 'home' currency is fixed.
It puts me in mind of the way Labour used terrorism to keep the public scared! Fear is an excellent tool for governments, to keep us lot in line

2 Dec 2011

Quote by Bluefish2009
It puts me in mind of the way Labour used terrorism to keep the public scared! Fear is an excellent tool for governments, to keep us lot in line

:thumbup:

3 Dec 2011

Whos scared? When I wne to Corfu in 2005 I was getting 147 euros for my pound. Now I guess its around 113? Big pants that is. Now pre euro I recall going on holiday and being a virtual millionaire for my quid :twisted: We actually bribbed the flume attendant in one place to let us on free all day. We gave him 1 weeks wages which was the equivilant of 4 goes on the slide and virtual peanuts. If all or a few countries devolve back I wont worry. Maybe it will open up some more cheap destinations other than Bulgaria and the Czech republic. Not going to the later anyway, Ive seen Hostel :shock:
Yes the above is quite shallow and probably massively incorrect also lol

3 Dec 2011

everyone's in debt apart from the germans...that's the problem (well...and the chinese)
to pay the money back we need growth...nobody is going to grow as everybody is skint...prices in the country are higher than they should be as we have mortgaged our future via PFI and the financial chicanery of the likes of the philip green, the pubcos and care homes...a (very)few have cashed out and left the punters to pick up the tab for years to come
there's only one thing for it...print a whole stash of cash and give it out to everybody....tough for the savers but would certainly bring the debt down
then all we have to worry about is inflation... lol

4 Dec 2011

Looks like it's the Merkozy solution then...

But, who will win this contest.. will it be a different ending to

4 Dec 2011

Welcome to the United States of Europe. One Government, one Nation and the UK on the outside. This is the only way that the Euro can survive intact and really why the French and Germans would want such an alliance including somne of the lesser countries - God only knows.
Still losing national governance should make the recent strikes and demos in Greece seem like a tea party in the park.
Personally I think the option will be to join the United States of Europe and completely lose national Government or go it alone.............

4 Dec 2011

Quote by Too Hot
Welcome to the United States of Europe. One Government, one Nation and the UK on the outside. This is the only way that the Euro can survive intact and really why the French and Germans would want such an alliance including somne of the lesser countries - God only knows.
Still losing national governance should make the recent strikes and demos in Greece seem like a tea party in the park.
Personally I think the option will be to join the United States of Europe and completely lose national Government or go it alone.............

The real European Union National Anthem
Or maybe Brian May will play from the roof of 10 Downing Street?

4 Dec 2011

Quote by denistoun
everyone's in debt apart from the germans...that's the problem (well...and the chinese)
to pay the money back we need growth...nobody is going to grow as everybody is skint...prices in the country are higher than they should be as we have mortgaged our future via PFI and the financial chicanery of the likes of the philip green, the pubcos and care homes...a (very)few have cashed out and left the punters to pick up the tab for years to come
there's only one thing for it...print a whole stash of cash and give it out to everybody....tough for the savers but would certainly bring the debt down
then all we have to worry about is inflation...

:welcome: to the forum

6 Dec 2011

The Eurozone Countries need to stop dicking around and sort their act out. I got a pension fund statement the other day - the analysis of the poor fund performance over the last 6 months tracks all the scare stories out of Euro Zone countries. If anyone with a pension plan thinks that this isn't hurting them, think again. If your pot has less money in it right now, it'll earn less long term.
I'm thinking of suspending my pension contributions and putting the same monthly amount into a mortgage with which I'd buy a property to rent out. If the property market crashes to the same extent as the stock market, we're all buggered - but perhaps I'd have something to sell and reinvest when it's time to retire.

6 Dec 2011

Quote by BaxterUK
The Eurozone Countries need to stop dicking around and sort their act out. I got a pension fund statement the other day - the analysis of the poor fund performance over the last 6 months tracks all the scare stories out of Euro Zone countries. If anyone with a pension plan thinks that this isn't hurting them, think again. If your pot has less money in it right now, it'll earn less long term.
I'm thinking of suspending my pension contributions and putting the same monthly amount into a mortgage with which I'd buy a property to rent out. If the property market crashes to the same extent as the stock market, we're all buggered - but perhaps I'd have something to sell and reinvest when it's time to retire.

A millionaire friend of mine (he's down to his last £12m) told me some time ago never to trust anyone else with your money. He does all his own investments (mainly property) and keeps a very close reign on what is going on where. PPP's only benefit the pension fund managers. I've always been concerned at the amount these morons take in fees for doing sweet FA whilst our investments have been declining and have systematically over the past few years been pulling out of them/selling them off to get better returns where possible. In some cases, as matters currently are, it's better to stuff the cash in the floor safe!

7 Dec 2011

i heard this morning that a huge amount of french peeple want to go back to the franc?
also i read this morning that the architech who founded the euro stated it was a non runner from the start?
is there any truth in this at all?

7 Dec 2011

Quote by starlightcouple
i heard this morning that a huge amount of french peeple want to go back to the franc?
also i read this morning that the architech who founded the euro stated it was a non runner from the start?
is there any truth in this at all?

One of the architects of the Euro was Jacques Delors. His daughter is Marine Aubrey who is the head of the Socialist Party (PS) in France who hope to oust President Sarkozy at next years (2012) Presidential Elections. You are quite correct that Jacques Delors (who is now in his mid 80's) has said publicly that the Euro was flawed from the outset. His arch enemy Margaret Thatcher knew that which is why she would not even consider it. It's a great shame that JD was not so forthcoming in the days of his Presidency of the European Commission.
As for the French wanting a return to the FF, I doubt that very much. They may say in passing that they prefer the Franc but that would mean putting Mme Marine Le Pen (National Front party - FN) in the Elysée Palace at the next election. Her father almost made it last time getting through to the run off between him and Sarkozy (UMP) and it is possible that the French will vote tactically again, putting Sarkozy in third place (and out of the running) with a run off between François Holland (the PS Presidential candidate) and Mme Le Pen (FN). If history repeats itself, the FN will lose spectacularly in the second round leaving François Holland the keys to the Elysée Palace. Problem is that he has never held a post in Government as a minister despite his long history as a politician and it will almost be as bad as putting the non-politico's in charge as they have in Italy.
The Euro is here to stay. There may be fewer members after some blood-letting later this week if Merkel gets her way but such change as that might require is fraught with all sorts of difficulty as it might require a treaty change and a return to voting contests where 'call me Dave' might be called upon to allow the UK to vote on an exit strategy from the club by referendum.

9 Dec 2011

so finaly after 100 years germany looks like it has control over europe with britain still showing its stubborn resitence lol

9 Dec 2011

Quote by Lizaleanrob
so finally after 100 years germany looks like it has control over Europe with Britain still showing its stubborn resistance

9 Dec 2011

well it seams that david cameron has some balls. he stood up to the f's and the k's and did not back down. early days yes but he showed the same determination that another tory leeder showed all those yeers ago.
good on you cameron :thumbup:

9 Dec 2011

Quote by starlightcouple
well it seams that david cameron has some balls. he stood up to the f's and the k's and did not back down. early days yes but he showed the same determination that another tory leeder showed all those yeers ago.
good on you cameron :thumbup:

And look where it got us and them.
ahhh remember the John Major years well lol

It looks like all other EU states will join a new fiscal arrangement aimed at stopping a repeat of the eurozone debt crisis. For eurozone countries, it means they will have to enshrine in their own national constitutions tougher budget rules which were in the Maastricht treaty, but have since been broken.

9 Dec 2011

Do we want europe to regulate our City?
I am no expert, But I think not

9 Dec 2011

Quote by Bluefish2009
Do we want europe to regulate our City?
I am no expert, But I think not

problem is Europe is still going to impose the tax levy.....its just that we won't be part of the decision process now. In reality we are inbetween a rock and a hard place. We don't want to agree to it, but equally by standing aside we are letting them do it anyway....just without us !!
Tends to feel like we are Man Utd of the EU. We have crashed out of the main event, where we rightly belong....and now have to compete in a lower level. And like man Utd..in reality it is of our own doing.
Begs the question really.....as we are now on the sidelines....would we actually be better totally out of it. EU contries at the top table..and we at the small table with our new friends Hungary !!!

9 Dec 2011

Quote by deancannock
Do we want europe to regulate our City?
I am no expert, But I think not

problem is Europe is still going to impose the tax levy.....its just that we won't be part of the decision process now. In reality we are inbetween a rock and a hard place. We don't want to agree to it, but equally by standing aside we are letting them do it anyway....just without us !!
Tends to feel like we are Man Utd of the EU. We have crashed out of the main event, where we rightly belong....and now have to compete in a lower level. And like man Utd..in reality it is of our own doing.
Begs the question really.....as we are now on the sidelines....would we actually be better totally out of it. EU contries at the top table..and we at the small table with our new friends Hungary !!!
This is what Mr Cable had to say
The Business Secretary defended Prime Minister David Cameron's use of the British veto to block eurozone treaty change after France and Germany opposed “safeguards” to protect Britain’s economy.
Mr Cable said: "The really important thing about this summit is that Europe sorts out its very deep crisis because hundreds of thousands of British jobs depend on the eurozone crisis being resolved.
"The key national interest we are trying to protect here is the single market. Very large sectors of the economy depends on it in all parts of the country. We have a critical interest keeping the single market and enlarging it."

9 Dec 2011

Quote by deancannock
Do we want europe to regulate our City?
I am no expert, But I think not

problem is Europe is still going to impose the tax levy.....its just that we won't be part of the decision process now. In reality we are inbetween a rock and a hard place. We don't want to agree to it, but equally by standing aside we are letting them do it anyway....just without us !!
Tends to feel like we are Man Utd of the EU. We have crashed out of the main event, where we rightly belong....and now have to compete in a lower level. And like man Utd..in reality it is of our own doing.
Begs the question really.....as we are now on the sidelines....would we actually be better totally out of it. EU contries at the top table..and we at the small table with our new friends Hungary !!!
I'm sure that tax levy can't now be implemented in the UK due to the fact we vetoed the treaty it can still be levied on British companies registered and trading in European tax havens.
so maybe Cameron is edging his bets to attract financial companies flooding to the UK and paying onto the UK tax system
if this latest project by the mad maid of germay and the her french fancy fails like every other one of their hair brained ideas ,its gonna fail in a big way taking all those who wanted to be one of the gang with it
i for one think Brussels have more than enough control over what we eat, fish and spend already without adding to our already overburdened tax system in order to bail out their own failings

9 Dec 2011

I look at our parliament and those in it, and I see a group of people with whom the only thing I have in common is language.I look at our neighbours in Europe (mainly northern Europe) and I see more equal societies,I see societies where the common man appears to have a voice that is heard,where government appears to be for the benefit of all in that country ... bring on a federal Europe I say,the sooner the better

9 Dec 2011

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
I look at our parliament and those in it, and I see a group of people with whom the only thing I have in common is language.I look at our neighbours in Europe (mainly northern Europe) and I see more equal societies,I see societies where the common man appears to have a voice that is heard,where government appears to be for the benefit of all in that country ... bring on a federal Europe I say,the sooner the better

deluded. bloody deluded.:doh:
if you like that kind of europe why dont you bugger off there dunno

i can always sub you the one way ticket. rotflmao

10 Dec 2011

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
I look at our parliament and those in it, and I see a group of people with whom the only thing I have in common is language.I look at our neighbours in Europe (mainly northern Europe) and I see more equal societies,I see societies where the common man appears to have a voice that is heard,where government appears to be for the benefit of all in that country ... bring on a federal Europe I say,the sooner the better

Europe already has a federal state - it's called the European Commission which is populated by unelected, unaccountable people.
You sometimes need to be careful about what you wish for Staggs. Your political view points are legendary in these forums.
You might wish to consider the Federal Soviet State rather than the Federal European one wink

At least they hold elections in the Federal Soviet States (albeit corrupt, allegedly) but you can't vote to elect people of the Sovereign European States to the obesely corrupt European Commission.

Quote by star
if you like that kind of europe why dont you bugger off there.
can always sub you the one way ticket.

Wouldn't be of any benefit star. He could still access his SH account from there whilst it might be more difficult from vast wastelands of Siberia :lol2:

10 Dec 2011

Quote by GnV
I look at our parliament and those in it, and I see a group of people with whom the only thing I have in common is language.I look at our neighbours in Europe (mainly northern Europe) and I see more equal societies,I see societies where the common man appears to have a voice that is heard,where government appears to be for the benefit of all in that country ... bring on a federal Europe I say,the sooner the better

Europe already has a federal state - it's called the European Commission which is populated by unelected, unaccountable people.
You sometimes need to be careful about what you wish for Staggs. Your political view points are legendary in these forums.
You might wish to consider the Federal Soviet State rather than the Federal European one wink

At least they hold elections in the Federal Soviet States (albeit corrupt, allegedly) but you can't vote to elect people of the Sovereign European States to the obesely corrupt European Commission.

Quote by star
if you like that kind of europe why dont you bugger off there.
can always sub you the one way ticket.

Wouldn't be of any benefit star. He could still access his SH account from there whilst it might be more difficult from vast wastelands of Siberia :lol2:
mores the pity gnv.
if this was a company that had shareholders, with the amount of truble he ( that is mr staggers )dont want anyone getting confused as to who I could meen, would be a majority shareholder. as for the life of me i cannot see how he is stil allowed on here when i have been told many other members far less offensive than this person have been banned.
sorry but some peeple are foul mouthed nasty hypocrits and that is just where i work.:notes: