Actually, I don't feel there should be much difference between men and women on this issue. I think the danger with some women today, is that they feel they have to be more assertive because society expects it of them - they then speak out on something that they are not sure of and it gives a poor impression. When a woman does know what she's talking about, I think her greater compassion can score huge dividends and influence minds.
Plim
As Bluefish says, we don't. At least, a large number of us don't.
Plimboy also has a valid point in that some people (both male and female, as it happens) can come across as strident and domineering rather than merely informed and confident.
Frankly, I think anyone who is informed and articulate is worth listening to. I do realise that not all men feel like this. In various different jobs I have been asked to deal with 'strong women' because no-one else was prepared to. I have never had a problem because, as far as I am concerned, we are all people and I am no more scared of intelligent women than I am of anyone else. Nor should I be, nor do they seem to expect me to be.
Corrie - don't change. If some men can't deal with you then it is their problem not yours.
Will
Strong enough men dont find us threatening; and what other kind would one want?!
Thought of this when reading this thread:
Phenomenal Woman
Pretty women wonder where my secret lies.
I'm not cute or built to suit a fashion model's size
But when I start to tell them,
They think I'm telling lies.
I say,
It's in the reach of my arms
The span of my hips,
The stride of my step,
The curl of my lips.
I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.
I walk into a room
Just as cool as you please,
And to a man,
The fellows stand or
Fall down on their knees.
Then they swarm around me,
A hive of honey bees.
I say,
It's the fire in my eyes,
And the flash of my teeth,
The swing in my waist,
And the joy in my feet.
I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.
Men themselves have wondered
What they see in me.
They try so much
But they can't touch
My inner mystery.
When I try to show them
They say they still can't see.
I say,
It's in the arch of my back,
The sun of my smile,
The ride of my breasts,
The grace of my style.
I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.
Now you understand
Just why my head's not bowed.
I don't shout or jump about
Or have to talk real loud.
When you see me passing
It ought to make you proud.
I say,
It's in the click of my heels,
The bend of my hair,
the palm of my hand,
The need of my care,
'Cause I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.
Maya Angelou
Well its yer basic psychomocology innit. A lot of blokes are intimidated by anybody cleverer than them(assertive, confident and challenging in debate), male or female and that puts a lot of them off. All I do is be me and see what happens. No way should you adopt a mask simply to get a shag and anyway quality over quantity every time for me.
I like women that are independant minded strong opinionated and fair. Come to think of it that's how I like men too. I guess people would say i'm a bit in your face and dominant but i am so telling you that J though she defers too me a lot but only does so on her terms and she is the most incredibly strong women We are Lost which is made up of 25% Lostmale and 75%lostfem
Its not the women or how strong they are, its the fact that they have made up their mind about something which is frightening, or at least the inevitable consequences thereof..........
I am unsure that men are intimidated. I do think that men have been raised to believe, that women should be less than their equal. That is a reflection on society as a whole - media, parenting, schooling etc. I have found that men raised by single
women to be much more confident about sharing their space equally with women. Those raised more 'traditionally' are less comfortable but I, personally, feel that women raised with more traditional roles to aspire to are one of the first to shy away from being 'accused' of feminism or equality.
Basically it goes against their norm and as such is uncomfortable. When people are uncomfortable they will do and say things that in the cold light of day they are a little embarrassed about.
But there is something about how the sexes relate to each other if one or both have a determination to do something. Women are just as exasperated with men, if not intimidated.
But there is no real reason to be afraid of a strong minded woman. One can be awestruck and gob smacked etc. But is fear the right reaction? Most would say not.
I like strong minded women, ones who know what the want and will go for it, can't stand ditherers!
I like strong minded women (as opposed to weak minded).
What I don't like is anyone who is judgemental, boorish or who expresses their strong minded views in an aggressive manner. And that goes for all sexes.
.
Yeah i think the assertive./aggresive balance highlighted in a couple of posts is more of an issue. Now I have thought about it a bit more, I have experienced aggressive opinionated people who would have considered themselves to be strong minded and assertive. I have come across more women than men who exhibit this behaviour.
Sadly, a set of behaviours that are seen as assertive and welcome in a man are often seen as agressive and unwelcome in a women.
In so many cases, a man is expected to push into a situation and a woman is epxected to hang back - presumably waiting to be invited/allowed. And others act on that excpectation. resulting in clashes, or even crashes. It's all caused by prejudging what a person 'should' do. Based on the location of their reproductive organs ffs!
It's sort of summed up in the title. The idea that a strong-minded woman is not the norm and therefore to be noted. But no-one has ever asked if anyone finds strong-minded MEN acceptable. It's a given that they are supposed to be.
I consider myself as strong minded, focused, driven and not often easily fooled. Si on the other hand isnt and some people play on his good nature and try to dupe him on occassion.
I can come over as aggressive but usually when challenged first or in defence of people or persons I care about.
Society has dictated the way the mass populus perceives strong minded determined women, some see it as aggressive and intimidating, some embrace their strengths and ability to communicate well therefore which ever way you've been conditioned in life usually determines your opinion on the matter.
I was raised in a family where it was encouraged to have an opinion and to listen to everyone elses even if theirs differed to yours, each veiw being a valid one to the person expressing it. This has helped me through life although I will admit that I have at times in my past jobs felt the need to be aggressive as opposed to assertive to achieve my objectives. Not because I was being bloody minded in my actions but due to the masculine nature of my roles and pressures from my male peers, having to work twice as hard and be three times as good and strong carrying out my duties just to manage my day to day rolls.
I have more respect and appreciation for someone who can hold their own and get their veiws across in what ever manners suits them best rather than someone who basically bullshits and blags there way through subjects they bearly comprehend the fundamental issues of let alone any detail.
To me its not a gender issue but more an individual trait we all have the potential for. Life has formed us the way we are, we can adjust our behaviour but then it retracts from who we are.
...... I have always spoken openly and I do not suffer fools easily. If I was a man I would be seen as assertive, confident and challenging in debate. As a woman, I can be viewed as being scary, loud and opinionated which is not traits many men seem to like.
