My 12 year old daughter Came home from school the other evening very upset and confused, I knew the minute she walked through the door.
I sat her down and asked what the problem was, she said she had just seen a mother shout and hit her child who was no older than 3 and in a buggy and swore at the child. After calming her anger down, I got the change to question her about the odd times I have smacked her and it must be the same.
She said Mum when you smacked me it was because I was pushing you, I felt you couldn’t tell me what to do, or make me do something I didn’t want to do. When you asked me to do sometime and I didn’t want to do I felt there was nothing you could do to make me. She said she felt what was the worse that could happen I could have been grounded so what, you could have taken something away, I knew I would get it back so was not bothered. I knew you couldn’t smack me I could phone child line or tell a teacher. So there was nothing I thought that you could do to make me. So I asked her why after I smacked her did she feel different, she said because she saw how upset it made me, she didn’t like seeing me upset, and the feeling she had then was different than seeing me angry.
These are the words out of my 12 year old daughter’s lips.
I wrote a thread about smacking my children some time ago, and just thought I would let you know an update.
I will still stand by my first stance and say sometimes a smack does not hurt.
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My update on smacking children
Quote by Theladyisaminx
You have one hell of a daughter there minxy..
For years I have been trying to think of words to explain why smacking never hurt me, and takes my daughter to give me the explaination, who says we can't learn from our children.
Out of the mouths of babes and sucklings eh?
It's a great shame that there are not more decent, right thinking parents like you in this world minxy but perhaps your daughter has learnt a "life lesson" too which she will take with her into adulthood.
Quote by Theladyisaminx
My 12 year old daughter Came home from school the other evening very upset and confused, I knew the minute she walked through the door.
I sat her down and asked what the problem was, she said she had just seen a mother shout and hit her child who was no older than 3 and in a buggy and swore at the child. After calming her anger down, I got the change to question her about the odd times I have smacked her and it must be the same.
She said Mum when you smacked me it was because I was pushing you, I felt you couldn’t tell me what to do, or make me do something I didn’t want to do. When you asked me to do sometime and I didn’t want to do I felt there was nothing you could do to make me. She said she felt what was the worse that could happen I could have been grounded so what, you could have taken something away, I knew I would get it back so was not bothered. I knew you couldn’t smack me I could phone child line or tell a teacher. So there was nothing I thought that you could do to make me. So I asked her why after I smacked her did she feel different, she said because she saw how upset it made me, she didn’t like seeing me upset, and the feeling she had then was different than seeing me angry.
These are the words out of my 12 year old daughter’s lips.
I wrote a thread about smacking my children some time ago, and just thought I would let you know an update.
I will still stand by my first stance and say sometimes a smack does not hurt.
Minxy I agree with you about this but.....I am going through this myself with my Grandaughter.
In the eyes of Social Services, a smack is NOT ok, and I will not go into any details here, but hasten to say MY Grandaughter is now in that system.
In their eyes to even tap your child is abuse. I was told to shout at your child is emotional abuse. I wish I lived in these lefties ideal world where everything is just sooooooo perfect.
They have perfect kids and a perfect home, and an oh soooooooo wonderful perfect partner. Bollox I say to that.
Bottom line here Minxy is that to tap, to slap, to shout, is now NOT acceptable. If caught the system will become involved, and like in my current situation, a long hard fight lies ahead. We have created a monster society, and we will bear the brunt of it for years to come.
But saying all of that a lot of kids NEED that system and most Social workers do a fine job from protecting kids, that really need that protection. It is even worse now though with the baby P scandal. Social services are so scared of their own shadows now, that now if you get into the system, nobody or nothing will stand in their way, whether it is just or not.
Quote by kentswingers777
But saying all of that a lot of kids NEED that system and most Social workers do a fine job from protecting kids, that really need that protection. It is even worse now though with the baby P scandal. Social services are so scared of their own shadows now, that now if you get into the system, nobody or nothing will stand in their way, whether it is just or not.
On the Baby P thread this was one topic that was raised.
The Social Services are damned if they do or damned if they don't.
Dave_Notts
Quote by kentswingers777
My 12 year old daughter Came home from school the other evening very upset and confused, I knew the minute she walked through the door.
I sat her down and asked what the problem was, she said she had just seen a mother shout and hit her child who was no older than 3 and in a buggy and swore at the child. After calming her anger down, I got the change to question her about the odd times I have smacked her and it must be the same.
She said Mum when you smacked me it was because I was pushing you, I felt you couldn’t tell me what to do, or make me do something I didn’t want to do. When you asked me to do sometime and I didn’t want to do I felt there was nothing you could do to make me. She said she felt what was the worse that could happen I could have been grounded so what, you could have taken something away, I knew I would get it back so was not bothered. I knew you couldn’t smack me I could phone child line or tell a teacher. So there was nothing I thought that you could do to make me. So I asked her why after I smacked her did she feel different, she said because she saw how upset it made me, she didn’t like seeing me upset, and the feeling she had then was different than seeing me angry.
These are the words out of my 12 year old daughter’s lips.
I wrote a thread about smacking my children some time ago, and just thought I would let you know an update.
I will still stand by my first stance and say sometimes a smack does not hurt.
Minxy I agree with you about this but.....I am going through this myself with my Grandaughter.
In the eyes of Social Services, a smack is NOT ok, and I will not go into any details here, but hasten to say MY Grandaughter is now in that system.
In their eyes to even tap your child is abuse. I was told to shout at your child is emotional abuse. I wish I lived in these lefties ideal world where everything is just sooooooo perfect.
They have perfect kids and a perfect home, and an oh soooooooo wonderful perfect partner. Bollox I say to that.
Bottom line here Minxy is that to tap, to slap, to shout, is now NOT acceptable. If caught the system will become involved, and like in my current situation, a long hard fight lies ahead. We have created a monster society, and we will bear the brunt of it for years to come.
But saying all of that a lot of kids NEED that system and most Social workers do a fine job from protecting kids, that really need that protection. It is even worse now though with the baby P scandal. Social services are so scared of their own shadows now, that now if you get into the system, nobody or nothing will stand in their way, whether it is just or not.
777 I feel for you if you are battling the system as I could have been facing the same thing had my daughter felt the need to tell her teacher or pick up a phone.
I don't know if you will remember the first thread I done on this subject, I took some harsh punishment and was told I was breading a monster, someone that would see hitting was acceptable, that my children would be violent that I was barbaric.
This thread I must stress isn’t I told you so, but please we can not judge all cases within the same light, I believe so many times we get pigeon holed into a box as the boxes only read good or bad.
I would love the people who think all cases should be dealt with in the same way to come around here and question my children, I have not influenced how they think, they have made their own minds up.
How by as a 12 year old said by seeing a parent smack a child isn’t the same as another parent smacking another.
We do need to protect our children but we don’t need to protect children that are loved. We need the children that are loved to be raised by their parents and leave their parents to choose the right form of punishment for their children.
Ive never beaten mine and they seem to have turned out OK.
I suppose Im just lucky.
It did cause one problem though, my sons step father was fond of bullying my son, mostly emotionally but the odd sly slap punch and poke. I knew it was going on and did my best to support my son through it all without resorting to Social Services. I managed to curtail the physical aspects but the emotional stuff carried on despite my best efforts.
It all came to a head when my son was 14 and responded to a jibe by the step father by telling him he was an absolute twat who didn't know how to behave as an adult human being. The step father punched my son in the face. My son retaliated and punched the chap squarely on the jaw knocking him to the ground.
I often wonder if I had beaten the boy more regularly would he have been able to cope better.
I suppose Im just lucky.
It did cause one problem though, my sons step father was fond of bullying my son, mostly emotionally but the odd sly slap punch and poke. I knew it was going on and did my best to support my son through it all without resorting to Social Services. I managed to curtail the physical aspects but the emotional stuff carried on despite my best efforts.
It all came to a head when my son was 14 and responded to a jibe by the step father by telling him he was an absolute twat who didn't know how to behave as an adult human being. The step father punched my son in the face. My son retaliated and punched the chap squarely on the jaw knocking him to the ground.
I often wonder if I had beaten the boy more regularly would he have been able to cope better.
Minxy whether you like it or not, it is now against the law to smack a child leaving a mark.
The people who run this system have told me that a tap or a smack or a shout, IS abuse. You could get taken to court for it, and if the child complains that you have hit or smacked it, the law is there to protect it. As well they know but.....if you get accused of this the system clams together, and like now I find myself dealing with the very peoples attitutdes that I detest....somehow ironic really.
You have to agree with everything they say or do, or you are also accused yourself of " not co-operating ". Perish the thought that one would argue against their views.
I was also critised by his woman, that to let my Grandaughter stay up on the only day that I see her, till ten o clock, I was being emotionally abusive to her. I mean when you are having to deal with people who live the " perfect life ", you have no arguement.
Remember Minxy......the next time you smack your child, you could also so easily end up in that same system......it's not a nice world to be in.
The people who run this system have told me that a tap or a smack or a shout, IS abuse. You could get taken to court for it, and if the child complains that you have hit or smacked it, the law is there to protect it. As well they know but.....if you get accused of this the system clams together, and like now I find myself dealing with the very peoples attitutdes that I detest....somehow ironic really.
You have to agree with everything they say or do, or you are also accused yourself of " not co-operating ". Perish the thought that one would argue against their views.
I was also critised by his woman, that to let my Grandaughter stay up on the only day that I see her, till ten o clock, I was being emotionally abusive to her. I mean when you are having to deal with people who live the " perfect life ", you have no arguement.
Remember Minxy......the next time you smack your child, you could also so easily end up in that same system......it's not a nice world to be in.
Quote by benrums0n
Ive never beaten mine and they seem to have turned out OK.
I suppose Im just lucky.
It did cause one problem though, my sons step father was fond of bullying my son, mostly emotionally but the odd sly slap punch and poke. I knew it was going on and did my best to support my son through it all without resorting to Social Services. I managed to curtail the physical aspects but the emotional stuff carried on despite my best efforts.
It all came to a head when my son was 14 and responded to a jibe by the step father by telling him he was an absolute twat who didn't know how to behave as an adult human being. The step father punched my son in the face. My son retaliated and punched the chap squarely on the jaw knocking him to the ground.
I often wonder if I had beaten the boy more regularly would he have been able to cope better.
:shock: I have never beaten mine either.
Beaten means: to strike repeatedly
Quote by Theladyisaminx
Ive never beaten mine and they seem to have turned out OK.
I suppose Im just lucky.
It did cause one problem though, my sons step father was fond of bullying my son, mostly emotionally but the odd sly slap punch and poke. I knew it was going on and did my best to support my son through it all without resorting to Social Services. I managed to curtail the physical aspects but the emotional stuff carried on despite my best efforts.
It all came to a head when my son was 14 and responded to a jibe by the step father by telling him he was an absolute twat who didn't know how to behave as an adult human being. The step father punched my son in the face. My son retaliated and punched the chap squarely on the jaw knocking him to the ground.
I often wonder if I had beaten the boy more regularly would he have been able to cope better.
:shock: I have never beaten mine either.
Beaten means: to strike repeatedly
Oh dear Minxy.....saying comments like that will now have all the " lefties " out, stating that a smack IS abuse...mark my words.
Sex God
I was never beaten... to be honest I think that's a far cry from a smack in the sense of discipline as a child. Personally, I think it's the wrong choice of word for a discussion such as this.
My parents had a stick. It was called "the stick" and we were made to fetch it (I say we but it was mostly me!) when we were naughty.
It hung on the wall behind the toaster and was there as a threat more than anything else, although I have to say it was used. My dad made it... in hindsight it was a beautiful piece of workmanship. It was always my mum who used it. :lol: Sadly, (again, in hindsight) on a day of utter rebelion, my brother and I took a hacksaw to it, chopped it into little bits, then sellotaped it back together and hung it back on the wall... it was all floppy! :lol:
I could have found a welcome home for it now! :rascal:
However, I'm really not interested in the political correctness of smacking your child, if I had kids I'd bring them up the same way as my parents did and even if I do say so myself, I turned out okay. Whilst I'm not sure I'd be smacking them (mainly because I suspect I'd only encourage the whole naughtiness that I've discovered in later life!) but I don't see anything wrong with it if that's how you choose to discipline your kids. The only thing I would hope for is that you do whatever you do in the privacy of your own home, behind closed doors as it's really not nice hearing/seeing someone shout/smack their kids in public. I'm sure many of you will disagree with that, that's okay, you're entitled to do so, I can only ever speak from my own experiences. My parents would never hurt me. Never in a million years and whatever they did by way of discipline was for my own good.
Just make sure that you understand that there's a very big difference between discipline and abuse, only the line is very fine.
It saddens me that children are now all too ready to work the system. Phone childline indeed. :shock: I have no idea what changed but I used to be scared of the line "wait till your father gets home". What happened to that? What happened to behaving with respect to your elders? Yeah I might have got the odd spanking but I'd never have spoken to adults the way kids do now. You only have to switch on the telly to see it. Is that what's wrong with society? The youth of today? It's shocking, it really is. Who takes the blame? The media? The government? The parents? Who knows? I don't. I just know that I'd think long and hard before I brought a child into this society.
My parents had a stick. It was called "the stick" and we were made to fetch it (I say we but it was mostly me!) when we were naughty.
It hung on the wall behind the toaster and was there as a threat more than anything else, although I have to say it was used. My dad made it... in hindsight it was a beautiful piece of workmanship. It was always my mum who used it. :lol: Sadly, (again, in hindsight) on a day of utter rebelion, my brother and I took a hacksaw to it, chopped it into little bits, then sellotaped it back together and hung it back on the wall... it was all floppy! :lol:
I could have found a welcome home for it now! :rascal:
However, I'm really not interested in the political correctness of smacking your child, if I had kids I'd bring them up the same way as my parents did and even if I do say so myself, I turned out okay. Whilst I'm not sure I'd be smacking them (mainly because I suspect I'd only encourage the whole naughtiness that I've discovered in later life!) but I don't see anything wrong with it if that's how you choose to discipline your kids. The only thing I would hope for is that you do whatever you do in the privacy of your own home, behind closed doors as it's really not nice hearing/seeing someone shout/smack their kids in public. I'm sure many of you will disagree with that, that's okay, you're entitled to do so, I can only ever speak from my own experiences. My parents would never hurt me. Never in a million years and whatever they did by way of discipline was for my own good.
Just make sure that you understand that there's a very big difference between discipline and abuse, only the line is very fine.
It saddens me that children are now all too ready to work the system. Phone childline indeed. :shock: I have no idea what changed but I used to be scared of the line "wait till your father gets home". What happened to that? What happened to behaving with respect to your elders? Yeah I might have got the odd spanking but I'd never have spoken to adults the way kids do now. You only have to switch on the telly to see it. Is that what's wrong with society? The youth of today? It's shocking, it really is. Who takes the blame? The media? The government? The parents? Who knows? I don't. I just know that I'd think long and hard before I brought a child into this society.
Quote by kentswingers777
Ive never beaten mine and they seem to have turned out OK.
I suppose Im just lucky.
It did cause one problem though, my sons step father was fond of bullying my son, mostly emotionally but the odd sly slap punch and poke. I knew it was going on and did my best to support my son through it all without resorting to Social Services. I managed to curtail the physical aspects but the emotional stuff carried on despite my best efforts.
It all came to a head when my son was 14 and responded to a jibe by the step father by telling him he was an absolute twat who didn't know how to behave as an adult human being. The step father punched my son in the face. My son retaliated and punched the chap squarely on the jaw knocking him to the ground.
I often wonder if I had beaten the boy more regularly would he have been able to cope better.
:shock: I have never beaten mine either.
Beaten means: to strike repeatedly
Oh dear Minxy.....saying comments like that will now have all the " lefties " out, stating that a smack IS abuse...mark my words.
But you have me down as one of those.
How does that work then?
Have I alienated myself again by not fitting into one of two boxes?
Ok beat is an emotive word how about:
bang, bash, boff, bonk, box, buffet, bump into, chastise, clash, clobber, clout, collide, conk*, crash, cuff*, drive, force, hammer, impel, knock, percuss, plant*, pop*, pound, pummel, punch, punish, run into, slap, slug, smash into, sock, swat, thrust, thump, touch, wallop, whop
Do you remember the quote from the Matilda books?
I'm smart; you're dumb. I'm big; you're small. I'm right, you're wrong. And there's nothing you can do about it.
I think thats what I heard when I was smacked etc as a kid.
bang, bash, boff, bonk, box, buffet, bump into, chastise, clash, clobber, clout, collide, conk*, crash, cuff*, drive, force, hammer, impel, knock, percuss, plant*, pop*, pound, pummel, punch, punish, run into, slap, slug, smash into, sock, swat, thrust, thump, touch, wallop, whop
Do you remember the quote from the Matilda books?
I'm smart; you're dumb. I'm big; you're small. I'm right, you're wrong. And there's nothing you can do about it.
I think thats what I heard when I was smacked etc as a kid.
Sex God
Quote by benrums0n
Ok beat is an emotive word how about:
bang, bash, boff, bonk, box, buffet, bump into, chastise, clash, clobber, clout, collide, conk*, crash, cuff*, drive, force, hammer, impel, knock, percuss, plant*, pop*, pound, pummel, punch, punish, run into, slap, slug, smash into, sock, swat, thrust, thump, touch, wallop, whop
Do you remember the quote from the Matilda books?
I'm smart; you're dumb. I'm big; you're small. I'm right, you're wrong. And there's nothing you can do about it.
I think thats what I heard when I was smacked etc as a kid.
In that case, I don't see any of that as discipline.
In my view that's abuse.
Sex God
Quote by benrums0n
I don't understand the distinction between an acceptable smack and unacceptable abuse.
:undecided:
A smack is just that a smack for wrongdoing. A clip round the ear, a smack on the legs. That's discipline in my view.
Anything more than that is abuse.
There's a difference, I'm not really sure I can or want to go into it any further than that.
Being a parent is the hardest job there is no doubt about that.
If you hit a child, that is your anger and your frustration that you are trying to dispell. It has nothing to do with diciplining the child. As soon as you smack, hit, whack (insert whichever here) a child you have lost the control.
I don't believe me having a smack or two as a child has done me any lasting harm on the other hand it didn't teach me anything either.
I'm not a perfect parent and I have smacked my eldest child but have always felt instant regret and I have instantly known that I have lost control.
I don't yet know which dicipline technique is most effective for my children but I do know that hitting them isn't going to have the desired effect.
If you hit a child, that is your anger and your frustration that you are trying to dispell. It has nothing to do with diciplining the child. As soon as you smack, hit, whack (insert whichever here) a child you have lost the control.
I don't believe me having a smack or two as a child has done me any lasting harm on the other hand it didn't teach me anything either.
I'm not a perfect parent and I have smacked my eldest child but have always felt instant regret and I have instantly known that I have lost control.
I don't yet know which dicipline technique is most effective for my children but I do know that hitting them isn't going to have the desired effect.
Quote by kentswingers777
See Minx.
So we don’t take into consideration the positives when dealing with our children love, compassion, affection, understanding, the willingness as a parent to listen to children’s views, to teach respect, to help them overcome problems, keen to support them in chosen aims ideas sports, to let them form their own opinions, to support them to be the person they want to be, to instil in them never to judge, to abide by the law, I could go on.
But we are judged on one negative. :shock:
That seems fair and a balanced view
Well I am glad I have brought mine up with an open minded approach, there is never just a right or wrong, left or right, black or white there are some things that are not the simple.
Quote by benrums0n
I don't understand the distinction between an acceptable smack and unacceptable abuse.
I would say an acceptable smack is when all other feeling you have for a child are positives a children when sitting after would reflect on the positives and negatives and weigh up what has just happened.
abuse is when a children has very little positives from their parents to draw from.
This is how I see the difference, I don’t mean it as a form to justify my actions.
Quote by benrums0n
Perhaps thats why im so against smacking cos i didnt have the positives as a kid.
Ben I do agree the balance of a smack should always be totally out weighted by positives, and give some explaination as to why some feel that is has not done them harm, while others feel so strongly the other way.
There are two other things that make me ponder.
When do kids get too old to be smacked?
Ben I think they can see why you have smacked them and they come to realise that you do have to live within certain guildlines within the family unit.
I believe a lot of children do it as a form to test the water, once they get older they are more able to control their own emotions, feelings etc so all becomes calmer within their own lives.
Does anyone smack their adult friends or adult family members?
No ben I have the choice to be around adults so I can walk away from these situations but I can't walk away from my children
Plus adults should know how to treat others as to not to want to entice such a reaction.
Quote by Theladyisaminx
I don't understand the distinction between an acceptable smack and unacceptable abuse.
I would say an acceptable smack is when all other feeling you have for a child are positives a children when sitting after would reflect on the positives and negatives and weigh up what has just happened.
abuse is when a children has very little positives from their parents to draw from.
This is how I see the difference, I don’t mean it as a form to justify my actions.
Minx you seem to be missing the most important point here......it is ILLEGAL to smack your kids, which leaves a mark. It is ILLEGAL to emotionally abuse your child.
That is the law, no matter what you or I say to the contrary. Try smacking your child in front of a social worker, and say that you are being positive.
They will have your child taken away quicker than you can say......ouch.
Sex God
Quote by benrums0n
Does anyone smack their adult friends or adult family members?
On occasion but only when they have been very good ;-)
Quote by kentswingers777
I don't understand the distinction between an acceptable smack and unacceptable abuse.
I would say an acceptable smack is when all other feeling you have for a child are positives a children when sitting after would reflect on the positives and negatives and weigh up what has just happened.
abuse is when a children has very little positives from their parents to draw from.
This is how I see the difference, I don’t mean it as a form to justify my actions.
Minx you seem to be missing the most important point here......it is ILLEGAL to smack your kids, which leaves a mark. It is ILLEGAL to emotionally abuse your child.
That is the law, no matter what you or I say to the contrary. Try smacking your child in front of a social worker, and say that you are being positive.
They will have your child taken away quicker than you can say......ouch.
777 I think you are missing the point, we have to understand that people have different views for different reasons.
Ben asked a question and I believe we have an understanding in how we both would see things differently, what you keep doing is boxing people to fit left or right without listening to why and how opinions are form. I am not asking for people like ben to agree with me, but am just giving him a different view for a different reason.
The things about this country is nobody listens, to listen is to learn, I am just listening to ben at this moment.
Sex God
Blimey and I thought I thought about stuff too much!! :shock: :giggle:
Doesn't anyone have any common sense any more? Or is my world too black and white and Kenty's is too left and right??
I think I'm missing a lot but this is making my brain hurt!
Doesn't anyone have any common sense any more? Or is my world too black and white and Kenty's is too left and right??
I think I'm missing a lot but this is making my brain hurt!
Quote by Dirtygirly
Blimey and I thought I thought about stuff too much!! :shock: :giggle:
Doesn't anyone have any common sense any more? Or is my world too black and white and Kenty's is too left and right??
I think I'm missing a lot but this is making my brain hurt!
We could set up a brain draining club.
And you could bring the floppy stick held together with cellotape.
Dirty the story of the stick was so funny I was crying.
Quote by Theladyisaminx
I don't understand the distinction between an acceptable smack and unacceptable abuse.
I would say an acceptable smack is when all other feeling you have for a child are positives a children when sitting after would reflect on the positives and negatives and weigh up what has just happened.
abuse is when a children has very little positives from their parents to draw from.
This is how I see the difference, I don’t mean it as a form to justify my actions.
Minx you seem to be missing the most important point here......it is ILLEGAL to smack your kids, which leaves a mark. It is ILLEGAL to emotionally abuse your child.
That is the law, no matter what you or I say to the contrary. Try smacking your child in front of a social worker, and say that you are being positive.
They will have your child taken away quicker than you can say......ouch.
777 I think you are missing the point, we have to understand that people have different views for different reasons.
Ben asked a question and I believe we have an understanding in how we both would see things differently, what you keep doing is boxing people to fit left or right without listening to why and how opinions are form. I am not asking for people like ben to agree with me, but am just giving him a different view for a different reason.
The things about this country is nobody listens, to listen is to learn, I am just listening to ben at this moment.
Minx this is NOT about opinions.....it is about the law of the land. The law social workers act upon.
There is no right or wrong things here. On this occasion I am dealing with hard facts. Whatever your reasons or anybodys elses about smacking, it is illegal.
You have said you feel it is ok to smack your child, and I agree with you, it is just that the law will not.....and I should know, as am going through something very similar right now.
