The missing plane .......
Not sure about all the FACTS in this little snippet.
NaturalNews) There are some astonishing things you're not being told about Malaysia Airlines Flight 370, the flight that simply vanished over the Gulf of Thailand with 239 people on board.
The mystery of the flight's sudden and complete disappearance has even the world's top air safety authorities baffled. "Air-safety and antiterror authorities on two continents appeared equally stumped about what direction the probe should take," reports the Wall Street Journal.
WSJ goes on to report:
"For now, it seems simply inexplicable," said Paul Hayes, director of safety and insurance at Ascend Worldwide, a British advisory and aviation data firm.
While investigators are baffled, the mainstream media isn't telling you the whole story, either. So I've assembled this collection of facts that should raise serious questions in the minds of anyone following this situation.
• Fact #1: All Boeing 777 commercial jets are equipped with black box recorders that can survive any on-board explosion
No explosion from the plane itself can destroy the black box recorders. They are bomb-proof structures that hold digital recordings of cockpit conversations as well as detailed flight data and control surface data.
• Fact #2: All black box recorders transmit locator signals for at least 30 days after falling into the ocean
Yet the black box from this particular incident hasn't been detected at all. That's why investigators are having such trouble finding it. Normally, they only need to "home in" on the black box transmitter signal. But in this case, the absence of a signal means the black box itself -- an object designed to survive powerful explosions -- has either vanished, malfunctioned or been obliterated by some powerful force beyond the worst fears of aircraft design engineers.
• Fact #3: Many parts of destroyed aircraft are naturally bouyant and will float in water
In past cases of aircraft destroyed over the ocean or crashing into the ocean, debris has always been spotted floating on the surface of the water. That's because -- as you may recall from the safety briefing you've learned to ignore -- "your seat cushion may be used as a flotation device."
Yes, seat cushions float. So do many other non-metallic aircraft parts. If Flight 370 was brought down by an explosion of some sort, there would be massive debris floating on the ocean, and that debris would not be difficult to spot. The fact that it has not yet been spotted only adds to the mystery of how Flight 370 appears to have literally vanished from the face of the Earth.
• Fact #4: If a missile destroyed Flight 370, the missile would have left a radar signature
One theory currently circulating on the 'net is that a missile brought down the airliner, somehow blasting the aircraft and all its contents to "smithereens" -- which means very tiny pieces of matter that are undetectable as debris.
The problem with this theory is that there exists no known ground-to-air or air-to-air missile with such a capability. All known missiles generate tremendous debris when they explode on target. Both the missile and the debris produce very large radar signatures which would be easily visible to both military vessels and air traffic authorities.
• Fact #5: The location of the aircraft when it vanished is not a mystery
Air traffic controllers have full details of almost exactly where the aircraft was at the moment it vanished. They know the location, elevation and airspeed -- three pieces of information which can readily be used to estimate the likely location of debris.
Remember: air safety investigators are not stupid people. They've seen mid-air explosions before, and they know how debris falls. There is already a substantial data set of airline explosions and crashes from which investigators can make well-educated guesses about where debris should be found. And yet, even armed with all this experience and information, they remain totally baffled on what happened to Flight 370.
• Fact #6: If Flight 370 was hijacked, it would not have vanished from radar
Hijacking an airplane does not cause it to simply vanish from radar. Even if transponders are disabled on the aircraft, ground radar can still readily track the location of the aircraft using so-called "passive" radar (classic ground-based radar systems that emit a signal and monitor its reflection).
Thus, the theory that the flight was hijacked makes no sense whatsoever. When planes are hijacked, they do not magically vanish from radar.
Conclusion: Flight 370 did not explode; it vanished
The inescapable conclusion from what we know so far is that Flight 370 seems to have utterly and inexplicably vanished. It clearly was not hijacked (unless there is a cover-up regarding the radar data), and we can all be increasingly confident by the hour that this was not a mid-air explosion (unless debris suddenly turns up that they've somehow missed all along).
The inescapable conclusion is that Flight 370 simply vanished in some way that we do not yet understand. This is what is currently giving rise to all sorts of bizarre-sounding theories across the 'net, including discussions of possible secret military weapons tests, Bermuda Triangle-like ripples in the fabric of spacetime, and even conjecture that non-terrestrial (alien) technology may have teleported the plane away.
Personally, I'm not buying any of that without a lot more evidence. The most likely explanation so far is that the debris simply hasn't been found yet because it fell over an area which is somehow outside the search zone. But as each day goes by, even this explanation becomes harder and harder to swallow.
The frightening part about all this is not that we will find the debris of Flight 370; but rather that we won't. If we never find the debris, it means some entirely new, mysterious and powerful force is at work on our planet which can pluck airplanes out of the sky without leaving behind even a shred of evidence.
If there does exist a weapon with such capabilities, whoever control it already has the ability to dominate all of Earth's nations with a fearsome military weapon of unimaginable power. That thought is a lot more scary than the idea of an aircraft suffering a fatal mechanical failure.
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I mean
Fact 1, I think we are all aware that those big planes carry flight recorders.
Fact 2, Yes they do emit a signal, but there have been cases I have seen on the programme "air crash investigations" where the signal has been very difficult to pick up and though they usually do find the signal it has sometimes been days or even weeks later.
Fact 3, True, but to find floating debris you would have to be in the right search location, although we know exactly where the aircraft disappeared from the radar screens we do not know for sure where it disappeared from existence, in other words it could have travelled a considerable distance at sea level under the radar scope before crashing, this does not explain why there were no radio transmissions received from the plane before it crashed, but what if it was hijacked and the pilot forced to fly at sea level and not permitted to use the radio ? what if flying so low the plane then crashed before reaching the hijackers intended destination ?
Fact 4, Not all missiles leave a recordable trail Stinger missiles don't, RPG 7 missiles don't, true the chances of them blowing a plane of this size to smithereens is doubtful but the attackers could have got lucky and hit the fuel tanks turning the plane into an instant fireball.
Fact 6, Honestly ? you mean it can't be forced to drop below radar range very quickly ?
I may be wrong on some points, and it is all just speculation on my part, radar has improved a lot since I used it, but I think the above FACTS also contain a lot of speculation.
Hints towards super weapons seem a bit, well, weird, a strange event to test your super weapon, alien abduction still has to be explored and the alien abuduction theorists will be wetting their pants at this one.
My personal punt, the flight recorder will be detected and debris recovered but not in the area that is being currently searched and Aliens are not abducting human beings they are coming here for political asylum in the UK.
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Go on have a punt on this one
There is a previous precedent re a missing plane vanishing without trace, it's not altogether unheard of.....
5 days for the wreckage and 2 years before the blackbox was found.
One thing I haven't seen mentioned anywhere is what of the mobile phones of those on board? should anything untoward but not bomb/explosion related happened surely someone on the phone would maybe have placed a call or if not and it's been landed somewhere then the last known wherabouts of their phones would possibly be known.
Spare a thought for the families waiting for news, they must be at their wits end and then some.
5 days for the wreckage and 2 years before the blackbox was found.
One thing I haven't seen mentioned anywhere is what of the mobile phones of those on board? should anything untoward but not bomb/explosion related happened surely someone on the phone would maybe have placed a call or if not and it's been landed somewhere then the last known wherabouts of their phones would possibly be known.
Spare a thought for the families waiting for news, they must be at their wits end and then some.
That's one of the ones I remembered on air crash investigations but couldn't remember all the details and didn't want to go off in my usual half cocked way was just 100% that it wouldn't be the first black box not immediately found.
Joining you in thoughts for the families losing them in a crash is bad enough but to not know just prolongs the agony though let us hope that there could still be a better explanation doubtful as that seems.
Joining you in thoughts for the families losing them in a crash is bad enough but to not know just prolongs the agony though let us hope that there could still be a better explanation doubtful as that seems.
Quote by Toots
There is a previous precedent re a missing plane vanishing without trace, it's not altogether unheard of.....
5 days for the wreckage and 2 years before the blackbox was found.
One thing I haven't seen mentioned anywhere is what of the mobile phones of those on board? should anything untoward but not bomb/explosion related happened surely someone on the phone would maybe have placed a call or if not and it's been landed somewhere then the last known wherabouts of their phones would possibly be known.
Spare a thought for the families waiting for news, they must be at their wits end and then some.
Mobile phone signals don't travel upwards they are ground based. And only usually work up to a couple of miles offshore.
This plane was 120 miles off shore at 35000ft travelling at 8 miles per minute. They are just looking in the wrong place!
Quote by Rogue_Trader
There is a previous precedent re a missing plane vanishing without trace, it's not altogether unheard of.....
5 days for the wreckage and 2 years before the blackbox was found.
One thing I haven't seen mentioned anywhere is what of the mobile phones of those on board? should anything untoward but not bomb/explosion related happened surely someone on the phone would maybe have placed a call or if not and it's been landed somewhere then the last known wherabouts of their phones would possibly be known.
Spare a thought for the families waiting for news, they must be at their wits end and then some.
Mobile phone signals don't travel upwards they are ground based. And only usually work up to a couple of miles offshore.
This plane was 120 miles off shore at 35000ft travelling at 8 miles per minute. They are just looking in the wrong place!
I read awhile back that it's the plane and technology attached that can distribute the phone signal, 6th question down
and although not proven and not knowing the specifics it seems someones phone may have been working post the incident being reported.
Sex God
I think they are simply looking in the wrong place. The aircraft would not have dropped instantaneously from the sky, unless blown up, as it would still maintain some of it's forward momentum. The trouble is that if whatever caused the crash in the first place threw the aircraft to face a different direction then it's not going to have crashed where it's expected to.
Whatever has happened is clearly very strange so perhaps there is a strange explanation to the aircraft being missing. Maybe the aircraft has sunk in the deep water and is relatively intact rather than a mangled wreck. It's unlikely but possible.
Whatever has happened is clearly very strange so perhaps there is a strange explanation to the aircraft being missing. Maybe the aircraft has sunk in the deep water and is relatively intact rather than a mangled wreck. It's unlikely but possible.
Sex God
So called 'black boxes' continuously operate from the moment ground power is attached to the aircraft. Aircraft are equipped with sensors that gather data. There are sensors that detect acceleration, airspeed, altitude, flap settings, outside temperature, cabin temperature and pressure, engine performance and other data including the cockpit voice recorder. Passenger carrying aircraft are usually equipped with two devices, although some aircraft can have up to four to allow a greater chance of detection and usefull data collection in the event of a disaster. They are installed in the tail of the plane because putting them in the back of the aircraft increases their chances of survival. Magnetic-tape recorders can track about 100 parameters, however they are slowly being phased out for sold state (hard drives/memory cards etc). Solid state recorders can track more than 700 types of data in larger aircraft.
If a plane crashes into the water, the 'homing beacon' is activated by a submergence sensor on the side of the beacon that looks like a bull's-eye. When water touches this sensor, it activates the beacon. Much like the automatic lifeboat launchers on ships.
Black boxesare not actually black. Think about it, being coloured black would make them hard to find. They are day glo orange with reflective strips.
If a plane crashes into the water, the 'homing beacon' is activated by a submergence sensor on the side of the beacon that looks like a bull's-eye. When water touches this sensor, it activates the beacon. Much like the automatic lifeboat launchers on ships.
Black boxesare not actually black. Think about it, being coloured black would make them hard to find. They are day glo orange with reflective strips.
Yes I realise they are "on" all the time otherwise they couldn't record all that they do, but I was wondering what activated the homing beacon, your explanation of submergence activation is one answer, but what if a plane crashes in a forest, impact perhaps like the activation of air bags in cars, maybe but what about the aircraft that crashes without much impact such as in a snow covered plain but the crew are incapacitated and cannot manually activate radios or the box ? It would need a multitude of "starting options" and I just wondered what they might be, I watched "how it's made" on black boxes that showed the construction that made them virtually indestructible and the colour but didn't show the actual working technology of them.
The colour ranks up there with the Black Mamba, the deadliest snake in the world (because of it's aggression and speed not because of the potency of it's venom) since a Black Mamba is actually blue
The colour ranks up there with the Black Mamba, the deadliest snake in the world (because of it's aggression and speed not because of the potency of it's venom) since a Black Mamba is actually blue
Meanwhile this is the most sensible report I have seen about the disappearance
he search for the Malaysia Airlines Boeing 777 that disappeared somewhere between Kuala Lumpur and Beijing on Saturday is the latest in a string of accidents in which airliners have disappeared into the sea. You'd think something as big as a passenger jet would be easy to find, even in pieces, but the ocean is immense, much of the plane sinks and it can be surprisingly difficult to locate a wreck, especially when no one really knows where it went down.
Sometimes, planes are never found. In January 1979, a Varig Brazilian Airlines Boeing 707 took off from Narita International Airport near Tokyo, bound for Rio de Janeiro via Los Angeles. A half hour into the flight, roughly 200 miles from Japan over the Pacific Ocean, the big jet disappeared with its crew of six and a cargo of paintings from an exhibit in Japan. No trace of the plane, the crew or the paintings has ever been found.
Technology has come a long way since then, though. Thirty years later, in June 2009, an Air France Airbus A330 with 228 aboard took off from Rio on its way to Paris, flew into stormy weather over the Atlantic and disappeared. Floating wreckage was spotted from the air within two days, but the ocean where the plane disappeared is 13,000 deep, and it took 23 months and robot submarines to locate the plane's black boxes.
Finding the cause of the crash is even harder, because there are so many possibilities and because investigators often have so little to work with. There's rampant speculation about what happened to Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370, and any theory could be right: A hijacking gone bad? A terrorist bomb like the one that blew a hole in the side of a Pan Am airliner over Lockerbie, Scotland, in 1988? Accidental decompression at 35,000 feet that sucked the oxygen out of the plane and starved the pilots of oxygen the way it did to everyone aboard golfer Payne Stewart's private jet in 1999? Sudden structural failure like the China Airlines 747 that disintegrated over the Taiwan Strait in 2002 when a shoddy 20-year-old repair gave way?
In many cases, given enough time and evidence, investigators do remarkable work to piece together what really happened.
Sometimes it's sinister, such as when one of the pilots of Egypt Air Flight 990 in 1999 waited for the other pilot to leave the cockpit and said, "I rely on God," pulled the throttles back to idle and nosed the plane into the Atlantic off Nantucket, killing all 217 aboard.
Sometimes it's simply a tiny, unseen malfunction, such as the wire that arced and touched off an explosion in the center fuel tank of TWA Flight 800 off Long Island in July 1996, sending it into the Atlantic.
And sometimes it's simply pilot error. When investigators finally found the black boxes from the 2009 Air France crash in the Atlantic, they concluded that the plane's pitot tubes -- the external instruments that measure airspeed -- had iced up, disconnected the autopilot and sent faulty speed readings to the pilots' instruments. In the middle of the night, in the middle of a storm, the pilots were confused about what the plane was actually doing and stalled it — a mistake so basic but so dangerous that student pilots are taught how to avoid it during their first hours in the air. The out-of-control plane plummeted for four minutes and more than 7 miles until it hit the water.
Like the Air France crash, the latest airliner disappearance is a powerful argument for upgrading black-box technology to allow planes to live-stream vital information when they get into trouble — a suggestion that airlines have resisted because of the cost. Crashes like these are rare, but when they happen, finding the wreckage consumes enormous resources and teasing out the causes can take years. Live-streamed data from black boxes could begin to answer both those questions almost instantly.
Chances are good that the Malaysia Airlines 777 will be found, and chances are almost as good that investigators will figure out what happened. Until then, though, it's best not to jump to conclusions. At this point, all the guesses are just guesses.
he search for the Malaysia Airlines Boeing 777 that disappeared somewhere between Kuala Lumpur and Beijing on Saturday is the latest in a string of accidents in which airliners have disappeared into the sea. You'd think something as big as a passenger jet would be easy to find, even in pieces, but the ocean is immense, much of the plane sinks and it can be surprisingly difficult to locate a wreck, especially when no one really knows where it went down.
Sometimes, planes are never found. In January 1979, a Varig Brazilian Airlines Boeing 707 took off from Narita International Airport near Tokyo, bound for Rio de Janeiro via Los Angeles. A half hour into the flight, roughly 200 miles from Japan over the Pacific Ocean, the big jet disappeared with its crew of six and a cargo of paintings from an exhibit in Japan. No trace of the plane, the crew or the paintings has ever been found.
Technology has come a long way since then, though. Thirty years later, in June 2009, an Air France Airbus A330 with 228 aboard took off from Rio on its way to Paris, flew into stormy weather over the Atlantic and disappeared. Floating wreckage was spotted from the air within two days, but the ocean where the plane disappeared is 13,000 deep, and it took 23 months and robot submarines to locate the plane's black boxes.
Finding the cause of the crash is even harder, because there are so many possibilities and because investigators often have so little to work with. There's rampant speculation about what happened to Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370, and any theory could be right: A hijacking gone bad? A terrorist bomb like the one that blew a hole in the side of a Pan Am airliner over Lockerbie, Scotland, in 1988? Accidental decompression at 35,000 feet that sucked the oxygen out of the plane and starved the pilots of oxygen the way it did to everyone aboard golfer Payne Stewart's private jet in 1999? Sudden structural failure like the China Airlines 747 that disintegrated over the Taiwan Strait in 2002 when a shoddy 20-year-old repair gave way?
In many cases, given enough time and evidence, investigators do remarkable work to piece together what really happened.
Sometimes it's sinister, such as when one of the pilots of Egypt Air Flight 990 in 1999 waited for the other pilot to leave the cockpit and said, "I rely on God," pulled the throttles back to idle and nosed the plane into the Atlantic off Nantucket, killing all 217 aboard.
Sometimes it's simply a tiny, unseen malfunction, such as the wire that arced and touched off an explosion in the center fuel tank of TWA Flight 800 off Long Island in July 1996, sending it into the Atlantic.
And sometimes it's simply pilot error. When investigators finally found the black boxes from the 2009 Air France crash in the Atlantic, they concluded that the plane's pitot tubes -- the external instruments that measure airspeed -- had iced up, disconnected the autopilot and sent faulty speed readings to the pilots' instruments. In the middle of the night, in the middle of a storm, the pilots were confused about what the plane was actually doing and stalled it — a mistake so basic but so dangerous that student pilots are taught how to avoid it during their first hours in the air. The out-of-control plane plummeted for four minutes and more than 7 miles until it hit the water.
Like the Air France crash, the latest airliner disappearance is a powerful argument for upgrading black-box technology to allow planes to live-stream vital information when they get into trouble — a suggestion that airlines have resisted because of the cost. Crashes like these are rare, but when they happen, finding the wreckage consumes enormous resources and teasing out the causes can take years. Live-streamed data from black boxes could begin to answer both those questions almost instantly.
Chances are good that the Malaysia Airlines 777 will be found, and chances are almost as good that investigators will figure out what happened. Until then, though, it's best not to jump to conclusions. At this point, all the guesses are just guesses.
When and if they do find MH370 we'll probably find that it's a series of errors / failures that have contributed to the disaster.
It's quite easy to make a plane 'disappear' mid-flight especially over water by the simple error of turning the transponder off. Alternatively, they may have selected the wrong transponder code (eg changed it from Civilian to Military) which would effectively 'hide' the plane from civilian ATC radars - two air crashes show this is possible - 1 the shooting down of an Iran Air plane by the US Navy where the IA flight had set a military frequency 'squawk' on their transponder, 2 - a mid air collision over California between passenger plane and a US fighter where the civilian ATC controller turned the plane (to avoid adverse weather) into the flight path of the fighter because the fighter did not show on his radar.
The area in which MH370 disappeared falls between Malaysia and Vietnam who don't have the worlds most sophisticated civilian radar systems and also rely on some quite antiquated military radars from China and Russia. Unlike most civilian ATC radars, military ones do not record they merely show the operator what's within its coverage with a height and IFF code. Unless the operator is specifically tracking an unidentified object they tend to ignore known scheduled and identified objects crossing their track.
The 'black boxes' (FDR & CVR) location beacons can only transmit over a short distance it's an aid to help find it in close proximity and is activated either by a pressure switch or immersion in water. In the improbable case of the plane making a controlled landing on water and sank and the FDR and CVR are trapped in an air pocket underwater they won't 'activate' (the transponders did not activate in the flight which crashed into the Hudson River as the tail location effectively became a trapped air pocket).
No radio communication - whatever happened to MH370, radio communication is not the first priority for the flight crew. Their first priority is to regain control of the aircraft to a safe flight mode. If they were dealing with a catastrophic failure it may have also severed their communications equipment and no signal was transmitted even though they were trying to communicate. If they did manage to recover the aircraft at a low altitude for a short period of time, they could also have been below the radar horizon and travelled miles in almost any direction before ultimately crashing into the sea.
As the accident involves an American built plane, the NTSB and Boeing will be involved in trying to identify the cause, be it structural, human or 'other' error. I think the only 'cause' that can be safely eliminated is 'Alien Abduction'.
It's quite easy to make a plane 'disappear' mid-flight especially over water by the simple error of turning the transponder off. Alternatively, they may have selected the wrong transponder code (eg changed it from Civilian to Military) which would effectively 'hide' the plane from civilian ATC radars - two air crashes show this is possible - 1 the shooting down of an Iran Air plane by the US Navy where the IA flight had set a military frequency 'squawk' on their transponder, 2 - a mid air collision over California between passenger plane and a US fighter where the civilian ATC controller turned the plane (to avoid adverse weather) into the flight path of the fighter because the fighter did not show on his radar.
The area in which MH370 disappeared falls between Malaysia and Vietnam who don't have the worlds most sophisticated civilian radar systems and also rely on some quite antiquated military radars from China and Russia. Unlike most civilian ATC radars, military ones do not record they merely show the operator what's within its coverage with a height and IFF code. Unless the operator is specifically tracking an unidentified object they tend to ignore known scheduled and identified objects crossing their track.
The 'black boxes' (FDR & CVR) location beacons can only transmit over a short distance it's an aid to help find it in close proximity and is activated either by a pressure switch or immersion in water. In the improbable case of the plane making a controlled landing on water and sank and the FDR and CVR are trapped in an air pocket underwater they won't 'activate' (the transponders did not activate in the flight which crashed into the Hudson River as the tail location effectively became a trapped air pocket).
No radio communication - whatever happened to MH370, radio communication is not the first priority for the flight crew. Their first priority is to regain control of the aircraft to a safe flight mode. If they were dealing with a catastrophic failure it may have also severed their communications equipment and no signal was transmitted even though they were trying to communicate. If they did manage to recover the aircraft at a low altitude for a short period of time, they could also have been below the radar horizon and travelled miles in almost any direction before ultimately crashing into the sea.
As the accident involves an American built plane, the NTSB and Boeing will be involved in trying to identify the cause, be it structural, human or 'other' error. I think the only 'cause' that can be safely eliminated is 'Alien Abduction'.
Sex God
The purpose of the homing beacon is to help identify the crash site where there is little or no sign of the wreckage, such as under the sea. If the aircraft crashes on land then the wreckage, debris field or impact zone is far easier to detect, especially today with the use of satelite imagery. Some systems include a battery pack activated by a fail safe mechanism in reaction to the loss of external power, but these tend to only last for a short period, maybe 48 hours at most in reflection of the easier detection on land.
No I don't buy that one, there have been many cases of planes crashing in remote areas sometimes vast in size such as Siberia or the Andes or remote parts of Australasia, South America and Canada black boxes have been pivotal in finding these aircraft.
Meanwhile, what we spoke or re mobile phones has become more intriguing .....
The mystery surrounding the missing Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 has deepened with the Chinese media reporting that several of the passengers' mobile phones were connecting when called by relatives, but the calls were not picked up.
The sister of one of the Chinese passengers among the 239 people on board the vanished flight rang his phone live on TV, the Mirror reports.
"This morning, around 11:40 , I called my older brother's number twice, and I got the ringing tone," said Bian Liangwei, sister of one of the passengers. At 2pm, Bian called again and heard it ringing once more.
"If I could get through, the police could locate the position, and there's a chance he could still be alive." She has passed on the number to Malaysia Airlines and the Chinese police.
A man from Beijing also called his missing brother on the plane, and reported to the airlines that the phone connected three times and rang before appearing to hang up, according to Shanghai Daily. Media reports claim that the brother had called the number in the presence of reporters before informing the airline.
Meanwhile, what we spoke or re mobile phones has become more intriguing .....
The mystery surrounding the missing Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 has deepened with the Chinese media reporting that several of the passengers' mobile phones were connecting when called by relatives, but the calls were not picked up.
The sister of one of the Chinese passengers among the 239 people on board the vanished flight rang his phone live on TV, the Mirror reports.
"This morning, around 11:40 , I called my older brother's number twice, and I got the ringing tone," said Bian Liangwei, sister of one of the passengers. At 2pm, Bian called again and heard it ringing once more.
"If I could get through, the police could locate the position, and there's a chance he could still be alive." She has passed on the number to Malaysia Airlines and the Chinese police.
A man from Beijing also called his missing brother on the plane, and reported to the airlines that the phone connected three times and rang before appearing to hang up, according to Shanghai Daily. Media reports claim that the brother had called the number in the presence of reporters before informing the airline.
Now I buy it.
I just did some googling and your right, it is water activated, but that seems a bit silly, for the reasons I stated in my previous post, it is not just when planes are submerged or crash into the sea that it might be helpful to have a homing signal pinging away, we have the technology, otherwise how would air traffic control know where the aircraft was in the first place ? it seems crazy that a black box doesn't have the same equipment that the cockpit has in sending out a signal to ATC, often the cockpit is destroyed but the black box is not, which means that the signal the cockpit sends to ATC is lost.
I just did some googling and your right, it is water activated, but that seems a bit silly, for the reasons I stated in my previous post, it is not just when planes are submerged or crash into the sea that it might be helpful to have a homing signal pinging away, we have the technology, otherwise how would air traffic control know where the aircraft was in the first place ? it seems crazy that a black box doesn't have the same equipment that the cockpit has in sending out a signal to ATC, often the cockpit is destroyed but the black box is not, which means that the signal the cockpit sends to ATC is lost.
Sex God
People have said that the aircraft was being tracked on radar. Was it ? Most of the oceans are NOT covered by radar survailance. The Americans have shown it is possible to hide a whole carrier group from radar detection in mid ocean. Is there not conflicting reports as to if the aircraft was turning back when it vanished ? If it was being tracked on radar, that would be known !! Also, even if the aircraft, intact, pointed straight down under power it would still take something like one minute to hit the water, surely any radar tracking would see that ?
I'm wondering if the radar satelites operated by the major powers covered this area of ocean ?
Can't offer any theories as to where it went, but it will be somewhere, either on land or under the water.
John
I'm wondering if the radar satelites operated by the major powers covered this area of ocean ?
Can't offer any theories as to where it went, but it will be somewhere, either on land or under the water.
John
Quote by Fobs
When and if they do find MH370 we'll probably find that it's a series of errors / failures that have contributed to the disaster.
It's quite easy to make a plane 'disappear' mid-flight especially over water by the simple error of turning the transponder off. Alternatively, they may have selected the wrong transponder code (eg changed it from Civilian to Military) which would effectively 'hide' the plane from civilian ATC radars - two air crashes show this is possible - 1 the shooting down of an Iran Air plane by the US Navy where the IA flight had set a military frequency 'squawk' on their transponder, 2 - a mid air collision over California between passenger plane and a US fighter where the civilian ATC controller turned the plane (to avoid adverse weather) into the flight path of the fighter because the fighter did not show on his radar.
The area in which MH370 disappeared falls between Malaysia and Vietnam who don't have the worlds most sophisticated civilian radar systems and also rely on some quite antiquated military radars from China and Russia. Unlike most civilian ATC radars, military ones do not record they merely show the operator what's within its coverage with a height and IFF code. Unless the operator is specifically tracking an unidentified object they tend to ignore known scheduled and identified objects crossing their track.
The 'black boxes' (FDR & CVR) location beacons can only transmit over a short distance it's an aid to help find it in close proximity and is activated either by a pressure switch or immersion in water. In the improbable case of the plane making a controlled landing on water and sank and the FDR and CVR are trapped in an air pocket underwater they won't 'activate' (the transponders did not activate in the flight which crashed into the Hudson River as the tail location effectively became a trapped air pocket).
No radio communication - whatever happened to MH370, radio communication is not the first priority for the flight crew. Their first priority is to regain control of the aircraft to a safe flight mode. If they were dealing with a catastrophic failure it may have also severed their communications equipment and no signal was transmitted even though they were trying to communicate. If they did manage to recover the aircraft at a low altitude for a short period of time, they could also have been below the radar horizon and travelled miles in almost any direction before ultimately crashing into the sea.
As the accident involves an American built plane, the NTSB and Boeing will be involved in trying to identify the cause, be it structural, human or 'other' error. I think the only 'cause' that can be safely eliminated is 'Alien Abduction'.
Well this is the best bit I have read and that includes all the garbage the media is putting out as usual, not ruling out alien abduction though because this would be more interesting than the sure to be announced conspiracy theories
In the news at 10 tonight they are saying the search area has been extended following information from Military Radar sources that say they have indications that the plane may have travelled for up to an hour after "disappearing" from civilian radar, the details were vague but go along with what has been said above re civilian and military radars.
Sexpert
Don't know a lot about plane's but if it has come down, depending on the angle it hit the water and the speed would there necessarily be a debris field? Remember the crash landing on the Hudson River? Is it possible the pilot put it on the sea in one piece then it sank?
Quote by herts_darlings1
Don't know a lot about plane's but if it has come down, depending on the angle it hit the water and the speed would there necessarily be a debris field? Remember the crash landing on the Hudson River? Is it possible the pilot put it on the sea in one piece then it sank?
It's is possible Herts but the pilot would have to have exceptional skills and a near flat sea to achieve it.
Here's what happens if you get it slightly wrong (125/175 died)
Quote by MidsCouple24
Its lost all over again, but I ain't sitting through seven series again....
WOA WOA WOA, 7 series ? I have all 6 boxed sets which I have not yet watched, are you telling me there is another series ?
No Mids there are only six, just seeing who was awake...they have flung around the idea of a seventh...but should just let it all die :-)
Sex God
Quote by MidsCouple24
No I don't buy that one, there have been many cases of planes crashing in remote areas sometimes vast in size such as Siberia or the Andes or remote parts of Australasia, South America and Canada black boxes have been pivotal in finding these aircraft.
No they haven't.
Quote by MidsCouple24
Now I buy it.
I just did some googling and your right, it is water activated, but that seems a bit silly, for the reasons I stated in my previous post, it is not just when planes are submerged or crash into the sea that it might be helpful to have a homing signal pinging away, we have the technology, otherwise how would air traffic control know where the aircraft was in the first place ? it seems crazy that a black box doesn't have the same equipment that the cockpit has in sending out a signal to ATC, often the cockpit is destroyed but the black box is not, which means that the signal the cockpit sends to ATC is lost.
I know I am
The simple fact is that the aircraft wreckage will be found by an emergency location transmitter. However the batteries on these tend to last no more than 48 hours reflecting the easier locating and rescue of people on board and the increased likelihood of surviving. This is not the black box that you keep talking about. If an aircraft crashes on land the boxes will be easier to locate within the wreckage.
The black box has the submersible activation method to locate the black box, not necessarily the aircraft, because wreckage settling on the sea floor can be spread over a larger area, dispersed by tidal influences and even covered over by shifting sands. The chemical reaction in the submersible activator will last for around 30 days.
