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Clarification needed - Munches - Should we pay!

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If anyone is interested in how we handled the Munch finances for the first Essex Munch, we posted a full breakdown here: http://www.swingingheaven.co.uk/swingers-forum/viewtopic/34033.html
We posted this partly to encourage people to run other Munches, by showing they can cover their costs, and partly to show that we didn't take a profit. We suggested a £3 contribution on the door, and nearly everyone paid it - some kind people were actually more generous than that.
We did a lot of research before deciding to pay the £150 fee for the room we chose, some local places we looked at wanted literally ten times as much, and as it turned out the one we picked did give us quite a hard sell on their buffet (payable in advance, at a head!), but judging by all the positive feedback about the venue, I think we made a good choice.
Perhaps the most worrying part of running the Munch was worrying about the number of people we'd actually get through the door on the night, and if we'd break even or not. Now we have a bit of experience under our belts, our next Munch should run even more smoothly! If anyone out there is considering running their first munch and wants the benefit of our (limited!) experience, please feel free to PM me.
Quote by MikeNorth
Hungry p, the attempted Teeside munch I was referring to was not the one you and I attended in December, but a previous attempt to organise one earlier last year, around May-June time

OK, noted.
Quote by Wishmaster
You've all missed my point completely. The question was not would I pay but should I pay. This is supposed to be a non-profit generating website, I've been to several munches b4 and I have not had to pay an entrance fee. I just want to know where it stops : £5, £10 .... £50????
What's the policy on charging entrance fees at munches?
Thanks Libra babes. I responded before reading your reply..

It isnt technically for profit then so YES you should pay, I think depending on what the costs were to set it up it should somehow be divided then that way everyone pays an equal share.
Would you be willing or able to fork out a few £100 for everyone else to enjoy themselves, yes it does sound all very nice and generous but unfair to the organiser.
Asylum seekers?? ffs hardly a fair comparison is it! Unless your fleeing to a munch for the sake of your life to a place where you might not get executed or see any more of your family killed etc!??? mad
I don't think people should pay to go to munches if it means someones making money out of us, but i think if its costing the person doing it money for the room, buffet etc then yes we should all chip in, if its a night for us all we all should pay 2wards it, to me thats still a none profit making site.
I am going to break with the general feeling here.
I hate being cajolled or being made to feel like I have to give something to someone when I will do it willingly on my own. Pass a bucket round and I'll throw some dosh in, but don't charge on the door, then pass a bucket round for the dj, then another bucket for charity, then do a raffle, then pass another bucket around for the room cost, then another bucket around for the door man........ it would get a bit much and I'd wonder what on earth the entrance fee had gone on dunno
If I am paying a charge on the door to get in I expect to be left alone unless I want to contribute. Emotional blackmail of "it's for charity" rubs me up the wrong way as I would probably give twice as much off my own back without the pressure.
Recouping room costs etc, fine, as long as profit is not made.
OK
Just to point out that I chose not to charge for my services at the Essex Munch I as will be the case at Essex Munch II. I was pleasantly surprised when I received the contents of the bucket (Thankfully changed up!!) As a professional DJ my charge for a gig like that would be 5-6 times over what I received....I'm not moaning!!!!!
My personal thoughts on wether to charge is that I don't see why the organiser should foot the whole bill, to be honest.....how many of us out there can spare that kind of cash out of their weekly/monthly paycheck?? £3 or less seems an insignificant amount to pay and at least you are informed of that before you put your name down. Its the old adage, you don't wanna pay then don't go and don't bitch about it when you're not going anyway!!!!
Alex DJ
OK
So did we resolve this issue!?!?!?
Alex DJ
This is a tricky one to answer..
on one side. i'm for the charge. but on another i'm against it.
I can understand the agreement for putting a charge on. casue it can be expeive to hold a munch. the venue, the time it takes to organinse. etc.. but the problem with this is that there are a few people in this world (not saying it is any of the organisers of the munches so far so please dont think that is what i'm saying). that will see this as a way of exploiting SH. and it has been done in the past.. not with munches but with users advertising parties to plug swinging clubs.
as people who know me, i will always dig deep when needed to. (i seemed to be one of the few that was bidding in the Leics munch) but sometimes its not nice to have the pressure of having to give to charity. if i'm walking through Birmingham City centre early in the morning. i always get collered by the homeless. purely because i know for a fact i'll feel bad if i walk pass with out giving. same can be said for having to give here.
When I first read the posting for the said munch I had to double check the amount as I thought :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: only £3 entrance fee cheap night out amongst the best crowd you could find yourself.
I am on reserve list at the moment :cry: but with agreat deal of worship "grovelling" :worship: hope to be upgraded, so I can put faces to all the avators and nicks that I've been talking to.
Look forward to a great night! cool
Yes, Denise has hit the nail on the head here. The rule is very simple, munch organisers cannot make a profit.
It's impossible to tell in advance exactly how many people will actually turn up, which means you can't just divide the costs by the number of people - and if you did, can you imagine the time it would take to give the right change for a charge of (and .435 of a penny)? A charitable donation is the only way to balance the books and not make a profit.
Personally I think "charging" at the door is a better option to passing a "plate" around for donations. It ensures a feeling of fairness and avoids a bit of embrassment if the "plate" is passed to you twice. No offence to Clare and Steve, but I ended up contributing to the Notts munch three times becuase I was too shy to say I had already done so redface
Having said that - no-one should feel "pressurised" to then contributing to the charity if they don't want to. I happened to miss the raffle at the raffle at the Essex munch purely becuase I was flitting around so much I didn't even know raffle tickets were being sold!
All munch organisers know that they can't make a profit and I, for one, trust that that is the case. And i think that all munch organisers so far have done a fine job in reporting back the "profit" and the charity it went to.
Sorry - just my tuppence worth confused
Rsxx :color:
Quote by Rainbows
I happened to miss the raffle at the raffle at the Essex munch purely becuase I was flitting around so much I didn't even know raffle tickets were being sold!
Rsxx :color:

Thanks for reminding me Rainbows, i won a ten-pound Anne Summers voucher in the raffle at the Essex munch - no idea what to buy with it yet though.... :P
Quote by MikeNorth
I happened to miss the raffle at the raffle at the Essex munch purely becuase I was flitting around so much I didn't even know raffle tickets were being sold!
Rsxx :color:

Thanks for reminding me Rainbows, i won a ten-pound Anne Summers voucher in the raffle at the Essex munch - no idea what to buy with it yet though.... :P
Oooh - did you HAVE to quote my typo thingy!!! redface surprisedops: I can't edit it now sad
lol :lol: :lol:
Quote by Rainbows
I happened to miss the raffle at the raffle at the Essex munch purely because I was flitting around so much I didn't even know raffle tickets were being sold!
Rsxx :color:

Thanks for reminding me Rainbows, i won a ten-pound Anne Summers voucher in the raffle at the Essex munch - no idea what to buy with it yet though.... :P
Oooh - did you HAVE to quote my typo thingy!!! redface surprisedops: I can't edit it now sad
lol :lol: :lol:
Corrected - no problemo sweetie :lol: you correct yours, and I've corrected mine.. :lol:
Doing anything costs money. I would expect to pay an entry fee, some kind of charity contribution, collections for a cause etc. Its all part of life.
I feel I have to step in here since I've been mentioned more than once.
The Teesside Social Meet that I organised in December was not called a Munch simply because did not want to bound up by the SH red tape that caused so much confusion when PJ and I attempted the original Teesside Munch back in the Summer.
At the time, as newbies, we were not recognised by the regs so basically every steop of the way, instead of recieving sound advice (with one or two expceptions) we were basically stamped on from the start.
The MUnch was to be held at a swingers hotel where people would be expected to pay for the cost of their hotel room but NOT to attend the Munch. So, if you wanted to come to the Munch but had somewhere else to stay then you wouldn't have to pay a thing. we did discuss the cost of hiring the place if no one wanted to stay, asking for donations for possible entertanment we ha in mind. None of this was set in stone but as usual the SH rumour mill took hold of the bare bones of it, ran away with it and like Chinese whispers, before we knew it, it has become something completely different to how it started out.
I received a PM asking me to explain exactly what was going on. I replied to this as best I could, offering every scrap of information I had at my disposal - still bearing in mind, nothing was actually arranged yet, it was all still in the planning phase - in the meantime, said mod locked the thread and didn't even respond to my PM.
Around the same time, a certain SH member announced plans for a party to be held in his home. The post immediately got 'stickied'. A case of if your fits? Or just shagging the right mod??
Now we have stickied events that are without a doubt charging a fee, parties held in clubs etc, etc. The Leics after party was on the Munch thread. It was to cost £10 entrance. Why should I as a single fem pay £10 to get in club when almost every other club lets me in for free?
Why hould I pay £3 for the Essex Munch? It wasn't a donation, it was compulsory. If you didn't pay, you didn't get a badge. I don't resent paying: I chipped in a tenner at one Munch. I don't think Munch organisers should have to pay for everything. It's just the way they go about asking for money that pees me off.
It's always been the same on here. It's all about who you are and what you are to other people.
Fuck it, I'm here now, I'm gonna rant as much as I want. Bring it on. Those of you that know me, know that I'm not afraid to say what I want. If this gets deleted then so what. It's what I think. If you don't like it, tough.
Just a quick correction, the £3 for the room hire at the Essex munch was not compulsory, and (if I recall correctly) 3 people didn't pay it, but still got their badges - two of them objected to having to pay, and one arrived well after 11pm, so I felt it would have been unfair to ask that one.
Just because you are gobby, Marya, it doesn't mean you are right. Whatever else you have put here I resent the implication of " Or just shagging the right mod?? "
If you have a point to make, say your specifics and back them up. No half truths, no rumour control - just hard facts. If you haven't got them, then put it down to experience and move on.
Mal
I've avoided this one so far - which is good going for me as I tend to end up in the middle of most of the contentious threads. wink
Firstly kiss for Marya - I don't think your opinions are out of place at all, I don't agree with all of them but see no reason why you shouldn't voice them. Personally I think sometimes everyone worries so much about not argueing that nothing ever really gets said on here.
I think the whole situation of Munches vs Parties including the whole business of club visits, after munch parties, pre-munch meetings etc is getting way too complicated. And also I agree that the status of these events depends to a certain extent on the status of the organiser not necessarily the particulars of the event. I think the term "Munch" has become to vague and that it really now means different things to different people, for instance there is one event stickied at the moment that requires a large fee to attend, there are also some events which are being called munches and seem to follow the rules but which aren't stickied.
Personally I am happy to attend which ever I events I fancy, get invites to and which I can get to, and provided no-one is making a personal profit from an event and any fees are clear in advance I have no problem with that.
I'm not sure what the answer is but I would like to see all the parties, munches etc. in a seperate place provided they confirm to the site AUP regardless of whether they meet the requirements of a "Munch". As long as all the details regarding type of venue, costs and expected behavior are available in advance I don't see a problem. At the moment the half a page of stickies clog up the LMU page and any parties that are smaller but not "munches" get lost on the later pages.
Roger the Dragon
cool
Quote by rogerthedragon
I'm not sure what the answer is but I would like to see all the parties, munches etc. in a seperate place provided they confirm to the site AUP regardless of whether they meet the requirements of a "Munch". As long as all the details regarding type of venue, costs and expected behavior are available in advance I don't see a problem. At the moment the half a page of stickies clog up the LMU page and any parties that are smaller but not "munches" get lost on the later pages.
Roger the Dragon
cool

This is currently under dscussion as we speak, Roger and will be aired shortly.
Mal
Quote by mal609

I'm not sure what the answer is but I would like to see all the parties, munches etc. in a seperate place provided they confirm to the site AUP regardless of whether they meet the requirements of a "Munch". As long as all the details regarding type of venue, costs and expected behavior are available in advance I don't see a problem. At the moment the half a page of stickies clog up the LMU page and any parties that are smaller but not "munches" get lost on the later pages.
Roger the Dragon
cool

This is currently under dscussion as we speak, Roger and will be aired shortly.
Mal
Cool 8-)
This is currently under dscussion as we speak, Roger and will be aired shortly.
Mal

Do you have your own chat forum Mal, for the mods?
Only being nosy lol
Have to agree with Steph,the £10 covered cost for buffet too!If i remember right most clubs charge single fems on party nights when food etc is laid on confused
Quote by freckledbird
This is currently under dscussion as we speak, Roger and will be aired shortly.
Mal

Do you have your own chat forum Mal, for the mods?
Only being nosy lol
Mark's issued us with baked bean tins and MILES of string!! Works well except when it's raining cos then the string goes soggy and doesn't transmit as well as it should.
:P
Quote by Jags
This is currently under dscussion as we speak, Roger and will be aired shortly.
Mal

Do you have your own chat forum Mal, for the mods?
Only being nosy lol
Mark's issued us with baked bean tins and MILES of string!! Works well except when it's raining cos then the string goes soggy and doesn't transmit as well as it should.
:P
who had to eat all the beans first???????? :shock:
no bloody wonder the mods forum stinks!!!! biggrin
My thoughts if anyone would like to read them? The thread seems to have started wandering as per usual and I can see some peeps getting a little het up with each other.
If I went to a much and it cost me £10 for instance, would gladly pay it, its simple because it saves me having to arrange one.
And as to the original post....£3 ? FOR GODS SAKE MAN, PAY IT, its only enough to get you one decent drink in a pub, what the hell is wrong with some people.
Rant Over!!!
Hmmm seems I managed to upset you all again. Getting ghood aren't I?
OK, so I apologise for typing before thinking.
I was actually making references in relation to my own experiences not making personal digs. Steph - the Munch was brilliant and yes, your comments about the club are fair but the fact remains, that the rules about these events have changed over the months since I've been on the site.
I'm not saying it's wrong or right just a fact. I think it's not unreasonable for anyone to express their opinions and for anyone to respond to that either.
Mal, as far finding ecidence etc, can I be arsed? Can you? No. We both know the score. I'm not looking to argue with you. For one thing, I know I won't win and two, I haven't got a handbag. (Joke ffs!)
I don't think I'm right all the time and I don't even resent the 'gobby' comment. It's proved beneficial to me in the past.
Admittedly, my "shagging the mods" comment was flippant and a bit daft but its' the type of thing everyone says and it was said to me by more than one person at the time that party was stickied - and a mod was one who said it!
That's just the same as the rumour mill and chinese whispers that have gone around the site about me in the past.
I'm not spitting my dummy out over this but I am dropping it now.
BTW - just got this PM
Naughty Naughty Girl.
Did you go accusing the some of the Mods of not being impartial?
Good on you for speaking your mind, I don't agree with everything you say but it is always nice to see real opinions rather than sanitised drivel.

Hmmmmmmmmmm! rolleyes
Quote by rh2
My thoughts if anyone would like to read them? The thread seems to have started wandering as per usual and I can see some peeps getting a little het up with each other.
If I went to a much and it cost me £10 for instance, would gladly pay it, its simple because it saves me having to arrange one.
And as to the original post....£3 ? FOR GODS SAKE MAN, PAY IT, its only enough to get you one decent drink in a pub, what the hell is wrong with some people.
Rant Over!!!

I don't think the actual amount was ever the issue. I think some people were under the impression that munch organisers might be making a profit, whereas I believe they have only ever wished to recoup their expenses, which I think is perfectly reasonable.
Shit, I can't leave this alone. I think I'm turing into Neilinleeds!
Quote by rh2
If I went to a much and it cost me £10 for instance, would gladly pay it, its simple because it saves me having to arrange one.
And as to the original post....£3 ? FOR GODS SAKE MAN, PAY IT, its only enough to get you one decent drink in a pub, what the hell is wrong with some people.
Rant Over!!!

I think the point Wishmaster was trying to make is not that he resents paying £3, £10 or whatever, he wanted to know the etiquette for asking for 'donations' or 'fee'.
At one time,. it seemed that you couldn't mention money at all, now it seems it's perfectly acceptable to ask for money.
Now can someone direct me to a nicer thread?
edit: And another thing ....... (I'm going after this, I promise!)
I wish to offer my sincere apologies for suggesting that any of the mods would show any favouritism for Stickies, Munches etc by people they've shagged. Sorry, sorry, sorry. It was just a throw away comment!