I hope I'm not alone in having seen this programme last night. Any of you who did, will no doubt have looked like this- :shock:
The basic jist was that Louis Theroux spent some time with the Phelps family, members of the 71 strong Westboro Baptist Church,Topeka, Kansas. Im not sure I can do justice to just how warped these people are, so I'll send you here- for an overview (scroll down past Jimmy Saville)
If it's repeated, it really is worth watching. If you've already seen it, or encountered the Phelps some other way, my question is this.
Is it fair that these, or other groups should be allowed to use their young children in this way? I am of course, referring to the 7 year old girl holding a sign saying "Fag Troops" who had no idea what the sign meant. It's difficult to condemn their group outright, without seeming like a bigot myself- however, the kids being used in this way (and in my delicately put humble opinion, brainwashed) surely cannot be right?
In the words of Dammie- post and be damned. Whoops, I forgot. According to the Westboro Baptist Church, we already are anyway. The only people going to heaven are it's 71 members- hope they don't get bored!
NB, remember, this is not about religion- but would also apply to politics and pretty much any other banner waving activity.
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Louis Theroux meets the most hated family in America....
Yes I watched this last night! :shock: :shock: :shock:
I said to Mrs Kiss that I thought that the parents using their children in that way, making them attend picket lines etc is child abuse. It's a form of mental abuse being brain washed like that in such an extreme way.
There was so much about the entire set-up that made alarm bells ring - I could go on and on!
That programme was truly disturbing.
I said to Mrs Kiss that I thought that the parents using their children in that way, making them attend picket lines etc is child abuse. It's a form of mental abuse being brain washed like that in such an extreme way.
There was so much about the entire set-up that made alarm bells ring - I could go on and on!
That programme was truly disturbing.
I found the programme very interesting as it demonstrated, to me at least, how a group is able to renforce thier beliefs on each other through ritual behavior.
There are many other religous cults of course. One that springs to mind that we see in England (they are worldwide of course) is the one who calls door to door in small groups often on a Saturday. I won't mention thier name in case it is a breach of the AUP.
There are many other religous cults of course. One that springs to mind that we see in England (they are worldwide of course) is the one who calls door to door in small groups often on a Saturday. I won't mention thier name in case it is a breach of the AUP.
Quote by Liaisons
There are many other religous cults of course. One that springs to mind that we see in England (they are worldwide of course) is the one who calls door to door in small groups often on a Saturday. I won't mention thier name in case it is a breach of the AUP.
That is not a cult!
Quote by Kiss
There are many other religous cults of course. One that springs to mind that we see in England (they are worldwide of course) is the one who calls door to door in small groups often on a Saturday. I won't mention thier name in case it is a breach of the AUP.
That is not a cult!
Having known someone who was sucked into them in another country, I have always considered them a cult, and my observations of them in england has not changed my view.
Quote by Liaisons
There are many other religous cults of course. One that springs to mind that we see in England (they are worldwide of course) is the one who calls door to door in small groups often on a Saturday. I won't mention thier name in case it is a breach of the AUP.
That is not a cult!
Having known someone who was sucked into them in another country, I have always considered them a cult, and my observations of themin england has not changed my view.
That's better.
For me I agree with Liasons.
Anyone who comes and pushes their 'faith' down my neck on the doorstep is wrong.
If its that good, people would be queueing at their doorstep surely.
And sending out children to do their work for them is definitely not on. If not abuse then definitely exploitation. In my opinion all young children should be banned from demonstrations of any kind as they can't make a consentual decision about what they are doing.
DD
Anyone who comes and pushes their 'faith' down my neck on the doorstep is wrong.
If its that good, people would be queueing at their doorstep surely.
And sending out children to do their work for them is definitely not on. If not abuse then definitely exploitation. In my opinion all young children should be banned from demonstrations of any kind as they can't make a consentual decision about what they are doing.
DD
Quote by devondelight
For me I agree with Liasons.
Anyone who comes and pushes their 'faith' down my neck on the doorstep is wrong.
If its that good, people would be queueing at their doorstep surely.
And sending out children to do their work for them is definitely not on. If not abuse then definitely exploitation. In my opinion all young children should be banned from demonstrations of any kind as they can't make a consentual decision about what they are doing.
DD
Although I may not agree with going door to door etc to try and spread the 'word of God', a cult is considered to be a religious group that often live together who's views are considered to by extreme by the majority.
Yes the TV programme last night showed a cult, to whom Liasons is referring in not a cult.
(Even though this wasn't mean to be a discussion about religion.)
Yep I saw it and :shock: is a fair respresentation of my facial expression throughout the show.
I was increadibly disturbed by the activities the young children were exposed to - picketing a soldiers funeral with signs reading "Fag Army" and "God Hates Fags" is not my idea of a family outing.
The overall message seemed to be that hate rules and seeing teenagers smiling at the thought of people being killed and burning in hell shows they've been exposed to it for so long they're completely desensitised to it.
I was increadibly disturbed by the activities the young children were exposed to - picketing a soldiers funeral with signs reading "Fag Army" and "God Hates Fags" is not my idea of a family outing.
The overall message seemed to be that hate rules and seeing teenagers smiling at the thought of people being killed and burning in hell shows they've been exposed to it for so long they're completely desensitised to it.
I saw it and felt sorry for the kids of the family, even the older children. They have been brainwashed and it was just normal to them.
I would of like to see a interview with the family members that have been cast out (I think there might be 2/3). Was they cast out by the family or did they choose to leave?
I would of like to see a interview with the family members that have been cast out (I think there might be 2/3). Was they cast out by the family or did they choose to leave?
Sex God
I found the whole program very bit that i found most harrowing was when the young boy of the family,i think he was about 7, had a cup of something thrown at him from a moving car.
he looked so innocent and sad :cry:
he looked so innocent and sad :cry:
Sex God
the programme is been repeated on thursday 4th on BBC2 at 11-20..
Quote by Liaisons
There are many other religous cults of course. One that springs to mind that we see in England (they are worldwide of course) is the one who calls door to door in small groups often on a Saturday. I won't mention thier name in case it is a breach of the AUP.
shouldn't that be in case you get stoned
i watched the programme,didn't agree with anything they had to say but if thats what they want to believe
don't forget that the group, that follow their god, that can't be mentioned for fear of being stoned, believe that they too are the only ones that will be born again and the rest of us are going to hell
it'll just be my luck, i'll go as global warming really kicks in
fil
Quote by winchwench
the programme is been repeated on thursday 4th on BBC2 at 11-20..
Thanks Creamy- Im so glad im not alone by feeling outraged, disgusted and utterly stunned by the behaviour of these people.
I'd rather burn in hell than spend my life full of such hatred & vitriol.
winchwnech do you feel your outrage & disgust for them is greater than their disgust for those they despise?
Quote by lilnfil
There are many other religous cults of course. One that springs to mind that we see in England (they are worldwide of course) is the one who calls door to door in small groups often on a Saturday. I won't mention thier name in case it is a breach of the AUP.
shouldn't that be in case you get stoned
i watched the programme,didn't agree with anything they had to say but if thats what they want to believe
don't forget that the group, that follow their god, that can't be mentioned for fear of being stoned, believe that they too are the only ones that will be born again and the rest of us are going to hell
it'll just be my luck, i'll go as global warming really kicks in
fil
I don't remember the other group you are mentioning picketing a dead soldiers funeral and shouting to his family that he deserved to die.
I have no issue with what people wish to believe, they should just respect other peoples beliefs too.
I guess suggesting that the unmentionable group are akin to those depicted in the TV programme has got my attention because a lady from the unmentionable group actually came to my door on Saturday morning, as soon as I began to express that I wasn't interested she just smiled and said "Not a problem, thank you." and walk back down the path. She didn't seem to be carrying a sign that said "Gays deserve to die!".
Quote by Liaisons
the programme is been repeated on thursday 4th on BBC2 at 11-20..
Thanks Creamy- Im so glad im not alone by feeling outraged, disgusted and utterly stunned by the behaviour of these people.
I'd rather burn in hell than spend my life full of such hatred & vitriol.
winchwnech do you feel your outrage & disgust for them is greater than their disgust for those they despise?
I'm outraged & disgusted by their use of children in such a manner. As for their treatment of the people they despise so deeply (total population of earth -71) , well I pity them TBH. I know some pretty nice "fags" who have enriched my life.
Quote by Kiss
i watched the programme,didn't agree with anything they had to say but if thats what they want to believe
don't forget that the group, that follow their god, that can't be mentioned for fear of being stoned, believe that they too are the only ones that will be born again and the rest of us are going to hell
it'll just be my luck, i'll go as global warming really kicks in
fil
I don't remember the other group you are mentioning picketing a dead soldiers funeral and shouting to his family that he deserved to die. agree
I have no issue with what people wish to believe, they should just respect other peoples beliefs too. agree
I guess suggesting that the unmentionable group are akin to those depicted in the TV programme i didn't think i had suggested it :? has got my attention because a lady from the unmentionable group actually came to my door on Saturday morning, as soon as I began to express that I wasn't interested she just smiled and said "Not a problem, thank you." and walk back down the path. She didn't seem to be carrying a sign that said "Gays deserve to die!". agree and i wasn't even there when she called
fil
Whilst I disagree entirely with the Phelp's beliefs and philosophies, I applaud the USA for having such an emphatic adherence to their rights of freedom of speech. Just because many don't like what they say doesn't (and shouldn't) prohibit them from saying it - something we don't have in this country anymore. As for including their children in their activities, what difference is there with all other faiths who drag their children along to worship whatever god they, the parents, do?
On a lighter note, and a bit of a hijack - I wonder what would happen if a British tourist, short of a ciggie, went up to Grandpa Phelps and asked to "ponce a fag"??!!
On a lighter note, and a bit of a hijack - I wonder what would happen if a British tourist, short of a ciggie, went up to Grandpa Phelps and asked to "ponce a fag"??!!
the biggest problem they have is that they treat the pastor as if he was a god. No one ever questions what he says cause he speaks the word of god.
How do you know that if you don't question it...
oh yes and what you shall have no other gods before the lord your god...
Basically from what was shown on the program they are a cult group who have taken their view point to an extreme.
Using the kids to demonstrate is wrong in my opinion. Also the way the church would spend $200K a year on flight to protest at different events (mainly funerals of service men killed in action). Where do they get that money from? what else could that be spent on that would be more giving, and more christian but in my opinion they aren't a christian group as they don't understand certain essential parts of the gospel.... like tolerance and understanding. "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone" ... but they are racist and non accepting where christianity should be about acceptance and universal love for all.
How do you know that if you don't question it...
oh yes and what you shall have no other gods before the lord your god...
Basically from what was shown on the program they are a cult group who have taken their view point to an extreme.
Using the kids to demonstrate is wrong in my opinion. Also the way the church would spend $200K a year on flight to protest at different events (mainly funerals of service men killed in action). Where do they get that money from? what else could that be spent on that would be more giving, and more christian but in my opinion they aren't a christian group as they don't understand certain essential parts of the gospel.... like tolerance and understanding. "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone" ... but they are racist and non accepting where christianity should be about acceptance and universal love for all.
Quote by ForestFunsters
Whilst I disagree entirely with the Phelp's beliefs and philosophies, I applaud the USA for having such an emphatic adherence to their rights of freedom of speech. Just because many don't like what they say doesn't (and shouldn't) prohibit them from saying it - something we don't have in this country anymore. As for including their children in their activities, what difference is there with all other faiths who drag their children along to worship whatever god they, the parents, do?From my original post- Is it fair that these, or other groups should be allowed to use their young children in this way? ....would also apply to politics and pretty much any other banner waving activity.
On a lighter note, and a bit of a hijack - I wonder what would happen if a British tourist, short of a ciggie, went up to Grandpa Phelps and asked to "ponce a fag"??!!
Quote by ForestFunsters
Whilst I disagree entirely with the Phelp's beliefs and philosophies, I applaud the USA for having such an emphatic adherence to their rights of freedom of speech. Just because many don't like what they say doesn't (and shouldn't) prohibit them from saying it - something we don't have in this country anymore. As for including their children in
their activities, what difference is there with all other faiths who drag their children along to worship whatever god they, the parents, do?
totally agree
thats exactly what i meant ForestFunsters but i wrote
Quote by lilnfil
i watched the programme,didn't agree with anything they had to say but if thats what they want to believe
fil
you certainly put the point across a lot better than i did
fil
Sex God
Quote by creampie123
the programme is been repeated on thursday 4th on BBC2 at 11-20..
:doh: made a mistake....this programme is been repeated on WEDNESDAY not thursday
the date and time is still right tho :giggle: :giggle: Quote by wayne_z12
:shock: Was my face when I watched this program. If you did not see the program but want to see what sort of people they are, take a look at the website.
BE WARNED IT AINT FUNNY
Makes interesting reading. @ the bottom of one page is this:
All original material on this web site is © 1955-2004 Westboro Baptist Church. You may use any of our material free of chargefor any reason.
Sexlightened
Quote by ForestFunsters
Whilst I disagree entirely with the Phelp's beliefs and philosophies, I applaud the USA for having such an emphatic adherence to their rights of freedom of speech. Just because many don't like what they say doesn't (and shouldn't) prohibit them from saying it - something we don't have in this country anymore. As for including their children in their activities, what difference is there with all other faiths who drag their children along to worship whatever god they, the parents, do?
On a lighter note, and a bit of a hijack - I wonder what would happen if a British tourist, short of a ciggie, went up to Grandpa Phelps and asked to "ponce a fag"??!!
Im really sorry, for im all for freedom of speech, but to treat those children in the manner that that family do
surely there is a sincere problem with any parent who believes there is nothing wrong not only putting the children in danger (which was proved during filming) but allowing them to carry those offensive signs, which they had no understanding off??? Is it not a parents job to protect their children whether it be verbally, physically or mentally. Didnt look like that was what their intention was to me! 