Surely Too Easy

2 Mar 2005

Quote by Bloke2005
I thought he was quite sweet personally

Why did you get a taste? :wink:
No, I told you, I'm saving that 10% for a taste of you when I meet you mate :wink:
PS: I didn't think he was sweet and there's another 'sweet' one next door right now :shock:
Double gup!! :shock:

2 Mar 2005

Quote by VenusnMars
Geez we're navel gazing again!!
It pisses me off when we start recriminating and making others feel guilty when quite a lot of us were watching what was going on and doing nothing.

It`s called the real world, deal with it! rotflmao

:giggle:
Venusxxx
Ahem - fetishism more like!! There's definitely a hint of sado-masochism about all this. wink

2 Mar 2005

Quote by manofmuchfun
Ok...... an I was to blame, hand up, just didnt like his attitude at first.......I realised that I would give him the benfit of the doubt and personally apologised ! even by PM ! ........yet....still the nature of shooting himself in the foot ! .........
ok the damage was done ......he had the chance to contain himself, ....but for my personal opinion he came for a shag without doing any reading an thought he'd show us he was top dog ! ...........what sort of remark is that about scandal ? or anyone else for that matter ...thats not being friendly or anything to do with swinging .....an as for the threat as others have said ...a doorman ? ........... are we not best off without those types ? ......
in future....I'll keep out of such things cos I shouldnt take the bait......but i wont write anything I'm not prepared to back up an I wont hide behind a keyboard....but there really isnt any place for his threats or attitude on here is there ?

MOMF, I hope I didn`t make you feel I was pointing the finger, sorry if I did. I am aware that you clashed with him the most, but I was going off on one of those `generalised group dynamic thingies` that I do rolleyes

, course, chances are given that I`m not the only one who raised a sympathetic attitude, that it`s not `all about me`, but I can dream can`t I?! wink

I hadn`t realised that so many had also sent the guy in question PMs, which does speak volumes about a lack of accomodation on his part, the chances are that yes, he probably never would have fit in, but is this still a justification for running him out of town? His last comment certainly warranted deactivation, I won`t debate that, I just wonder how emotive he`d become at the time and how much of that was a result of the interaction with everyone here, and if that had been different whether he could have learnt something....eventually :wink:. This is something I have asked myself before he came along regarding others who have bit the dust.
So Tune, yes, I do understand where you are coming from regarding those, who like me, sometimes feel like this, say nothing, and then bring it up later, making people feel guilty. I won`t speak for everyone, but it`s not an admirable trait, but it`s also one which is pretty hard to overcome when there is an active majority who are likely to disagree with you if you do speak up. It`s another one of those `Gorilla grunting` thingies which I`m personally trying to work on. In the meantime I hope that others will read this as an interesting discussion and not see it as an accusation. I wouldn`t blame anyone for feeling a little defensive, I certainly have at times, I just try to spot it reel myself in from time to time. I`m not always that good at it either.
Why does `naval gazing`, piss you off so much? I`d be interested to know.
Venusxxx

2 Mar 2005

I'm sorry. As one of the main culprits I admit I goaded him every step of the way on Libra's thread but he really was asking for it.
I asked him if his brother was still at school - as a joke - he came back with yeah baby hes 1st year 6th form - like I'm gonna be impressed.....He didn't read half the posts (can't have) and insulted more people than he flirted with.
He sent me PMs while we were posting on the thread asking me for naked pics and a serious ( :shock: ) meet. I didnt reply to his PMs cos I was too busy posting on what turned out to be a highly entertaining thread. I could see he was not gonna last long and quite franlkly didnt care once we'd got past the Yeah Baby crap and the 'I can last for hours' scenario.
Call me cynical but that was one newbie that needed a bloody good baiting. We had fun at his expense, yes, but I bet he got a wank or two out of it, and I bet we taught him SOMETHING, be it something small, nevertheless. People cannot come on here presuming girls like me with a naked arse are gonna want to jump into bed with him.
I will, however, restrain myself next time...
It was the Sig that got me going. Cocky little tyke.

2 Mar 2005

Several people told him that his sig was really hurting him. Credit where it's due, he did eventually remove it, but by that time he'd pretty much destroyed any chance he might have had of gaining any credibility with his blasÃ© tone, despite some well intentioned advice from quite a few people. I'm fairly convinced he was just chancing and had no real intention of taking either SH or himself seriously.

2 Mar 2005

Quote by Ice Pie
Several people told him that his sig was really hurting him. Credit where it's due, he did eventually remove it, but by that time he'd pretty much destroyed any chance he might have had of gaining any credibility with his blasÃ© tone, despite some well intentioned advice from quite a few people. I'm fairly convinced he was just chancing and had no real intention of taking either SH or himself seriously.

Yeah, I got that bit! :P
MOMF, I don`t think we can necessarily change someone who is determinedto be a twat, I think the only thing we can do is let them burn their bridges in their own time thus giving the not so twattish time to come around. Different twats may be more receptive, and more people giving them this chance, instead of being so judgemental, may aid that reception, or alternatively if people don`t want to bend over backwards (their perogative) twats are just as easily ignored. That said, I`m not Mother Teresa, I`ve jumped on the odd twat myself, but I do tend to question my motives afterward, especially when I see harsher degrees of it in other areas which make me uncomfortable. This is far from a `holier than thou` thing.
Of course, I could be completely wrong, perhaps this baptism of fire is a good way of cleansing the forum, making it more comfortable for others here. I am more inclined to be sympathetic toward any chance of someone becoming hurt because I`m a soft twat lol

, but regardless of that, I still feel I am making some sense......somewhere along the line confused

:lol:
Venusxxx

2 Mar 2005

Quote by da69ve
I thought he was quite sweet personally

2 Mar 2005

Quote by manofmuchfun
so would you feel that it would have made any difference in HIS case ?

You know, I don`t think it would have done, especially since the PMs came to light, but the thing is we will never know for sure will we? I think that`s what tends to sit uncomfortably with me. I have a lot of respect for this site, and prefer to see the main membership body can be perceived as blameless when someone gets booted. That hasn`t happened in this case.

now I can see that I have to adjust to accomodate these twats ? well yes I will , so i'm on a learning curve for the sake of peace in here ! i'm trying to see the balance between what is sense and whats not....you may disagree with me, you may not.......I will be more tolerant in future and let em hang themselves rather than push ! ....as I said as a whole How are and do we deal with it ? ....I have no wish to push anyone out....they may actually turn out to be decent fellas !

You don`t HAVE to do anything, I`ve just offered a point of view which you and others here can either choose to take on board, or dissect, I welcome both. People who choose to take it on board will perhaps validate what I`m thinking, people who choose to dissect will possibly open my eyes to other valid points of veiw, depending on the strength of their argument. People who feel they HAVE to take it on board for the sake of peace and quiet leave me with the impression they feel I am hounding them, which is not my intention at all

now i'll tell you another thing ........I tried to offer someone who has ASKED my advice some help..........behind my back he has gone to someone and asked for a shag with someone he knew damn well I was seeing, .....again is my blood boiling ? ...ok.....I'm gonna let the twat hang himself .....

I`m sorry to hear that sad

, if it`s personal, go get him!
Venusxxx

2 Mar 2005

Blimey my 'just before bed comment' has draw the cat and the pidgeons again ! Oops sorry xx

2 Mar 2005

As a newbie on here myself i wanted to say that yes, sometimes it can feel quite intimidating but then you're always gonna get that when joining something new.
I think u have to know ur limits and not come charging in like ur the best thing ever (which it seems this lad did). If people are gonna accept you then u have to accept the fact that no-one knows u and if u dont make an effort to get involved and make friends then ur stuffed.
For me i've had nothing but friendship and support offered xxxx

2 Mar 2005

I've just logged in after going to work after making my post here and see there's quite a debate going 's an interesting read and the interaction should demonstrate to anyone following the thread but not posting that there's a good and cohesive community here. Nobody's throwing shit at anyone else (except tongue in cheek) but everyone has a view which others are affording them the respect to put forward and agree or disagree politely. Surely this is the essence that keeps the forum healthy in the long run.
The interaction takes place at many levels; initially at the cyber level here in the forum, then by PM, email, whatever, and of course some of us (a lot in fact) get to meet and make friendships.
Having just bounced back in I think I've got a fairly objective view of the way the debate has gone
To get subjective I'd just confirm that I stand by everything I said in my earlier post. I feel the guy was a troll. What does it achieve to agonise over whether he got a fair reception or not? Plenty of newbies come on here and get a very warm welcome so no-one can say that folk on here are unfriendly.
Everyone's making some good points so I'd like to say "Respect" to all kiss

And.........
BTW I DON'T wear a baseball cap but I do have a baseball bat which I use to stir the tea when I'm on the road :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:
innocent

:whistling:

2 Mar 2005

This is at least the third in the series about this Essex Boy. He appears to have aroused a wide range of response and emotions, pages of discussion and heartfelt outpourings.
Did it really need all that?

2 Mar 2005

Quote by duncanlondon
This is at least the third in the series about this Essex Boy. He appears to have aroused a wide range of response and emotions, pages of discussion and heartfelt outpourings.
Did it really need all that?

Why not? It`s interesting and enlightening. :mrgreen:
Venusxxx

2 Mar 2005

Quote by duncanlondon
This is at least the third in the series about this Essex Boy. He appears to have aroused a wide range of response and emotions, pages of discussion and heartfelt outpourings.
Did it really need all that?

Not him personally perhaps, but as an example of a recurring personality type that crops up now and then, I think it's a valid discussion.

3 Mar 2005

Quote by manofmuchfun
who will accept his behaviour ? ...........

Not me!!

:x :x :x :x wink

3 Mar 2005

Quote by VenusnMars
but I have to ask, was it him who already held the gun, or was it handed to him?

He arrived with the gun and, not only was it already cocked to fire but he'd already shoved it up his arse and was begging for people to pull the trigger.
I'm sure, were I the active member now that I was 3 months ago I'd have probably had some fun at his expense, too. Would I have treated someone like that in real life? Probably not, I'd have ignored them. Indeed, it's one of the reasons I moved out of London to where I am now, up north.

3 Mar 2005

Just for the record, I would like to point out that when I deactivated him I had not read any of his previous 68 posts that day (though I did later!!).
I was so blunt with him because he joined the site and then started a thread moaning about it.
mad

:x :x :x :x :x
I was quite surprised by his reaction !! :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

3 Mar 2005

Quote by Sgt Bilko
Just for the record, I would like to point out that when I deactivated him I had not read any of his previous 68 posts that day (though I did later!!).
I was so blunt with him because he joined the site and then started a thread moaning about it.
:x :x :x :x :x
I was quite surprised by his reaction !! :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

There ya go Sarge!
PS Love the.......................er.............................. tits :twisted:
:grin: :grin:

3 Mar 2005

I only read the welcome thread from this guy.
From the welcome thread, he had wrote things in his signature that some people took offence to. But did it break any AUP rules? None that I can see.
His comments towards people throughout the welcome thread were qualified with an emtiocon i.e. he was trying to join the banter and state it was a joke. When it was pointed out that his remarks could have caused offence he apologised. At no time did he make a direct abusive remark in the welcome thread. I saw some direct abusive remarks....... but not from him.
Banter and fun is a two way process...........if it all goes one way then that is bullying. You may dress it up with as many psychological or street references as you wish, but this is the way I see it.
I find the forum has a diverse assortment of people with a great sense of humour and wit. However, this time I did not think the baiting and abuse was funny.
Dave_Notts

3 Mar 2005

Quote by Dave__Notts
if it all goes one way then that is bullying.
Dave_Notts

:shock: :idea: :idea: :idea: :!:
Now why didn`t I cut through the crap like that?! I`m hyper-sensitive to anything which smacks of bullying, which would probably explain a great deal about my tenacity on this thread.
/runs off to find scalpel to dissect self, but possibly might sleep first :lol2:
Nite all wink

Venusxxx

3 Mar 2005

Quote by westerross
Geez we're navel gazing again!!
There have been times when I've jumped to defend someone who's getting a roasting, which I think is unfair. But I didn't in this case, because this guy was asking for it.
It pisses me off when we start recriminating and making others feel guilty when quite a lot of us were watching what was going on and doing nothing. Credit to those who were trying to cool (shit sorry!!) things down but quite frankly you were fighting a losing battle. The guy you were trying to defend was his own worst enemy. He proved that when he showed his true colours and threatened violence. Think how you'd feel if someone like that turned up to a munch!!
As someone else said to me - he was a bit of a troll.

:cheers: :cheers: :cheers:

Quote by manofmuchfun
in future....I'll keep out of such things cos I shouldnt take the bait......but i wont write anything I'm not prepared to back up an I wont hide behind a keyboard....but there really isnt any place for his threats or attitude on here is there ?

That was the reason I was staying well out of it on the night (you reading this Morbius. ON THE NIGHT. :P lol

)
Venus he was given plenty of chance to redeem himself during the night. As you can see at least 2 people sent him PMs advising him how the forum worked etc and he chose to ignore them or to try and pick them up ( :roll: :lol: ). I should imagine that one of the mods who were about PMd him as well with a warning. He was only banned when he threatened a mod ( :wanker: ). OK the mod was a little offensive, but we don't know what's gone on via PMs etc. Maybe the mod was justified in his comment.
I really don't think that the subject of this clown warrants a 3 page thread, but hey, he's getting plenty of attention now. :roll: Probably pissing himself somewhere.
He did shoot himself in the foot and was banned. One of the first things we learn is that you can only help people that want to be helped. wink

3 Mar 2005

Even those who couldnâ€™t hit a cows arse with a banjo couldnâ€™t have failed to miss the piss taking opportunity this guy offered.
He was obviously an immature chav. Those who continued to piss take, even after he had tried to apologise (clumsy though it was) had by that time become trigger happy. The big exit was inevitable.
My point is, if someone behaved initially like he did in the pub, how many would have gone up to him and taken the piss? Not many I guess. My bet would be that, unless he said something to you or interrupted you in any way, he would have been ignored.
In the way that some people are always right, cant handle having their views questioned, will never apologise, sometimes it needs to be remembered that not everyone is equipped to be able to handle piss taking as well as others. We all see that in real life and tend to act accordingly.
Iâ€™ve been involved in it, so therefore cant take the moral high ground, but, group piss taking is bullying.

3 Mar 2005

Quote by easy
Venus he was given plenty of chance to redeem himself during the night. As you can see at least 2 people sent him PMs advising him how the forum worked etc and he chose to ignore them or to try and pick them up ( ). I should imagine that one of the mods who were about PMd him as well with a warning. He was only banned when he threatened a mod ( :wanker: ). OK the mod was a little offensive, but we don't know what's gone on via PMs etc. Maybe the mod was justified in his comment.
I really don't think that the subject of this clown warrants a 3 page thread, but hey, he's getting plenty of attention now. :roll: Probably pissing himself somewhere.
He did shoot himself in the foot and was banned. One of the first things we learn is that you can only help people that want to be helped.

I`ll be the first to admit that using Wideboy as an example of how newbie-baiting can become out of hand hasn`t done my case any favours, for all the reasons you state, and no, he alone does not warrant a three page discussion, but as Ice said,

Not him personally perhaps, but as an example of a recurring personality type that crops up now and then, I think it's a valid discussion.

And I still feel my points are worth considering when applied to the general trend of newbie baiting, because in varying degrees we can be very quick to alienate people who `don`t get it` purely for the entertainment value, and when they become angry they all too often become slaughtered . If they try to give as good as they get, they all too often become slaughtered. I think the latter can be particularly difficult for some who are advised it`s only a pisstake and try to join in, because one regular`s `humour` is, coming from a newbie, an `insult`. People will not accept such tit for tat behaviour from someone they barely know, but when we set the standard, is it all that surprising that some will try dive in with the mood, especially when advised to? Not everybody has the instinct to know how to behave in certain environments, and those who do not will try to do the next best thing, which is to look at the longer term members to see how they behave.
I think if you watch some of the patterns on how these road accidents build up, and how both some regulars and some newbies will read and react to each others behaviour, much of it can be understood to a point and the snowball effect avoided, depending upon recognising the emotions involved and where the point of no return lies.
Venusxxx

3 Mar 2005

Quote by In a thread about discreet relationships Neilinleeds
i for one, and this is very much MHO mind, am heartily sick of seeing . . . .
newbies being castigated for a naive newbie post.
newbies being castigated for spelling mistakes.
newbies being castigated for being honest and declaring that they are in fact, OMFG, married.
newbies being castigated for not getting an "in joke" and possibly misreading it, and then being castigated all the more.
newbies being castigated for *insert any particular reason you happen not to like here*
i'd go so far as to say sometimes, looking at some of the lurkers in LMU who regularly pounce on posters, well it smacks of trolling. if a newbie posted something contentious to get a rise, we'd call it exactly that!
FFS if you don't like it just bloody ignore it! can you imagine how boring this site would be if only a certain kinda person conforming to a certain narrow mindset and lifestyle and moral codewere made welcome here? :roll: :roll:
look, we all know the world and his wife would have some pretty disparaging comments to make about our membership here wouldn't they? read any damn article in any damn newspaper, cos we are in fact all vile perverts who spread STD's and lead disgustingly amoral lives yeah? so for gods sake do you get just how damn annoying it can be to see the same people who despise that attitude, getting on their high horse and daring to judge others. well i'm sorry, but i'd rather see the honesty in the guys post there than what i can only see as judgmental hypocrisy from people who should know better.
you have a right to your life and your opinion, as does every other member here, but could you not just maybe ignore the stuff you don't like and find something you do like instead, and comment on that, instead of posting continual negative comments and sermonising? we do strive for tolerance OF EVERYONE'S LIFESTYLE here, whether it appeals to us or not, do we not, or have i got everything so badly wrong?
/flame off!

I knew Neil would be missing a good debate so in his absence I found this which I found very relevant to the general 'jump on the band wagon and have some fun at a stupid newbie's expense' thread we seem to have developing.
I have thought about this subject long and hard as it may require me to think about how I too behave and post in the forum. I was one of the people who offered a hand of help to the lastest newbie who joined here and kicked up a fuss. When he ignored everything I did get irritated as I knew others would have PMed him and still he carried on. I agree with the fact that I am not here to play social worker and be nursemaid to every lost puppy that can't handle a bit of a ribbing.
I also agree with the sentiments that group piss taking of the scale we saw in this example is tantamount to bullying and it is rather unpleasant to see. I thought back to when I first joined and what my first few posts were like. I asked myself why they were like that and what I wanted to achieve. I think the difference is the reasons why a person joins here. We have all made mistakes and the finger pointing at fellow forum members in order to make them feel guilty is often uneeded too.
I feel this thread has been a good one as it has offered an opportunity to reflect, analise and make decisions as to our future behaviour in mobbing new members, be them a troll like the one who sparked off this thread, or the ones who are strong like Hagrid was to fight off the abuse in a civilised and thoughtful manner. What about the ones that simply disappear and don't come back?
I have no answers to this one as I feel it is a situation that will come up time and time again as the newbies become established members and then regulars. So even though this time the example chosen was a bit of a troll, I will surely think carefully about how I approach things to come. Will I be bothered to try so hard to give them advice or just pass on by letting them have enough space to get fed up and leave or spam the boards with desperate I want a shag NOW! posts........ who knows.
kiss

Gem.x

3 Mar 2005

Quote by Happy Cats
My point is, if someone behaved initially like he did in the pub, how many would have gone up to him and taken the piss? Not many I guess. My bet would be that, unless he said something to you or interrupted you in any way, he would have been ignored.

Actually I have seen this happen in my pub quite a lot. Every Christmas we appear to get wide boys coming into the pub with this sort of attitude. Funnily enough they get much the same reaction to what happened here. In one particular instance one of the straight women took one of them aside (the older member of a group) and tried to explain to him why their behaviour was "out of order". When they didn't stop she ended up throwing a chair at them! :shock: . And they were forcibly removed by a group of off-duty police officers. Result? A broken window, but they never came back. Much the same discussion then reigned between the regulars and staff as to how we should react/deal with these people. So the forum isn't that different to real life in my opinion.
As to this "experience" getting so much coverage. I think it has started a healthy debate on a more general level. And that is one of the reasons I keep coming back here time and again.

3 Mar 2005

MOMF, in this particular case, the actual person behind the posts..... we will never know if he was worth caring about or not cos he did come out as a troll in the end when he had been goaded enough.
Ask yourself how you would have reacted in his situation at 19? We all have lessons to learn. As in real life we tend not to tollerate the tossers as much as we do here but sometimes when a group of individuals all jump on one person's comments then it is mobbing. This is really another word for bullying. I think that is where it has come from and I do see it as a justified point.
The discussion has also taken a general turn and it is no longer about this one particular newbie but new forum members on the whole. The pack mentallity thing comes out and it is (shock horror) usually single young males that get the ribbing. If they survive it they often fade away anyway through lack of instant shags. In the mean time do we have a duty of care to the newbie that we were once extended as newbies ourselves? If it is ignored, well then how does that person then become "fair game" for the entertainment of all?
kiss

Gem. x

3 Mar 2005

Bullying isnâ€™t premeditated usually, it just happens. Nor does it have to be a group against an individual, it can be one to one. There was a pack mentality against our friend.
Rainbows, I think you missed my point about what you would do in real life. Our friend wasnâ€™t out of order at first â€“ he just looked a prat. He could have been easily ignored, as initially he didnâ€™t cause offence or insult anyone. My point was that in the pub you donâ€™t go up to someone, whose only crime it, is to look like a prat, but is not bothering you and take the piss.

3 Mar 2005

MOMF, the older newbies that come in and get flamed are the ones who are married etc.... rolleyes

I have flamed someone who said they were married and playing away quite harshly too. It flipped the thread into a huge row about married folk playing. Fortunately he was a strong character and held his own through the entire thread. Not everyone is as strong as this.
I do think that the point about someone breezing into a pub like a wide boy with a swagger and an attitude do get laughed at, but it's more in a check out that dickhead overthere, who does he think he is? lol

And the cue the giggles, tuts and rolls of eyes. If he cmae onto you then you'd tell him no and move away. Well I know I would.
As for the young equals daft thing, your theory falls down there as I am only 23. I was not long 22 when I joined this site in the chatroom and common sense told me how to behave. Not all young ones are daft as a brush and niave. I do agree that I am not here as a behavioural trainer. If someone missed the queue when the common sense was handed out then it is not my job on here to put right 19 year (or how ever many years) of social inadequacy.
However, I do feel a bit of a responsibility to be as welcoming to the new ones regardless of the twat factor they possess as I was welcomed with open arms. But then I think my gender and age worked in my favour there too. When Jess made the comment, but I was welcomed with open arms, I thought, yeah but you're a girl. It shouldn't make things different but it does cos this is a swingers site and the thing on our minds is shags?
We don't want to shag them so we can be as nasty as we like to the person? Eeek, what a horrid time we'd all have here if that was the case.
And I very rarely say hi to newbies anymore anyway cos they seem to disappear once I say hi, OR they get banned. Got fed up of making the effort to say hi to them all and then they never come back. sad

I keep telling folk I'm jinxed. :lol:
kiss

Gem. x

3 Mar 2005

Just picking up on the pub analogy. If a prat walks into a pub, people usually avoid him and hope he goes away. If he stands on a table and says "Oy look at me I'm well flash, 'oo wants a fuck then?" then he is in people's faces and they will react.

3 Mar 2005

Unfortunately the pub analogy doesn`t work very well here, he was contained to one or two threads, and so much more easily avoided. (pending on the size of the pub!)
Also, in some of your more `meat market` clubs, that `Wideboy` attitude can actually pull the female equivilent of his character, I`ve seen it in action confused

He probably didn`t drop it as quickly as we`d have liked because it may well have served him well in a different environment. He may not have recognised just how much of it he needed to drop here! I know he had the PMs etc, but was he willing/able to break the habit quick enough? Seems not. Would he have been given a little more time, and without the push which made him lose his temper? Perhaps not, but others might. As others here have pointed out, it all depends on how much effort someone is willing to put in, which is a very personal decision, each to their own. Just give them a chance for that effort to be extended by those who want to. If they don`t want to listen, they will burn their own bridges without assistance, that much is obvious.
I`m sorry, it`s not my fault. I turned into a ENFP. I was much less of a social worker when I was an ENTP! rotflmao

:giggle:
Venusxxx