it looks like ukip's popularity is growing
what part of their policies do you think are becoming popular with the British voter ?
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ukip on the rise
Sex God
Quote by Lizaleanrob
it looks like ukip's popularity is growing
what part of their policies do you think are becoming popular with the British voter ?
In times of recession when there is unemployment, low wages and general unhapiness amongst the population a Nationalist agenda will always appeal. It is just the easiest and most natural thing in the world to blame the foreigners and hyping up that issue is almost guaranteed to get attention from unhappy people. Why look in the mirror and sort your own problems out when you can blame someone else?
Notwithstanding that, I think there is a general feeling that the mainstream parties have all morphed into a fairly middle of the road, non extreme, fudge of grey politics and in times of crisis people naturally look for something that is visibly different.
I happen to think (and have experienced) an increase of racial intolerance over the last couple of years as have Eastern European friends of ours. Barbed remarks are now made openly (don't know if that is actually a good thing as before it was probably behind their back). Internet forums make for very uncomfortable reading these days with calls for "closing the doors" and "sending them back." I would not like to be a non native UK national in this country at the moment with the sentiment of this kind that is around - sentiment that is masqueading as a solution to all of our problems.
Quote by Too Hot
I happen to think (and have experienced) an increase of racial intolerance over the last couple of years as have Eastern European friends of ours. Barbed remarks are now made openly (don't know if that is actually a good thing as before it was probably behind their back). Internet forums make for very uncomfortable reading these days with calls for "closing the doors" and "sending them back." I would not like to be a non native UK national in this country at the moment with the sentiment of this kind that is around - sentiment that is masqueading as a solution to all of our problems.
It's the British way and it disgusts me. When I can get away with it, I prefer not to admit I'm British for fear of being tarred with the same brush.
What is it about the British that makes them feel so superior over everyone else?
Former eastern bloc workers are hard working, do an excellent job and don't rip you off. That they take jobs away from fat, lazy, immoral overpaid British workers is in the very best interests of competition and is to be encouraged. In typical fashion, the Brits fail to understand the logic and are often screwed senseless by their own kind. I realise it's good Television but just how many people are robbed by rogue British builders who disappear with the job value in cash up front. How does this happen? The Brit builder often suggests that the customer can get it on the cheap and not pay VAT by stumping up the cash before the first nail is hammered. And it not only happens in England, Brits in France frequently rip off fellow Brits in exactly the same way! I have yet to hear of this being the case with Polish builders.
Where I do agree with Farage is that the UK cannot afford to continue the Blairite doctrine allowing all comers to the UK. It is unaffordable. AFAIK there is no UKIP policy which follows the line taken by Enoch Powell suggesting that all foreigners be paid off and sent back from whence they came. What they do suggest is that the borders should be controlled more and that is no bad thing. As a UK citizen, I have an absolute right of access to the rest of mainland Europe but that access is not without rules. For residency in France or Spain for example, there are clear rules requiring proof that you will not become a financial burden on the State. If you cannot provide such proof, you cannot legally reside. If you disrespect the laws of your host State, you can be expelled. Maybe there are some lessons to be learned from other European States.
The British are very good at the blame game. They blame everyone else for their own shortcomings.
Quote by Lizaleanrob
it looks like ukip's popularity is growing
what part of their policies do you think are becoming popular with the British voter ?
There are many Rob and that is the reason they will be having my vote next time around.
Some of their policies get the big :thumbup: from me.
End the ban on smoking in allocated rooms in public houses, clubs and hotels. Even though I am a non smoker, the smoking ban has far exceeded what it was originally supposed to do.
The law of the land must be single and apply to us all. We oppose any other system of law. We see day after day the same laws applying to some sections of our society, and others it seems are allowed to flaunt it. That has to change and no matter what colour or religion you are, the laws must be the same for all.
Support grammar schools and vocational education.:thumbup:
Assure for all people prompt and caring treatment in ill health.:thumbup:
Repeal the Human Rights Act to end abuses by convicted criminals and illegal immigrants.:thumbup:
Double prison places to enforce zero tolerance on crime.:thumbup:
The tide of mass EU immigration has pushed down wages and restricted job opportunities. Only by leaving the EU can we regain control of our borders.:thumbup: The biggest reason for me why they will get my vote.
The UK Independence Party's position on this issue may be stated simply: while UKIP fully supports the concept of civil partnerships, it opposes the move to legislate for same-sex marriage.:thumbup:
I will never again vote either Tory or Labour ever again. I have over the years voted for both of them, and they are really now just one party. Nigel Farage seems like a genuinely nice guy and is the one least likely to flop when answering his questions on programmes such as Question Time. He ticks many of the boxes for many new voters Rob.
There are other things as well Rob, but these are a good enough reason for me. Seems Rotherham Council do not approve though. :notes:
Quote by GnV
The British are very good at the blame game. They blame everyone else for their own shortcomings.
Makes it sound like you hate Britain and I can then understand why you live in France. But surely if you have nothing good to say, why keep your British passport? Why not just become French? Of course the French never moan about anything, do they?
Oh and for the record, I think the British are THE most tolerant of countries on this planet. Also I think we have very few shortcomings, and far less than some of our European neighbours. For me I love living here and I love being English, the most wonderful of places.
Sex God
Quote by starlightcouple
End the ban on smoking in allocated rooms in public houses, clubs and hotels. Even though I am a non smoker, the smoking ban has far exceeded what it was originally supposed to do.
The law of the land must be single and apply to us all. We oppose any other system of law. We see day after day the same laws applying to some sections of our society, and others it seems are allowed to flaunt it. That has to change and no matter what colour or religion you are, the laws must be the same for all.
Support grammar schools and vocational education.:thumbup:
Assure for all people prompt and caring treatment in ill health.:thumbup:
Repeal the Human Rights Act to end abuses by convicted criminals and illegal immigrants.:thumbup:
Double prison places to enforce zero tolerance on crime.:thumbup:
The tide of mass EU immigration has pushed down wages and restricted job opportunities. Only by leaving the EU can we regain control of our borders.:thumbup: The biggest reason for me why they will get my vote.
The UK Independence Party's position on this issue may be stated simply: while UKIP fully supports the concept of civil partnerships, it opposes the move to legislate for same-sex marriage.:thumbup:
Nigel Farage seems like a genuinely nice guy and is the one least likely to flop when answering his questions on programmes such as Question Time. He ticks many of the boxes for many new voters Rob.
There are other things as well Rob, but these are a good enough reason for me. Seems Rotherham Council do not approve though. :notes:
The list you have given there Star is such an easy list of ideas for a fringe party to come up with because they just do not have to cost it out.
End the ban on smoking in allocated rooms in public houses, clubs and hotels. -
Disagree completely this has been a great victory and a great success, not to mention that now that we don't come home at night stinking of other peoples smoke.
The law of the land must be single and apply to us all. We oppose any other system of law. We see day after day the same laws applying to some sections of our society, and others it seems are allowed to flaunt it. That has to change and no matter what colour or religion you are, the laws must be the same for all.
Eh??? The law is the law Star - give us some examples of the English law that is not being enforced and another one is over-riding it?
Support grammar schools and vocational education
Good, long standing conservative policy that they can't implement because of opposition to Grammar Schools by the general population - how will UKIP change that attitude?
Assure for all people prompt and caring treatment in ill health
Altruistic and sensible, no one disagrees but cost is a major factor - where will funding come from.
Repeal the Human Rights Act to end abuses by convicted criminals and illegal immigrants -
And members of the general public who are mistreatred, wrongly arrested and unlawfully imprisoned (makes up 90% of the human rights cases in this country whereas the Abu Hamza type of newstory is just a tiny percentage).
Double prison places to enforce zero tolerance on crime - cost? funding?
The tide of mass EU immigration has pushed down wages and restricted job opportunities. Only by leaving the EU can we regain control of our borders:thumbup: The biggest reason for me why they will get my vote.
This is where I think the crux of the matter lies and it is a kneee jerk reaction to a problem that cannot be so simply fixed. Regrettably UK PLC is a bit of a non entity in the global scale of things these days and a stand alone UK might have a good Nationalist ring to it but what would we do on our own? I know - kick out all the Eastern Europeans and get the wages back up, then we can make things so expensively that no one will buy them. That won't work and WE ARE a part of Europe and 50% of all inward investment into the UK comes from Europe. In case you hadn't noticed there is a massive, worldwide economic correction on and former thirds world countries are about to become the new major economic superpowers of the world - where does that leave little England and its Little Englanders? Just to make that point - Did you see that Tata are opening a massive plant in China to build Land Rovers and Range Rovers? That should be the biggest wake up call of all for UK PLC - The best cars in the world going to be manufactured where production costs are about one tenth of the UK.
Getting out of Europe and closing the doors has other unintended consequences - you can't just pick on Eastern Europeans - what about the Irish passport holders? The French, the German and the Spanish? The hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of non native UK residents now live and contribute in our society. Where do you draw the line and how? What will happen to the 600,000+ British passport holders currently living and working in France & Spain - will they suddenly become persona non grata in those countries? Or is the idea just to racially target Poles, Czechs etc cos they are taking all the pub and hotel jobs? What about the other 5,000,000 British passport holders who live abroad? THey like to call themselves expats not immingrants - but hey - one mans immigrant is another mans expat.
The UK Independence Party's position on this issue may be stated simply: while UKIP fully supports the concept of civil partnerships, it opposes the move to legislate for same-sex marriage. We live in modern times and the Bible is a work of fiction proven by science. People need to get over archaic pre-conceptions and allow people to live the lawful life that they choose.
Nigel Farage seems like a genuinely nice guy and is the one least likely to flop when answering his questions on programmes such as Question Time. He ticks many of the boxes for many new voters - Agreed, but he has yet to be scrutinised and it ids easy as a fringe party to beat the drum, fly the flag and not to have to have auditable policies.
The beauty of politics Too Hot, is that people agree to disagree on most of the ' other s' policies.
I have tried the others and now UKIP is obviously on the rise. Places like Rotherham it seems are running scared of them and their policies.
I have given my reasons and those reasons are there for all to see on their web page, and in their manifesto. The questions you ask of my reasons for voting for them are irrlevant really to me, as they will get my vote. If you would like to ask the same questions to UKIP that are in their manifesto, then they have a telephone number on their web page....give them a tinkle.
The one I will pick up on quickly is the smoking one. I do not smoke and whilst I agree that the banning of smoking in public areas a good thing, the whole blanket ban is unfair and it is obvious you are a non smoker hence your views but, what I do not like is the people who had the power to ban smoking in ALL public places were anti non smokers themselves so had their own agendas.
That is like giving a person who hates the motor car the job to curb their use. It surely should have a mixture of people who can put all sides to it. The pub industry was struggling before the ban, but now they have almost gone to the wall, caused in so many cases to the complete ban of smoking. So whole industries suffer whereby leaving a few smoking pubs that give people the CHOICE ( remember that word Too Hot? ) the CHOICE to do as they wish. The Government are as always quick to takes the hundreds of millions of pounds every year in tax revenue, but then hypocritically stopping those people from smoking almost anywhere.
You hate smoking and you now have a choice, but smokers had their choices taken away from them by anti smoking lobbyists. Democracy eh?
I have tried the others and now UKIP is obviously on the rise. Places like Rotherham it seems are running scared of them and their policies.
I have given my reasons and those reasons are there for all to see on their web page, and in their manifesto. The questions you ask of my reasons for voting for them are irrlevant really to me, as they will get my vote. If you would like to ask the same questions to UKIP that are in their manifesto, then they have a telephone number on their web page....give them a tinkle.
The one I will pick up on quickly is the smoking one. I do not smoke and whilst I agree that the banning of smoking in public areas a good thing, the whole blanket ban is unfair and it is obvious you are a non smoker hence your views but, what I do not like is the people who had the power to ban smoking in ALL public places were anti non smokers themselves so had their own agendas.
That is like giving a person who hates the motor car the job to curb their use. It surely should have a mixture of people who can put all sides to it. The pub industry was struggling before the ban, but now they have almost gone to the wall, caused in so many cases to the complete ban of smoking. So whole industries suffer whereby leaving a few smoking pubs that give people the CHOICE ( remember that word Too Hot? ) the CHOICE to do as they wish. The Government are as always quick to takes the hundreds of millions of pounds every year in tax revenue, but then hypocritically stopping those people from smoking almost anywhere.
You hate smoking and you now have a choice, but smokers had their choices taken away from them by anti smoking lobbyists. Democracy eh?
Sex God
Quote by Lizaleanrob
it looks like ukip's popularity is growing
what part of their policies do you think are becoming popular with the British voter ?
Their policies.......... think it's more to do with dis-affected Tories from looking at the results, and as for the Lib Dems the coalition is just sinking them with the well highlighted pledge and policy u-turns.
Shame there's no credible opposition, although this is allowing the others to flourish again in between General Elections
I'd like to pick up on the smoking ban.
I'll declare my interest as a reformed smoker; I gave up over 20 years ago.
The ban exists here in France too but.....
In the bars and restaurants of the larger conurbationions, the ban is enforced generally. Here in the deepest parts of rural France it seems not so. There is a choice - and the French generally are often left to make their own choices. If you enter a bar and it's full of tobacco smoke and you find it offensive, you leave and find another bar. As star says, the licenced trade in the UK is almost sunk. The pub was the life and soul of small rural communities and they are fast closing down as local authorities pay people to squeal on their fellow man desperately trying to eke out an ever increasingly miserable existence under the weight of regulation after regulation.
I despair.
Whole communities are now being left without a focal point. People are frightened to go out and find it much easier to buy cheap 2 for 1 deals on alcohol at their local supermarket and drink at home. Instead of 'measured' measures, they judge the quantity in their glass by the number of 'glugs' and invariably are drinking more. The medical think tanks then complain about the increase in alcoholicism. It's a viscious circle. A merry go round that people are finding it increasingly difficult to get off.
At the pub, the publican invariably knew his customers very well and would 'look out' for those descending into new depths. The supermarkets have no such morals.
The smoking ban may account for more than we give it credit for.
I'll declare my interest as a reformed smoker; I gave up over 20 years ago.
The ban exists here in France too but.....
In the bars and restaurants of the larger conurbationions, the ban is enforced generally. Here in the deepest parts of rural France it seems not so. There is a choice - and the French generally are often left to make their own choices. If you enter a bar and it's full of tobacco smoke and you find it offensive, you leave and find another bar. As star says, the licenced trade in the UK is almost sunk. The pub was the life and soul of small rural communities and they are fast closing down as local authorities pay people to squeal on their fellow man desperately trying to eke out an ever increasingly miserable existence under the weight of regulation after regulation.
I despair.
Whole communities are now being left without a focal point. People are frightened to go out and find it much easier to buy cheap 2 for 1 deals on alcohol at their local supermarket and drink at home. Instead of 'measured' measures, they judge the quantity in their glass by the number of 'glugs' and invariably are drinking more. The medical think tanks then complain about the increase in alcoholicism. It's a viscious circle. A merry go round that people are finding it increasingly difficult to get off.
At the pub, the publican invariably knew his customers very well and would 'look out' for those descending into new depths. The supermarkets have no such morals.
The smoking ban may account for more than we give it credit for.
Sex God
There are a number of points to consider in the run up to this by election.
The outgoing Labour MP had to resign after an expenses scandal.
The nominated Labour candidate was not welcomed by the local party members, half of whom walked out of the selection meeting.
The recent removal of children from UKIP supporters.
The current ConDem government is unpopular.
There can be no denying that UKIP have done well to beat larger, better funded mainstream parties, however I wonder how many of the votes they received in Rotherham were protest votes against the three main parties, or sympathy votes.
The outgoing Labour MP had to resign after an expenses scandal.
The nominated Labour candidate was not welcomed by the local party members, half of whom walked out of the selection meeting.
The recent removal of children from UKIP supporters.
The current ConDem government is unpopular.
There can be no denying that UKIP have done well to beat larger, better funded mainstream parties, however I wonder how many of the votes they received in Rotherham were protest votes against the three main parties, or sympathy votes.
Sex God
Quote by GnV
I'd like to pick up on the smoking ban.
I'll declare my interest as a reformed smoker; I gave up over 20 years ago.
The ban exists here in France too but.....
In the bars and restaurants of the larger conurbationions, the ban is enforced generally. Here in the deepest parts of rural France it seems not so. There is a choice - and the French generally are often left to make their own choices. If you enter a bar and it's full of tobacco smoke and you find it offensive, you leave and find another bar. As star says, the licenced trade in the UK is almost sunk. The pub was the life and soul of small rural communities and they are fast closing down as local authorities pay people to squeal on their fellow man desperately trying to eke out an ever increasingly miserable existence under the weight of regulation after regulation.
I despair.
Whole communities are now being left without a focal point. People are frightened to go out and find it much easier to buy cheap 2 for 1 deals on alcohol at their local supermarket and drink at home. Instead of 'measured' measures, they judge the quantity in their glass by the number of 'glugs' and invariably are drinking more. The medical think tanks then complain about the increase in alcoholicism. It's a viscious circle. A merry go round that people are finding it increasingly difficult to get off.
At the pub, the publican invariably knew his customers very well and would 'look out' for those descending into new depths. The supermarkets have no such morals.
The smoking ban may account for more than we give it credit for.
But life goes on, the idea is to progress and make things better.
How was it better when men came home from work, left the family at home to go down to the pub? The local "pub" as a stinking grotty little hovel full of stale tobacco smoke and yellow ceilings is dead - and good riddance. Is it not better to have cleaner, more modern establishments that cater for men, women and families? Have we not moved on a bit from the "local" as depicted on Coronation Street and for which there appears to be some strange nostalgia?
Quote by Lizaleanrob
it looks like ukip's popularity is growing
what part of their policies do you think are becoming popular with the British voter ?
It may just be possible that the popularity is with the 'English' voters rather than British ones. (Yes there is a difference).
I am on my local council's advice team. I am sent emails and questionnaires almost daily when they want opinions of afew rather than the masses. The demographic questions at the end of their surveys did not contain English. It did however specify around twenty non European based countries for ethnicity. There's racism for you :sad:
It now contains English and I no longer have to select 'other'.
Looking at my current circumstances - fully time employed, mortgaged, parent, husband. paying more than my fair share of tax, car owner etc etc, the main parties don't seem to be working for my benefit. All they seem to want me to do is pay even more to help others.
I am not 'party loyal' I have over time voted for whichever party suggests they will offer me more help than the others. As my circumstances change, so may my 'X'.
Quote by Too Hot
But life goes on, the idea is to progress and make things better.
What a naive outlook on life. Why because people change things, they all end up being for the better? Really? No not always as sometimes change can be for the worse.
Quote by Too Hot
How was it better when men came home from work, left the family at home to go down to the pub? The local "pub" as a stinking grotty little hovel full of stale tobacco smoke and yellow ceilings is dead - and good riddance. Is it not better to have cleaner, more modern establishments that cater for men, women and families? Have we not moved on a bit from the "local" as depicted on Coronation Street and for which there appears to be some strange nostalgia?
See Too Hot exactly as I stated earlier. You do not smoke and so because of that you want to take away others rights to do so. Nobody forced anyone to go into a ' stinking grotty little hovel full of stale tobacco smoke and yellow ceilings ', it was because of choice. I seem to remember threads of late that you have commented on, whereby it is your way or the highway. You want to change things for what YOU seem to think is for the better.
I do not smoke but am aware that people's liberties are being taken away from them by people like you and then say it is change for the better. Better for who? You or them? You hide behind the excuses of change for the better, sometimes it is change for change sake. You seem to be more than happy to be able to force people to comply with your line of thinking, a bit like your comment you made about the church and their views on gay marriage. The church and those views have been around for hundreds and hundreds of years, and yet because you do not agree with their very fundamentals of their faith you want, no sorry demand change. I hope the church stands firm on this issue, not because I am anti gay marriage, but because it is what the churches beliefs and values are. I think it is a dreadful way to view things and to demand change on people through force of legislation and then say fuck the church as they are all old fashioned old codgers and they now have to move with the times, and then care not a fuck about their values and their faith. What a strange view to have on life.
I think the Jeremy Clarkson approach should be taken with anyone who drives a 4x4. Shoot em in front of their families.
Quote by starlightcouple
See Too Hot exactly as I stated earlier. You do not smoke and so because of that you want to take away others rights to do so. Nobody forced anyone to go into a ' stinking grotty little hovel full of stale tobacco smoke and yellow ceilings ', it was because of choice. I seem to remember threads of late that you have commented on, whereby it is your way or the highway. You want to change things for what YOU seem to think is for the better.
What choice did non smokers have before the smoking ban? The only choice we had was either to go into a pub full of smoke or not to. There were not any pubs that enforced a voluntary ban on smoking.
I'm with Too Hot all the way on this one. If it has to come down to choice between those who smoke and those who don't, let's opt for the healthy option. Why should I have to suffer the effects of passive smoking just to enjoy a pint?
Quote by Max777
See Too Hot exactly as I stated earlier. You do not smoke and so because of that you want to take away others rights to do so. Nobody forced anyone to go into a ' stinking grotty little hovel full of stale tobacco smoke and yellow ceilings ', it was because of choice. I seem to remember threads of late that you have commented on, whereby it is your way or the highway. You want to change things for what YOU seem to think is for the better.
What choice did non smokers have before the smoking ban? The only choice we had was either to go into a pub full of smoke or not to. There were not any pubs that enforced a voluntary ban on smoking.
I'm with Too Hot all the way on this one. If it has to come down to choice between those who smoke and those who don't, let's opt for the healthy option. Why should I have to suffer the effects of passive smoking just to enjoy a pint?
Who says you have to?
Vote with your feet and go to a non smoking pub....
Quote by GnV
See Too Hot exactly as I stated earlier. You do not smoke and so because of that you want to take away others rights to do so. Nobody forced anyone to go into a ' stinking grotty little hovel full of stale tobacco smoke and yellow ceilings ', it was because of choice. I seem to remember threads of late that you have commented on, whereby it is your way or the highway. You want to change things for what YOU seem to think is for the better.
What choice did non smokers have before the smoking ban? The only choice we had was either to go into a pub full of smoke or not to. There were not any pubs that enforced a voluntary ban on smoking.
I'm with Too Hot all the way on this one. If it has to come down to choice between those who smoke and those who don't, let's opt for the healthy option. Why should I have to suffer the effects of passive smoking just to enjoy a pint?
Who says you have to?
Vote with your feet and go to a non smoking pub....
That's the point I'm making. Before the smoking ban, there were no non smoking pubs.
Quote by max
That's the point I'm making. Before the smoking ban, there were no non smoking pubs.
I see where you're coming from now max, but I do remember there was at least one pub we used to frequent before the ban that had enforced their own.
One even banned mobile phones and no chips were served with food orders. No one armed bandits and no mind numbing 'lift' music to encourage people to talk to each other.
Quote by GnV
That's the point I'm making. Before the smoking ban, there were no non smoking pubs.
I see where you're coming from now max, but I do remember there was at least one pub we used to frequent before the ban that had enforced their own.
One even banned mobile phones and no chips were served with food orders. No one armed bandits and no mind numbing 'lift' music to encourage people to talk to each other.
You onviously lived in a very civilised part of the world G. can't say I ever encountered a non smoking room let alone a non smoking pub prior to the ban.
The proprietors were of a certain age Max and sought to attract a particular clientele which they did very successfully. The younger, trendy set went elsewhere leaving us old farts to put the world to rights over some very nice guest beers.
Sadly, the owners health started to fail so they sold up and moved to the quieter climes of a Suffolk backwater where he could mess about in boats. They were all but retired anyway and non smokers themselves so couldn't care a stuff about what people thought.
Funny thing though, the Pub was often crammed full to the door!
Sadly, the owners health started to fail so they sold up and moved to the quieter climes of a Suffolk backwater where he could mess about in boats. They were all but retired anyway and non smokers themselves so couldn't care a stuff about what people thought.
Funny thing though, the Pub was often crammed full to the door!
Quote by GnV
The proprietors were of a certain age Max and sought to attract a particular clientele which they did very successfully. The younger, trendy set went elsewhere leaving us old farts to put the world to rights over some very nice guest beers.
Sadly, the owners health started to fail so they sold up and moved to the quieter climes of a Suffolk backwater where he could mess about in boats. They were all but retired anyway and non smokers themselves so couldn't care a stuff about what people thought.
Funny thing though, the Pub was often crammed full to the door!
Maybe that says it all!
Quote by Max777
The proprietors were of a certain age Max and sought to attract a particular clientele which they did very successfully. The younger, trendy set went elsewhere leaving us old farts to put the world to rights over some very nice guest beers.
Sadly, the owners health started to fail so they sold up and moved to the quieter climes of a Suffolk backwater where he could mess about in boats. They were all but retired anyway and non smokers themselves so couldn't care a stuff about what people thought.
Funny thing though, the Pub was often crammed full to the door!
Maybe that says it all!
Yes it does.
It says that you don't need to run a 'nanny' state controlling people's lives. People are quite capable of making their own choices!
Sex God
Quote by GnV
It says that you don't need to run a 'nanny' state controlling people's lives. People are quite capable of making their own choices!
so does this mean you find a good connection with ukip's policies on matters such as these G
after all ukip does have more than one policy and not just the immigration one that most jump on
Quote by GnV
The proprietors were of a certain age Max and sought to attract a particular clientele which they did very successfully. The younger, trendy set went elsewhere leaving us old farts to put the world to rights over some very nice guest beers.
Sadly, the owners health started to fail so they sold up and moved to the quieter climes of a Suffolk backwater where he could mess about in boats. They were all but retired anyway and non smokers themselves so couldn't care a stuff about what people thought.
Funny thing though, the Pub was often crammed full to the door!
Maybe that says it all!
Yes it does.
It says that you don't need to run a 'nanny' state controlling people's lives. People are quite capable of making their own choices!
Not so because if the ban was rescinded tomorrow, virtually every pub, if not all, would revert to smoking. Non smokers would again have no choice.
Not sure I follow your drift rob.
However, whilst I support some of their aspirations over Europe, a total withdrawal - if that is what their election manifesto would include - would be a deal breaker for me.
Living in France, voting UKIP might be likened to asking turkeys to vote for Christmas.
However, whilst I support some of their aspirations over Europe, a total withdrawal - if that is what their election manifesto would include - would be a deal breaker for me.
Living in France, voting UKIP might be likened to asking turkeys to vote for Christmas.
Sex God
Quote by GnV
Not sure I follow your drift rob.
However, whilst I support some of their aspirations over Europe, a total withdrawal - if that is what their election manifesto would include - would be a deal breaker for me.
Living in France, voting UKIP might be likened to asking turkeys to vote for Christmas.
from that point you couldn't possibly agree G, but i must say i like a quiet a few of their policies but not all
Sex God
Quote by starlightcouple
But life goes on, the idea is to progress and make things better.
What a naive outlook on life. Why because people change things, they all end up being for the better? Really? No not always as sometimes change can be for the worse.
Naiive?? You must be joking. Are you suggesting for one second that progress has not improved the quality of the human lives over the last 200 years? Water was good when you had to dig a well to get it, but it is much easier now that it comes out of a tap. We were infested with dyssentry and typhoid not that long but health measures reduced to toll of infections and people became healthier AND lived longer. I don't know how anyone can argue against action taken to improve the quality of peoples lives and make society healthier.
Quote by Too Hot
How was it better when men came home from work, left the family at home to go down to the pub? The local "pub" as a stinking grotty little hovel full of stale tobacco smoke and yellow ceilings is dead - and good riddance. Is it not better to have cleaner, more modern establishments that cater for men, women and families? Have we not moved on a bit from the "local" as depicted on Coronation Street and for which there appears to be some strange nostalgia?
Quote by starlightcouple
See Too Hot exactly as I stated earlier. You do not smoke and so because of that you want to take away others rights to do so. Nobody forced anyone to go into a ' stinking grotty little hovel full of stale tobacco smoke and yellow ceilings ', it was because of choice. I seem to remember threads of late that you have commented on, whereby it is your way or the highway. You want to change things for what YOU seem to think is for the better.
I do not smoke but am aware that people's liberties are being taken away from them by people like you and then say it is change for the better. Better for who? You or them? You hide behind the excuses of change for the better, sometimes it is change for change sake. You seem to be more than happy to be able to force people to comply with your line of thinking, a bit like your comment you made about the church and their views on gay marriage. The church and those views have been around for hundreds and hundreds of years, and yet because you do not agree with their very fundamentals of their faith you want, no sorry demand change. I hope the church stands firm on this issue, not because I am anti gay marriage, but because it is what the churches beliefs and values are. I think it is a dreadful way to view things and to demand change on people through force of legislation and then say fuck the church as they are all old fashioned old codgers and they now have to move with the times, and then care not a fuck about their values and their faith. What a strange view to have on life.
I think the Jeremy Clarkson approach should be taken with anyone who drives a 4x4. Shoot em in front of their families
You should read a book called "Who moved the cheese." I think you would find it most enlightning. It is not the strongest who survive - but those most adaptable to change and who are willing to look at the positives rather than look for the negatives. The smoking ban is here and the positives far outweigh the negatives in terms of health and in terms of the basic human rights of non smokers. Everyone is equal - which seems pretty fair to me.
Your comments about the church remind me of an old saying - Religion is comedy for the intelligent and reality for the ignorant. How can we possibly have our lives dictated to on the basis of a work of fiction and a Church that a British King invented because he didn't like Catholics. We live in modern times, Henry VIII has been dead for a very long time and Elizabeth II does not really justify being Supreme Governer of the Church of England.
Life moves on relentlessly and you can roll with it seek out positives and opportunities, or you can moan about how much better things used to be and gaze back fondly through rose tinted glasses.
Not sure what you mean't about the 4X4 or its relevance???
I've seen Nigel Farage on Question Time a few times.
Obviously an intelligent man, but does himself immense discredit by banging the "Anti-Europe" drum in relation to every damn question (even if said question has nothing to do with Europe). This immediately portrays him as a "policy party"
People forget that UKIP actually grew in support only once a similar nationalist party (I cant remember the name, I believe Robert Kilroy silk was involved in it) folded into it... it also gave the less-obnoxious supporters of the BNP a more legitimate party to vote for.
Like the lib-dems (whom I actually support generally), they are a party that never expects to be in power, so they can make all the claims they like.
Binning the human rights act?
Nothing short of an absolute removal from Europe will allow us to do that (legally). Doing that is nothing short of insanity, as the consequences will be far-reaching both socially and economically.
Smoking Ban / Same-Sex Marraige
"Non-policies" whose sole purpose is to attain favor with the electorate.
Double Prison places
OK, we have a option for more jobs here (wardens, etc), but where exactly is the funding going to come from? How long before the "Yobs costing £50K/yr to keep in Jail" headlines start coming from the media? Also, good luck getting planning for all those new prisons...
Lack of jobs / low wages due to immigration
Nope, thats down to the current work ethic. There has been a minimum wage present for years now, and you need to ask yourself "If you cant work in an entry level job when your only applicants are people who have English as their second language, what could you be doing wrong?". There is a difference between applying for a job you can do, and only applying for jobs that you want to do.
I know a fair few people that run hotels / bars..... Their European staff turn up on time, don't turn up hungover / scruffy, and funnily enough are on the same wages as their UK counterparts.
Rant over!
Obviously an intelligent man, but does himself immense discredit by banging the "Anti-Europe" drum in relation to every damn question (even if said question has nothing to do with Europe). This immediately portrays him as a "policy party"
People forget that UKIP actually grew in support only once a similar nationalist party (I cant remember the name, I believe Robert Kilroy silk was involved in it) folded into it... it also gave the less-obnoxious supporters of the BNP a more legitimate party to vote for.
Like the lib-dems (whom I actually support generally), they are a party that never expects to be in power, so they can make all the claims they like.
Binning the human rights act?
Nothing short of an absolute removal from Europe will allow us to do that (legally). Doing that is nothing short of insanity, as the consequences will be far-reaching both socially and economically.
Smoking Ban / Same-Sex Marraige
"Non-policies" whose sole purpose is to attain favor with the electorate.
Double Prison places
OK, we have a option for more jobs here (wardens, etc), but where exactly is the funding going to come from? How long before the "Yobs costing £50K/yr to keep in Jail" headlines start coming from the media? Also, good luck getting planning for all those new prisons...
Lack of jobs / low wages due to immigration
Nope, thats down to the current work ethic. There has been a minimum wage present for years now, and you need to ask yourself "If you cant work in an entry level job when your only applicants are people who have English as their second language, what could you be doing wrong?". There is a difference between applying for a job you can do, and only applying for jobs that you want to do.
I know a fair few people that run hotels / bars..... Their European staff turn up on time, don't turn up hungover / scruffy, and funnily enough are on the same wages as their UK counterparts.
Rant over!
