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Honesty

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Unknown User
Well All this seems to have descended into chaos as per usual :sad: :sad: :sad:
I do believe the original topic was one of "Honesty"
Not "Lets all argue like school playground dwellers"
So , on the subject of HONESTY - I honestly believe this forum thread seems to have gone off track slightly :bounce:
Quote by dee_licious
Is being honest a good thing?
E.G:
The person who is honest with their lover but not their partner.
I personally appreciate honesty. That way I can make my own mind up about a person.
dee x
Unknown User
Quote by Rogue_Trader
DLT is facing a further 3 charges,
Michael Le Vell wasn't part of Operation Yew tree
Nigel Evans wasn't part of Operation Yew Tree
more have been found guilty, but it has always been a policy of not naming and shaming on SH especially as this is a very contentious and current line of investigation, so best to leave it be.

First point: DLT was never convicted of ANY of the 14 offenses with which he was charged! What is happening is the CPS are now having a second bite at this failure as 2 of those 14 were not unanimous dismissals and have chucked in a third. The man is INNOCENT!!
Second point: What the hell as 'Operation yew Tree' got to do with it? I never mentioned it. I was making the point about failed cases? These people were put through hell and back (and in both Evans' and Travis' cases financially destroyed) and were innocent at all times. The Police failed and the innocent paid. Utterly shameful! And my list wasn't complete but was just sufficient to make the point.
Last Point: the Police are becoming totally inept at catching criminals and are filling the Courts with high profile cases to make 'good copy' in the media. Their Union is a particularly vicious body not afraid to bring down elected MPs from their Cabinet posts when it suits their Left Wing political objectives. They resist all and every reform and are now proven liars to anyone who challenges them. Hillsborough, Lawrence, Mitchell etc etc. They used to serve US now they serve themselves.
And I can safely report that Jimmy Saville remains dead at this time....
Unknown User
i was going to add something.
but what happened here? lol
pebble
Casanova
Quote by tyracer
i was going to add something.
but what happened here? lol

Just ride past! Don't look! :lol:
Big_Fraser
Orgasminator
Quote by pebble
i was going to add something.
but what happened here? lol

Just ride past! Don't look! :lol:
Shhhh pebble, I have ordered 100 cans of coke and Im currently cooking burgers, hot dogs and making popcorn (and cockporn).
Mad Frankie Frasers refreshment stand is open during the half time interval.
Honest :lol:
Unknown User
Quote by Chish
Last Point: the Police are becoming totally inept at catching criminals and are filling the Courts with high profile cases to make 'good copy' in the media.

I don't agree with the above, you're just pulling up headline cases that are failing, the entire legal system itself is creaking, criteria on burden of proof appears to have changed, the court system is bulging, prisons bulging, Judges overworked, Legal Funding all but extinguished and the amount of red tape & hoops that CPS/Police/Courts/Solicitors/Barristers/Prosecution/Judges seem to have to have jump though appears to have gotten past a joke.
Blaming the Police is easy, it's much bigger than that.
Unknown User
Quote by Toots

Last Point: the Police are becoming totally inept at catching criminals and are filling the Courts with high profile cases to make 'good copy' in the media.

I don't agree with the above, you're just pulling up headline cases that are failing, the entire legal system itself is creaking, criteria on burden of proof appears to have changed, the court system is bulging, prisons bulging, Judges overworked, Legal Funding all but extinguished and the amount of red tape & hoops that CPS/Police/Courts/Solicitors/Barristers/Prosecution/Judges seem to have to have jump though appears to have gotten past a joke.
Blaming the Police is easy, it's much bigger than that.
Taken as simplistic statement, as you selectively quoted, then you could pull it apart as you have done. You have quite rightly added in perfectly valid other factors as well but not totally police related and no excuse for failing to arrive at convictions which by definition rest on conclusive evidence found by the Police.
Its a shame you didn't also add the rest part of which was: "They resist all and every reform and are now proven liars to anyone who challenges them. Hillsborough, Lawrence, Mitchell etc etc. They used to serve US now they serve themselves." And which gives the context to why I said what I did. The Police have repeatedly misled Governments, told lies to cover their failings and destroyed people's reputations and finances when they can't otherwise nail someone. THAT has nothing to do with court / Law / procedures / hoops / changes you mention.
Big_Fraser
Orgasminator
HOTDOGS, GET YOUR HOTDOGS HERE, TWO FOR £5 YOUR HOTDOGS !! :karaoke:
Unknown User
Quote by Chish
Taken as simplistic statement, as you selectively quoted, then you could pull it apart as you have done. You have quite rightly added in perfectly valid other factors as well but not totally police related and no excuse for failing to arrive at convictions which by definition rest on conclusive evidence found by the Police.

Rubbish, the Police in some instances pass their evidence on to the CPS for them to decide as to whether or not to proceed who in turn have an their own criteria for proceeding (or not as the case may be) also, the Police may have all the evidence they need but for a variety of reasons such as Red Tape and other stuff of which some is out of their control they decide not to or are advised against proceeding.
Quote by Chish
Its a shame you didn't also add the rest part

I chose to ignore the majority of the rhetoric in your post but instead simply answered your 'Final Point'
But *deep breath* resist reform? What of the Police Reform & Social Responsibility Bill? ACPO's 2011 stated view seems to counter your 'resist reform' but instead offersd a balanced view as to the way forward whilst still protecting their core principles.

As for proven liars, there is no doubt it happens, it's nothing new I'm surprised you seem to appear to think so? Corruption exists, it's not specific to the Police and although their appears to be some Police that are rotten to the core it is my experience that the vast majority of Police officers are decent,honest hardworking individuals that work in very difficult/challenging conditions on an ever changing landscape in a job that from the outside looks easy but to those working it is something altogether different. I do not envy a Police officer their job.
Unknown User
Quote by Big_Fraser
HOTDOGS, GET YOUR HOTDOGS HERE, TWO FOR £5 YOUR HOTDOGS !! :karaoke:

smile ha ha .. I'm rooting for Toots!!
I'm not quite sure how this has been hijacked into a bitter issue ridden police bashing thread... Oh wait.. Hold on... Yes I do :)
Big_Fraser
Orgasminator
Quote by the_magik_s
I'm not quite sure how this has been hijacked into a bitter issue ridden police bashing thread...

I have been around various forums long enough to expect this kind of thing every now and again, I have even been involved with a few debates that went kinda Ron Burgundy

:giggle:
Unknown User
Quote by Big_Fraser
HOTDOGS, GET YOUR HOTDOGS HERE, TWO FOR £5 YOUR HOTDOGS !! :karaoke:

I don't think I want to buy your hotdogs at that price! All that dosh for a piece of meat :rascal:
dee_licious
Orgasminator
FFS how did my post end up causing a riot :sad:
I asked about honesty in relationships. Whilst I appreciate everyone has a right to their own opinions.
I do not class myself as "scum" just because I choose to have a relationship with someone who is married.
"people in glass houses shouldnt throw stones"
Big_Fraser
Orgasminator
Quote by dee_licious
FFS how did my post end up causing a riot :sad:

Totally not your fault, you opened and perfectly valid and interesting topic and it kinda got Hijacked. Dont be a sad lil dee :therethere:
Quote by dee_licious
I do not class myself as "scum" just because I choose to have a relationship with someone who is married.

I think some of the terms and language in this topic have not been condusive to an open and frank discussion, maybe reading easy's topic on the forums would help people interact without as much friction:http://www.swingingheaven.co.uk/swingers-forum/viewtopic/307158.html
I certainly wouldn't consider you at all callous or vindictive in your actions Dee so would not even consider judging you xx
Quote by flirty_4
I don't think I want to buy your hotdogs at that price! All that dosh for a piece of meat :rascal:

I wont charge you for the sausage if you dont charge me for the buns :rascal:
Interval is over - I'm off out of this topic again now.....
Made a tidy profit and showed Flirty my sausage so Im.....
bolt
Unknown User
Quote by dee_licious
FFS how did my post end up causing a riot :sad:
I asked about honesty in relationships. Whilst I appreciate everyone has a right to their own opinions.
I do not class myself as "scum" just because I choose to have a relationship with someone who is married.
"people in glass houses shouldnt throw stones"

I agree. There's no need to tar people just because it's something others don't agree on. Come on folks, we're all adults here. No need to burn bridges,
Make love not war :rascal:
Unknown User
Quote by Big_Fraser
FFS how did my post end up causing a riot :sad:

Totally not your fault, you opened and perfectly valid and interesting topic and it kinda got Hijacked. Dont be a sad lil dee :therethere:
Quote by dee_licious
I do not class myself as "scum" just because I choose to have a relationship with someone who is married.

I think some of the terms and language in this topic have not been condusive to an open and frank discussion, maybe reading easy's topic on the forums would help people interact without as much friction:http://www.swingingheaven.co.uk/swingers-forum/viewtopic/307158.html
I certainly wouldn't consider you at all callous or vindictive in your actions Dee so would not even consider judging you xx
Quote by flirty_4
I don't think I want to buy your hotdogs at that price! All that dosh for a piece of meat :rascal:

I wont charge you for the sausage if you dont charge me for the buns :rascal:
Interval is over - I'm off out of this topic again now.....
Made a tidy profit and showed Flirty my sausage so Im.....
bolt
I have some raspberry nipple ice cream for afters :rascal:
Unknown User
Quote by dee_licious
I do not class myself as "scum" ...

Sort of how I felt being called 'utterly vile and disgusting". And why I bit hard. Sorry it was me who hijacked your Thread Dee.
won't happen again as I am out of here...
Unknown User
Quote by Chish
I do not class myself as "scum" ...

Sort of how I felt being called 'utterly vile and disgusting". And why I bit hard. Sorry it was me who hijacked your Thread Dee.
won't happen again as I am out of here...
I did not call anyone scum, I said I think people who cheat on partners are scum, a fine line perhaps but it is my opinion and my opinion counts for nothing in the big wide world, I also said that I think people who cheat should do so because it is their choice, I will not lie to appease some people, most know that what they are doing is wrong to many people and that some people think that while not perhaps right it is a simple yes or no choice to do it and they are not bad people or scum for doing it.
Some people actively seek those that are cheating in the swinging lifestyle believing that they will be more discrete about their meets with them, that they will be less clingy etc.
We are all adults and providing people make it clear that they are cheating then long may they enjoy themselves, because by being clear about what they are doing others have the choice of partaking in the deception or avoiding them.
As for inept police, I do not believe the police are inept, I do believe they are in a no win situation, they catch criminals and the Home Office directives ensure that the most they can do is give them a warning, even when they think that it is worth taking them to court the CPS can intervene and decide that it is not in the publics interest to press charges, usually based on the costs of a trial. Then to make their job even harder the sentances handed down are a joke.
I have said it before and I will say it again, the Police would have very little to do if they were not dealing with repeat criminals who should already be in prison.
We are living with a false economy believing that we are saving money by not imprisoning criminals or letting them out too soon because the costs to courts, Police, probation services and the public is far greater than the cost of incarceration.
Watch Police Interceptors and other such programmes and count the cost of what the Police do to catch a car thief, half a dozen police cars, a helicopter etc only to hear that the thief was then released without charge or given a Police warning for the umpteenth time.
Unknown User
Quote by MidsCouple24
I do not class myself as "scum" ...

Sort of how I felt being called 'utterly vile and disgusting". And why I bit hard. Sorry it was me who hijacked your Thread Dee.
won't happen again as I am out of here...
Erm, I didn't actually call you V&D, but then I've pointed that out already. But let's be honest, Your anti police tangent was a bit bizarre though mate.
As for inept police, I do not believe the police are inept, I do believe they are in a no win situation, they catch criminals and the Home Office directives ensure that the most they can do is give them a warning, even when they think that it is worth taking them to court the CPS can intervene and decide that it is not in the publics interest to press charges, usually based on the costs of a trial. Then to make their job even harder the sentances handed down are a joke.
I have said it before and I will say it again, the Police would have very little to do if they were not dealing with repeat criminals who should already be in prison.
We are living with a false economy believing that we are saving money by not imprisoning criminals or letting them out too soon because the costs to courts, Police, probation services and the public is far greater than the cost of incarceration.
Watch Police Interceptors and other such programmes and count the cost of what the Police do to catch a car thief, half a dozen police cars, a helicopter etc only to hear that the thief was then released without charge or given a Police warning for the umpteenth time.
And mids couple, at least we agree on one thing. Fair play - I could have written that myself smile
Unknown User
Quote by Big_Fraser
HOTDOGS, GET YOUR HOTDOGS HERE, TWO FOR £5 YOUR HOTDOGS !! :karaoke:

Got any Nachos Fraser?????????
nom Nom Nom :happy:
Unknown User
Quote by flirty_4
HOTDOGS, GET YOUR HOTDOGS HERE, TWO FOR £5 YOUR HOTDOGS !! :karaoke:

I don't think I want to buy your hotdogs at that price! All that dosh for a piece of meat :rascal:
Oh shush you, and show us ya fun baags!! wink
Unknown User
Quote by the_magik_s
HOTDOGS, GET YOUR HOTDOGS HERE, TWO FOR £5 YOUR HOTDOGS !! :karaoke:

I don't think I want to buy your hotdogs at that price! All that dosh for a piece of meat :rascal:
Oh shush you, and show us ya fun baags!! wink
I'm happy to help there, Magik :rascal:
Unknown User
to me its simple....teat others as you would like to be treated yourself.
So if you lie and cheat on your partner......expect people to lie and cheat on you !!!
From experience I would say its not nice , when you find out.
Big_Fraser
Orgasminator
Quote by Katniss
Got any Nachos Fraser?????????

Fresh batch in the frier now ;)
Cant seem to find anyting tangy and tasty to dip them in though, any ideas?? :rascal:
Unknown User
Quote by Big_Fraser
Got any Nachos Fraser?????????

Fresh batch in the frier now ;)
Cant seem to find anytting tangy and tasty to dip them in though, any ideas?? :rascal:
Got nothing cheesy?
:giggle: bolt
capricornten
Sexlightened
Quote by Rogue_Trader
Ha ha .. You're using the 'PREJUDGEMENT' of poor Jimmy Saville's antics as a way to discredit the police. That's an intelligent argument.
I said your defence of JS was vile and disgusting, I didn't say you were. #Touchy

Ah so its OK to DO vile and disgusting things and still not BE vile and disgusting. OKaaayyy
Nicely swerved on prejudice ... No I was calling YOU out for being prejudiced which you clearly are judging by your statements about Saville and myself. I was also adding that the Police were hopeless at prosecuting these sort of alleged crimes as we have seen recently with a string of failed cases costing £Millions.
Two distinct points but clearly one too many for you to handle.
String of failed cases???
Only William Roache...everyone else is either still awaiting trial or have been found guilty and imprisoned.
And your comment that someone is not guilty because they are dead and haven't stood trial for their crime would also put most spree murderers as innocent, would also put a lot of dictators as innocent as well...
well said, damnit.
honesty is subjective.
Saville was guilty, its just the incredible level that's so hard to fathom.