Can You Persuade A Gay Man

27 Jan 2005

Quote by cool4catz
Personally I doubt that a person's true sexuality ever really changes - more likely that they don't always know until well into adulthood, usually down to conditioning/expectations. I have no evidence of that, just my gut feeling.

Like I said, I'm not sure. The first problem is, what defines a person's "true" sexuality. Is it what they were born with, before social conditioning forces them to be one thing or another? Are we all born 50/50, but learn to go one way or the other depending on whether we grow up accepting society's norms or rejecting them? Or, as tradition would have it, are some born straight and some gay, but a subset of those learn to move along the "scale" to a greater or lesser degree? How will we ever know? Should I have gone to bed an hour ago? I think I can answer that last one, not sure about the others.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm assuming that my sexuality is innate because I'm not aware of it having changed at any time during my life. If it ever does seem to change, I'll probably just assume there was an aspect to my character that I wasn't previously aware of. dunno

WRT social conditioning, I think that can influence our behaviour, but not our actual nature. Again, this is only unsupported conjecture on my part.
Ice

27 Jan 2005

My best friend from work is also a gay man,you have more chance of shagging the pope than a gay man..sorry huni.

27 Jan 2005

Quote by Scandal
WRT social conditioning, I think that can influence our behaviour, but not our actual nature. Again, this is only unsupported conjecture on my part.
Ice

So Ice are you saying that sexuality is our actual nature, genetic, determined at birth (or before) and will not change?
How would you define which aspects of us are nature or behaviour?

You rang?! :mrgreen:
Venusxxx

27 Jan 2005

Ah but anyone can (if they are willing) change their behaviour to fit into an environment where they will then be more readily accepted. Easier for women to perform and change behaviour I imagine than men though hightened excitement, thrill factor etc I would imagine could play a part in that direction wink

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I have always been aware of my own sexuality and would not change my behaviour to suit any situation. I am sure that some people who go to parties and end up with the same sex dont go in thinking - right I am going to come out of here gay either :shock: :shock:
If it ever happened with a woman I would be really shocked not because I dont find women attractive but because I just really like men ................ I think lol

:lol: :lol:
Oh and persaude a gay guy why?????????
Sure I am just talking bolloks here so will go out now ..............................................

27 Jan 2005

Quote by corriefem
Ah but anyone can (if they are willing) change their behaviour to fit into an environment where they will then be more readily accepted. Easier for women to perform and change behaviour I imagine than men though hightened excitement, thrill factor etc I would imagine could play a part in that direction .

I suppose you would have to ask whether that change in behaviour is possible unless a person is tapping into something which has always been there but has been unexplored until that point......
It`s the nature vrs nurture debate. Good luck with that one people! :crazy: :wink:
Venusxxx

27 Jan 2005

Quote by Silk and Big G
I have friend who is six feet three . Do think if I ask him really nicely he'll get shorter ?

If that's silk writing, will getting down on my knees do? (OK, I'm not your friend but I have an extra inch to shorten).

27 Jan 2005

In my case I have always been bi but circumstances, social conditioning and the lack of opportunity to openly admit to it held me back. I had a crush on a girl at school when I was 14 so I know that it's always been lurking. The biggest knock back was a few years ago when I told a bi friend that I thought I was bi too. She laughed and said 'it's one of those things we all go through phases blah blah blah' and brushed it off just like that. So I never dared say anything for a long time after that.
It came to the fore again when I was with my ex bf and we were both fantasising about having another woman with us while we had sex, I went into great detail what I would do with her, it all came spilling out. Then I discovered SH and realised quite quickly that I wasn't odd really, I just needed to find the right people to 'come out' to. Now I don't give a flying fig who knows, this is me yippee! biggrin

27 Jan 2005

I am really interested in sexual identity and have studied some of the historical developments in understanding gender and sexuality. The common assumption people make is that sexuality is bound up in gender, whch isn't a 'real' or absolutel thing anyway. So to say 'male and female sides' doesn't really mean anything. We've come to think in oppositional wyas, like that the genders are opposite or that straight and gay are opposite, which we've made up really. And this leaves no room for bisexuality because it makes it impossible conceptually.
So... I believe sexuality to be fluid. I guess generally straight people will stick to straight even if they do have same sex fantasy, unless it is too strong to ignore. I wil argue with Judy, that it is very common for women to actually change orientation entirely in older age, a common phenomenon is for women to 'realise' very late on that they are actually lesbian. But if they weren't before, are they now, and will they always be? No answers.
It may be that gay people will have sex with the other sex (and they do!). But it's up to them what they understand it to mean. And you can't 'persuade' some one just because you've got the appropraite bits. Like with anyone, there has to be some chemistry for these anomalies to happen, surely?
I think orientation is a mixture of 'born that way' (I certainly was) plus current societal norms. Many people simply don't know there's an alternative to the traditional 'married with kids' monogomous set up.

27 Jan 2005

Quote by Scandal
WRT social conditioning, I think that can influence our behaviour, but not our actual nature. Again, this is only unsupported conjecture on my part.
Ice

Quote by Ice Pie
Again, this is only unsupported conjecture on my part.

If I were a geneticist, I would have offered my views as fact, not conjecture.
What I have said is that I think sexuality is innate. I haven't offered any evidence to support this view and I don't claim to have any. I did not say that conditioned behaviour departing from the innate has a label on it saying "This is conditioned behaviour". What I did say is that people can discover elements of their nature which they weren't previously aware of. I implied that those elements may have been suppressed by conditioning. So I can't give you the definition you ask for; it could be anything. Any point on the line that Judy talked about could be innate, and any behaviour relating to that point could be suppressed, and any behaviour somewhere else on the line could be enforced by external influences.

27 Jan 2005

Quote by JudyTV
I was just wondering, one of my best friend's is gay....and I would seriously love to have sex with him......I HAVE asked him but his usual response is 'Ewww that's gross' LoL.....I've even offered him my arse......
My question is, do you think you could persuade a gay man (or a lesbian, for the men) to have sex? And if so, how?
DISCLAIMER: I'm not trying to say that if someone is gay that they're deluded or need to be 'turned' to the other side.....it's just a simple question.

living in a dream world WAKE UP! :shock:
Why do you say that so definately?...........Although its unlikely if he is 100% gay, It isn't completely out of the question, some gay men do have sex with females. You can only be adamant if you are completely Gay yourself. So, are you?
Judy
rolleyes

feel my talent is wasted sometimes living in dream world wake up- dreamer helen as in asleep as in dream world- asin wake up, got nothing to do with thread just seemed amusing to me :roll:
standard disclaimer no offence meant or taken wink

27 Jan 2005

Quote by johnneuk1
feel my talent is wasted sometimes living in dream world wake up- dreamer helen as in asleep as in dream world- asin wake up, got nothing to do with thread just seemed amusing to me :roll:
standard disclaimer no offence meant or taken

I goddit.
So said talent is not 100% wasted. Mind you, I'm not 100%.

27 Jan 2005

cheers vix look 100% to me passionkiss