I read an article/blog/postng yesterday (forgot to keep link so you could read it) on a msg board about a group in the USA who claim to be Christian Swingers.
There was a reply to this stating
But surely the "rules" or laws of Christianity forbib such activity.
Im not very religious so it's hard for me to form an opinion.
Is it possible to be a Christian and a swinger?
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Christian Swingers
Quote by xrusman
But surely the "rules" or laws of Christianity forbib such activity.
Speaking as a non-Christian, Christians seem to have spent the last two thousand years merrily breaking their own rules so I don't see why they'd stop now. I know number 7 is "Thou shalt not commit adultery" but judging by the pervading Christian attitude regarding Number 6 (Thou shalt not kill) then I can only assume that these are more guidelines than actual rules.
By the way did you hear that the Co-Op has closed Christian Voice's account on grounds of them being fundamentalists...think I might have to open a co-op account now! Good on em!
By the way..yes I do consider myself religious but absolutely not Religious.
HertsGuy30s
Quote by xrusman
I read an article/blog/postng yesterday (forgot to keep link so you could read it) on a msg board about a group in the USA who claim to be Christian Swingers.
There was a reply to this stating
But surely the "rules" or laws of Christianity forbib such activity.
Im not very religious so it's hard for me to form an opinion.
Is it possible to be a Christian and a swinger?
As always with any religion, it seems you can read whatever you wish into you personal "delusion of choice"....
A quick google search on religion and polygamy would probably result in loads of pages for and against the subject. Certain books in the Old Testament mention the Big Boss telling someone to go take another wife.. Islam allows polygamy... Maybe it's only the later, more organized official state religions that have turned their backs on a more open form of sexuality and freedom. Though I can't be bothered to go into why they have done that...
So, maybe Christianity and swinging isn't too unusual..... though personally, I think anyone who believes in any of that religious stuff.... should keep it private and between consenting adults, in private , behind closed doors..... yikes...
Sex God
Bless em
Funny thing religion.. brings out all sorts of opinions. As a former theologian student, I studied several different religions but one thing that remained constant was that the reason we now have so many different religions is that someone did not like the rules of their current one.
Example why do you have the Church of England - because divorce was not permitted under catholic law. Formed by King Henry VIII.
Almost all of todays religions have stemmed from Judaism and if you look you can several ties to it.
Now back to the orginal post question. As to religious swingers well they are out there, bible thumping, door knocking, cross bearers that in the dark recesses of their lives, long and yearn for additional personal contact. As to polygamy, it is actually stated in the Bible that it is permitted. Jewish law has similiar rules. Now before anyone actually gets upset - go read Deutronomy 17:17 and beyond. Later rules actually stipulated that KINGS were only allowed 18 wives whereas the common man was limited to four. This can be found in the Talmud (Jewish bible) as well as the King James version.
As of the Old Testament is a vital part of the Christian faith, it cannot be disregarded in this discussion. It was concerning the Old Testament laws and the Old Testament Prophets that Jesus said plainly that he came not to destroy the Law or the Prophets but rather to fulfil. In addition, there is no passage in the New Testament that clearly prohibits polygamy. This was the understanding of the early Church Fathers and for several centuries in the Christian era."
"Considering that monogamy prevailed as the only legitimate form of marriage in Greece and Rome, it cannot be said that Christianity introduced obligatory monogamy in the Western World. Indeed, although the New Testament assumes monogamy as the normal or ideal form of marriage, it does not expressly prohibit monogamy, expect in the case of a bishop and a deacon. It has been argued that it was not necessary for the first Christian teachers to condemn polygamy because monogamy was the universal rule among peoples whose midst it was preached; but this is certainly not true of the Jews, who still both permitted and practiced polygamy at the beginning of the Christian era."
"Some of the Fathers accused the Jewish Rabbis of sensuality, but no Council of the Church in the earliest centuries opposed polygamy, and no onstacle was put in the way of its practise by kings in countries where it had occurred in the times of paganism. In the middle of the sixth century Diarmait, King of Ireland, had two queens and two concubines. Polygamy was frequently practised by the Merovingian kings. Charles the Great had two wives and many concubines; and one of his laws seems to imply that polygamy was not unknown even among priests. In later times Philip of Hesse and Frederick William II of Prussia contracted bigamous marriages with the sanction of the Lutheran clergy, Luther himself approved of the bigamy with considerable tolerations. It had not been forbidden by God; even Abraham, who was “perfect Christian,†had two wives. It is true that God had allowed such marriages to certain men of the Old Testament only in particular circumstances, and if a Christian wanted to follow their example he had to show that the circumstances were similar in his case; but polygamy was undoubtedly preferable to divorce. In 1650, soon after the Peace of Westphalia, when the population had been greatly reduced by the Thirty Years’ War, the Frankish Kreistag at Nuremberg passed the resolution that thenceforth every man should be allowed to marry two women. Certain sects of Christians have even advocated polygamy with much fervor. In 1531 the Anabaptists openly preached at Munster that he who wants to be a true Christian must have several wives. And the Mormons as all the world knows, regard polygamy as a divine institution."
<steps off the pulpit>
:crazy:
Ok sermon over.. who wants to shag? :happy: :happy: :happy: :happy:
Example why do you have the Church of England - because divorce was not permitted under catholic law. Formed by King Henry VIII.
Almost all of todays religions have stemmed from Judaism and if you look you can several ties to it.
Now back to the orginal post question. As to religious swingers well they are out there, bible thumping, door knocking, cross bearers that in the dark recesses of their lives, long and yearn for additional personal contact. As to polygamy, it is actually stated in the Bible that it is permitted. Jewish law has similiar rules. Now before anyone actually gets upset - go read Deutronomy 17:17 and beyond. Later rules actually stipulated that KINGS were only allowed 18 wives whereas the common man was limited to four. This can be found in the Talmud (Jewish bible) as well as the King James version.
As of the Old Testament is a vital part of the Christian faith, it cannot be disregarded in this discussion. It was concerning the Old Testament laws and the Old Testament Prophets that Jesus said plainly that he came not to destroy the Law or the Prophets but rather to fulfil. In addition, there is no passage in the New Testament that clearly prohibits polygamy. This was the understanding of the early Church Fathers and for several centuries in the Christian era."
"Considering that monogamy prevailed as the only legitimate form of marriage in Greece and Rome, it cannot be said that Christianity introduced obligatory monogamy in the Western World. Indeed, although the New Testament assumes monogamy as the normal or ideal form of marriage, it does not expressly prohibit monogamy, expect in the case of a bishop and a deacon. It has been argued that it was not necessary for the first Christian teachers to condemn polygamy because monogamy was the universal rule among peoples whose midst it was preached; but this is certainly not true of the Jews, who still both permitted and practiced polygamy at the beginning of the Christian era."
"Some of the Fathers accused the Jewish Rabbis of sensuality, but no Council of the Church in the earliest centuries opposed polygamy, and no onstacle was put in the way of its practise by kings in countries where it had occurred in the times of paganism. In the middle of the sixth century Diarmait, King of Ireland, had two queens and two concubines. Polygamy was frequently practised by the Merovingian kings. Charles the Great had two wives and many concubines; and one of his laws seems to imply that polygamy was not unknown even among priests. In later times Philip of Hesse and Frederick William II of Prussia contracted bigamous marriages with the sanction of the Lutheran clergy, Luther himself approved of the bigamy with considerable tolerations. It had not been forbidden by God; even Abraham, who was “perfect Christian,†had two wives. It is true that God had allowed such marriages to certain men of the Old Testament only in particular circumstances, and if a Christian wanted to follow their example he had to show that the circumstances were similar in his case; but polygamy was undoubtedly preferable to divorce. In 1650, soon after the Peace of Westphalia, when the population had been greatly reduced by the Thirty Years’ War, the Frankish Kreistag at Nuremberg passed the resolution that thenceforth every man should be allowed to marry two women. Certain sects of Christians have even advocated polygamy with much fervor. In 1531 the Anabaptists openly preached at Munster that he who wants to be a true Christian must have several wives. And the Mormons as all the world knows, regard polygamy as a divine institution."
<steps off the pulpit>
:crazy:
Ok sermon over.. who wants to shag? :happy: :happy: :happy: :happy:
Sex God
Quote by hertsguy30s
But surely the "rules" or laws of Christianity forbib such activity.
Speaking as a non-Christian, Christians seem to have spent the last two thousand years merrily breaking their own rules so I don't see why they'd stop now.
Kinda a sweeping statement dont you think?
Its impossible to be a part of any Christian religion and 'not break any rules'. It comes down to being human. The question is why you broke them and if you are prepared to rectify the situation.
S
whatta topic
to me the basic christian any religion theme is be kind to others....and try to lead a good life were you dont upset others.....
..the 10 commandments well most were man made to enforce us uncontrolable peasants
i agree with most except the turn the other cheek one...........slap me and you ll end up in hospital
to me the basic christian any religion theme is be kind to others....and try to lead a good life were you dont upset others.....
..the 10 commandments well most were man made to enforce us uncontrolable peasants
i agree with most except the turn the other cheek one...........slap me and you ll end up in hospital
Sex God
Quote by xrusman
Is it possible to be a Christian and a swinger?
As with much of religion, I think this is largely down to personal interpretation. The Christian "rules" on extramarital sex are really quite vague. Certainly "adultery" is forbidden, but there's no real clear definition of what that is AFAIK. Married Christians promse to be faithful to each other, and the liberal interpretation of that is don't go behind your partner's back, which leaves the door open for all sorts of mutual participation with other people. There don't seem to be any restrictions at all on unmarried Christians.
There is a lot of info following the link that Mark posted and I'm nowhere near through it all but I have found something I find troublesome.
This is from their site.
"Encourage your children to explore their developing sexuality responsibly, in ways that are voluntary, consensual, and harmless for every participant."
On first reading I thought good sense then I became concerned re the last part.
" in ways that are voluntary, consensual, and harmless for every participant"
I believe this to be treading on dangerous ground, I fear that this can be interpruted as giving license to commit abusive acts.
This is from their site.
"Encourage your children to explore their developing sexuality responsibly, in ways that are voluntary, consensual, and harmless for every participant."
On first reading I thought good sense then I became concerned re the last part.
" in ways that are voluntary, consensual, and harmless for every participant"
I believe this to be treading on dangerous ground, I fear that this can be interpruted as giving license to commit abusive acts.
Sex God
Quote by xrusman
There is a lot of info following the link that Mark posted and I'm nowhere near through it all but I have found something I find troublesome.
This is from their site.
"Encourage your children to explore their developing sexuality responsibly, in ways that are voluntary, consensual, and harmless for every participant."
On first reading I thought good sense then I became concerned re the last part.
" in ways that are voluntary, consensual, and harmless for every participant"
I believe this to be treading on dangerous ground, I fear that this can be interpruted as giving license to commit abusive acts.
would it not be a good idea to mention that fact on 'their' site and see what the response is?
Quote by northwest-cpl
Almost all of todays religions have stemmed from Judaism
I'm not so sure that Buddhists, Hindus, Shintoists (sp), Confucians (sp), Taoists or animists would agree with you?
Hence the post of ALMOST. In the big scheme of things out of the increasing number of religions, ALMOST all of them are christian related - but not all.
:notes: I do cover my arse in my comments/posts so that I dont end up TALKING out of it. :moon: :notes:
Now if you wish some friendly repartee'
Lets go :sparring:**Walks to the cupboard for a can of WHOOPASS**.... don't make me open this. :giggle: :giggle: :giggle:
:smackbottom: :smackbottom: :smackbottom: :smackbottom: :smackbottom: :smackbottom: Quote by Happy Cats
**Walks to the cupboard for a can of WHOOPASS**.... don't make me open this. :giggle: :giggle: :giggle:
Cant find it?
Here you are -
Being a -wots the UK term - YANK and all.. but thanks for the offer... Next time i am out I will be sure to come by and borrow that cup of sugar....
Quote by CiscoCat6k
Almost all of todays religions have stemmed from Judaism
I'm not so sure that Buddhists, Hindus, Shintoists (sp), Confucians (sp), Taoists or animists would agree with you?
Hence the post of ALMOST. In the big scheme of things out of the increasing number of religions, ALMOST all of them are christian related - but not all.
:notes: I do cover my arse in my comments/posts so that I dont end up TALKING out of it. :moon: :notes:
Now if you wish some friendly repartee'
Lets go :sparring:**Walks to the cupboard for a can of WHOOPASS**.... don't make me open this. :giggle: :giggle: :giggle:
I don't want you to waste your can on me
but that's a bit like saying a 5.5" cock is almost 10".I've no way of knowing how kosher the site is but this pie chart is illuminating.
While Christians, Muslims and Jews do seem to be in the majority, they only make up just over half (55%) of the world's population. Even allowing for the non-religious group almost all is still a bit off.
Quote by northwest-cpl
Almost all of todays religions have stemmed from Judaism
I'm not so sure that Buddhists, Hindus, Shintoists (sp), Confucians (sp), Taoists or animists would agree with you?
Hence the post of ALMOST. In the big scheme of things out of the increasing number of religions, ALMOST all of them are christian related - but not all.
:notes: I do cover my arse in my comments/posts so that I dont end up TALKING out of it. :moon: :notes:
Now if you wish some friendly repartee'
Lets go :sparring:**Walks to the cupboard for a can of WHOOPASS**.... don't make me open this. :giggle: :giggle: :giggle:
I don't want you to waste your can on me
but that's a bit like saying a 5.5" cock is almost 10".I've no way of knowing how kosher the site is but this pie chart is illuminating.
While Christians, Muslims and Jews do seem to be in the majority, they only make up just over half (55%) of the world's population. Even allowing for the non-religious group almost all is still a bit off.
:laughabove: :laughabove: :laughabove: :laughabove: :laughabove: :laughabove: :laughabove: :laughabove:
Quote by Silk and Big G
But surely the "rules" or laws of Christianity forbib such activity.
Speaking as a non-Christian, Christians seem to have spent the last two thousand years merrily breaking their own rules so I don't see why they'd stop now.
Kinda a sweeping statement dont you think?
Its impossible to be a part of any Christian religion and 'not break any rules'. It comes down to being human. The question is why you broke them and if you are prepared to rectify the situation.
S
Silk - yes it is a sweeping statement but then so are all the 10 commandments! The odd thing about these is that the first 4 are all about how great and fab god is, 5 is god getting grumpy, presumably from being irritated by his kiddies Adam and Eve, 6 - 9 are global truths more or less followed by all living things and 10 is drivel...my neighbour hasn't even got a donkey!
Sorry I'll stop before my ear wax starts melting...
Actually one late addition, the one thing i absolutely agree with is "do unto others as you would have done unto you". I think that phrase should be drummed into all school kids and the practice of it would make the world a much nicer place. (Aaaahhhhh)
Ooo yes and don't get me started on "The question is why you broke them and if you are prepared to rectify the situation." - ask a Catholic about this? Murder someone, 25 Hail Marys... ooo that makes me mad!
HertsGuy30s
Sex God
Quote by hertsguy30s
Ooo yes and don't get me started on "The question is why you broke them and if you are prepared to rectify the situation." - ask a Catholic about this? Murder someone, 25 Hail Marys... ooo that makes me mad!
HertsGuy30s
You know what? Im finding you highly fucking offensive. I'm not ashamed to admit I was baptised Catholic and when I was 20, attended RCIA classes to receive first communion and confirmation. I am proud to say that I have faith and go about it in my own way. I dont force it down people's throats and its something very personal to myself. Im a good person and treat others with respect.
I wouldn't think that I could go to reconciliation because I've killed someone!!!! Why do you insist on making people out who chose to believe in a certain religion like they are heartless pricks??!!!
Sex God
Quote by oliveoyl
i am with silk and big on this one I was just trying to work out how to say the same thing.
We have a faith too and how we reconcile our faith and swinging is our business alone,
but I would NEVER shove my faith down other peolpes throat,
for silk and big g
Thank you for you're support Olivexxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Im so angry at the moment!!! Its not that I don't believe its everyone's right to have an opinion, but what he said has offended me.
I have Faith and I also respect the laws that govern us. I don't walk around thinking Im above anyone else. I certainly wouldn't commit such any offence in the knowledge that I can get away with it because of my faith, just as millions of people who don't participate in any religion.
Ah, but what the fuck do I know?? I'm a Christian. You'll have to excuse me now, Im off to drown some kittens.
What do they say about not talking about politics and religion 
For what its worth all religions have been pretty represive on the sexual front. Which is why a lot of religious people become so fucked up. Denying a natural urge is very unhealthy. I agree that a persons faith is a personal matter and should be kept that way or else I might waffle on about the catholic churches slaughter of heretics in medieval France 
For what its worth all religions have been pretty represive on the sexual front. Which is why a lot of religious people become so fucked up. Denying a natural urge is very unhealthy. I agree that a persons faith is a personal matter and should be kept that way or else I might waffle on about the catholic churches slaughter of heretics in medieval France Sex God
Quote by seagull69
What do they say about not talking about politics and religion
Its only his sweeping statements I was forced to take personally. Sorry.
Quote by Silk and Big G
What do they say about not talking about politics and religion
Its only his sweeping statements I was forced to take personally. Sorry.
No need to apologise :) Just thought an interesting thread was just about to turn nasty
Peace and Love
Quote by seagull69
What do they say about not talking about politics and religion
sorry but as a practicioner of the old norse faith (odinism to some) I will have to disagree with that sweeping statement about all religions,as with a lot of 'pagan' beliefs sexuality is something that is respected enjoyed and rejoiced in,and before you start saying it's not a real religion/recognised belief you might want to check out pagans for progress,the pressure group(which I am proud to belong to)to find out just how close we are to being legally recognisedI am not a christian but I know some really nice christians and people of other faithsand after many discussions I have come to the same conclusion time and again,your beliefs are exactly that 'Yours' enjoy them for the joy and passion that they bring,,don't try and foist them onto others,don't treat others as lesser people just because their beliefs differ from yours,(you don't look down on people because they like different shoes,,do you) think to yourself 'if the percentages were the other way round would my beliefs be targeted as wrong,,and a message for all the radicals and fundamentalists(that is a big word for a sunday)remember he who shouts loudest doesn't necasserily win,sometimes he gets a bloody nose from his neighbour :)
rant over
Sexpert
ok i dont have much to add here as i think its allready been nailed down that religeon and sex are each persons own business , what i would like to comment one if this idea that a person who is strong on religionl who also swings is a hypocrite (ok so no-ones said that yet but thats how it reads)
well im coming from the side that hasnt been admited to im an agnostic and proud to be and yet i still follow the ten commandments yes even the thou shalt not take any god over me ..well i dont but he didnt say i had to follow him either hehe
onto the no adultary ..he said dont TAKE not dont make out with when her hubby says go for it :P
ok now ive rambled on for a little while i might add im going to back cisco on this one , as i know a lot of catholics and like all good agnostics i have great philisophical debates with the local priest even nearlly had him hanging up his cassock and anyone who thinks a catholic would dare ask for his penance before having paid thier dept is just wrong and at that the pennance is for the soul and thats all not to pay a debt to god but to settle your own guilt
heaysy
well im coming from the side that hasnt been admited to im an agnostic and proud to be and yet i still follow the ten commandments yes even the thou shalt not take any god over me ..well i dont but he didnt say i had to follow him either hehe
onto the no adultary ..he said dont TAKE not dont make out with when her hubby says go for it :P
ok now ive rambled on for a little while i might add im going to back cisco on this one , as i know a lot of catholics and like all good agnostics i have great philisophical debates with the local priest even nearlly had him hanging up his cassock and anyone who thinks a catholic would dare ask for his penance before having paid thier dept is just wrong and at that the pennance is for the soul and thats all not to pay a debt to god but to settle your own guilt
heaysy
