UKIP Policies

27 Jan 2013

Just been reading up on some UKIP policies just to see what else there was aside from the very public single issue that everyone talks about. There are some surprises in there:
They feel that a national hunting ban is unfair and would propose a County by County referendum on the issue
Reduce the top rate of income tax to 31%
Increase the low rate of income tax up to 31%
Reduce Corporation Tax
Scrap the European Arrest Warrant ( really don't understand that one)
Support Grammar Schools
And much more quite surprising stuff. Or maybe not actually. They are all disaffected Tories so one could expect extreme conservatism.

27 Jan 2013

Hummmm
Those policies seem to cut across what star has been getting excited about....
Trust you to pick a fight TH lol

27 Jan 2013

Quote by GnV
Hummmm
Those policies seem to cut across what star has been getting excited about....
Trust you to pick a fight TH

Not at all. I had an entertaining afternoon watching footy and then decided to do a bit of Internet research and really find out what UKIP is all about. Now that you mention it - Star does seem to have issues with many of the these "policies" but I guess with any political party you have to make compromises with some things. I would find it surprising (or maybe I would not!) if the supporters who have become so brainwashed by the EU issue that they are either unaware or prepared to accept all the rest of the extremes just to address the Johnny Foreigner issue.
Where I live it has always been a staunch Labour area but recently the UKIP voice is becoming increasingly loud but really only about the immigration issue. Perhaps they just don't realise that UKIP is an extreme version of Conservatism.

27 Jan 2013

Quote by Too Hot
Hummmm
Those policies seem to cut across what star has been getting excited about....
Trust you to pick a fight TH

Not at all. I had an entertaining afternoon watching footy and then decided to do a bit of Internet research and really find out what UKIP is all about. Now that you mention it - Star does seem to have issues with many of the these "policies" but I guess with any political party you have to make compromises with some things. I would find it surprising (or maybe I would not!) if the supporters who have become so brainwashed by the EU issue that they are either unaware or prepared to accept all the rest of the extremes just to address the Johnny Foreigner issue.
Where I live it has always been a staunch Labour area but recently the UKIP voice is becoming increasingly loud but really only about the immigration issue. Perhaps they just don't realise that UKIP is an extreme version of Conservatism.
:thumbup:
UKIP is an extreme version of Conservatism.
:thumbup:
Like I've posted previously - I'll keep stum on UKIP.

27 Jan 2013

I certainly wouldn't want to be paying 31% income tax.

27 Jan 2013

Quote by Trevaunance
I certainly wouldn't want to be paying 31% income tax.

Mmmmmmm..........
Reducing top rate income tax AND reducing CGT will have appeal to some.

27 Jan 2013

Whilst UKIP have many interesting policies, the number one is the withdrawal from Europe which is what most people will put at the top of their list when voting for them.
Immigration apparently is the biggest single issue that concerns voters. Cameron's promise before he was elected cut no ice, as the vast majority of immigrants entering the uk were from European countries, and so could not be stopped from entering. Withdrawing from Europe would start to curb the amount of Europeans entering these shores. A cap on immigrants must happen as otherwise the figures of 70 plus million in the UK will be reached very quickly, whilst services would fall apart under the pressure.
Having tax at 31% will never affect me, reducing corporation tax seems like a good idea.
UKIP's best chances of success is in the European elections of which many so called experts think they will do rather well. Would Cameron have made the offer of a referendum had UKIP not been on the political scene? I doubt it somehow and the Tories cannot afford to lose any more voters, as they know something drastic will have to happen between now and the next election, if they are to get in on a majority. Appeasing the voters on Europe seems his best option, and to be honest his only chance of success at the next election.
If nothing else UKIP has changed the way the Conservatives look at things, and have changed their agenda towards the next election. That alone has to be a good thing?

28 Jan 2013

Quote by starlightcouple
Whilst UKIP have many interesting policies, the number one is the withdrawal from Europe which is what most people will put at the top of their list when voting for them.
Immigration apparently is the biggest single issue that concerns voters. Cameron's promise before he was elected cut no ice, as the vast majority of immigrants entering the uk were from European countries, and so could not be stopped from entering. Withdrawing from Europe would start to curb the amount of Europeans entering these shores. A cap on immigrants must happen as otherwise the figures of 70 plus million in the UK will be reached very quickly, whilst services would fall apart under the pressure.
Having tax at 31% will never affect me, reducing corporation tax seems like a good idea.
UKIP's best chances of success is in the European elections of which many so called experts think they will do rather well. Would Cameron have made the offer of a referendum had UKIP not been on the political scene? I doubt it somehow and the Tories cannot afford to lose any more voters, as they know something drastic will have to happen between now and the next election, if they are to get in on a majority. Appeasing the voters on Europe seems his best option, and to be honest his only chance of success at the next election.
If nothing else UKIP has changed the way the Conservatives look at things, and have changed their agenda towards the next election. That alone has to be a good thing?

You saying that people will put withdrawal from Europe ahead of the economy and unemployment and will also happily see an increase in tax to 31% just to get out of Europe?
Immigration is a big issue because stupid extremists are not prepared to tell the truth. The vast majority of educated and resasonable people can see and understand that immigration is an economic benefit to the country. Reacting to extremist headlines is not what having a reasoned opinion is really about.
If the Eastern Europeans keep coming in and keep contributing more than they are taking out then our defecit will sort itself out because they provide more tax revenue than they take out. Do you follow the maths? More tax income coming = more to spend on services.
In another thread much was spoken about the war - surely it has not escaped your attention that throughout history people have looked to blame "foreigners" in difficult times. In every instance, history has proven that to have been the wrong thing to do.
Just take aside your personal reactionary views on this and look at it from the country's point of view. European immigrants come here to work and as a consequence they pay tax on earnings and tax on goods that they buy. Many are so integrated that this is now their home and all the statistics available show that economic migrants contribute more in tax than they take in benefits. If that were to continue then the defecit eases.
What is best for your great and glorious country? The native population that take more in benefits than they pay in tax? Or immigrants that pay more in tax than they take in benefits?
I agree with a great deal of the UKIP right wing policies but their immigration policy is unfounded as they simply do not understand basic economics and they have not read their history books.
As an aside let's look at the big fear of January 2014 - Bulgarian immigration....
A loaf of bread in Bulgaria costs 35p. Diesel is a pound a litre. Airports remain open when it snows and motorists can afford a second set of tyres for the winter. Bulgaria's 16.3% ratio of government debt to GDP beats Luxembourg's 18.3% and makes Britain's 85% look atrocious. Bulgaria's economy grew by roughly 0.5% in 2012, ours is at the point of a triple dip recession.
Are you seriously suggesting that Bulgarians would come here just to claim benefits?

28 Jan 2013

Quote by Too Hot
A loaf of bread in Bulgaria costs 35p. Diesel is a pound a litre. Airports remain open when it snows and motorists can afford a second set of tyres for the winter. Bulgaria's 16.3% ratio of government debt to GDP beats Luxembourg's 18.3% and makes Britain's 85% look atrocious. Bulgaria's economy grew by roughly 0.5% in 2012, ours is at the point of a triple dip recession.
Are you seriously suggesting that Bulgarians would come here just to claim benefits?

Do you know what the weekly or monthly wage of a typical Bulgarian is TH? The average monthly pay in Bulgaria was 669 leva in the fourth quarter of 2010 and I do not think it has increased that much since then, which is less than £300 per month. Bulgaria's economy may well have grown TH and a very clever ploy with your diverting tactics here, but does the average Bulgarian get anything extra for this new found growth? Seems they do not.
So the average wage per month is about £300 and in the UK they could possibly get four times that amount, and you think they would rather stay in Bulgaria because their economy grew by roughly 0.5 ??? rolleyes

:roll:

Now I know TH that your arguments are so out of date, and you are making yourself look very silly. You really do need to get out there with the average person on the street in an inner city, to be able to understand how it really works. Funny how the rich have your attitudes and the poorest just suffer the consequences.
Oh and btw, seems the monthly wage is pretty similar in Romania as well.

28 Jan 2013

Let's be real here and understand the motives of "emigration." What goes through someones mind when they think about emigrating to another country. It is a positive thought process to better yourself and your family. Maybe if they were slackers and the idle and feckless they might look at moving to another country to get paid to do nothing. As it happens, history has taught us that economic migrants came here to work, not to take benefits - the native Brits are doing just fine taking benefits - it is doing work they seem to have a problem with.
There is nothing silly about wanting this country to generate more in tax revenues than it spends in benefits. The only way that is going to happen is through immigration. UK native residents voted on their attitude to work - you said it in another thread. 7.1% increase in population - and still it is the native Brits who are claiming all the benefits!
Let's make the whole point very clear. You own a Company that hand makes umbrella's and each umbrella sells for £5. You need every employee to make three umbrella's an hour to cover their wages and on going costs. You find that 80% of your employees can make two to three an hour but 20% struggle to make one an hour and this means that you are paying them more than they are giving back. Is this sustainable? Would you bring in more people who make three an hour or do you get rid of them and concentrate on the 20% that make one an hour?
It is very, very simple and the problem that you have is the problem that this country generally has. The level of expectations of ordinary people vastly outweighs the reality of what the country can afford to give them. As JFK famously said - ask not what your country can do for you, ask yourself what can you do for your country.

28 Jan 2013

Quote by Too Hot
Let's be real here and understand the motives of "emigration." What goes through someones mind when they think about emigrating to another country. It is a positive thought process to better yourself and your family. Maybe if they were slackers and the idle and feckless they might look at moving to another country to get paid to do nothing. As it happens, history has taught us that economic migrants came here to work, not to take benefits - the native Brits are doing just fine taking benefits - it is doing work they seem to have a problem with.

Of course it is good to better yourself, but answer the question as to why this Government is trying to dissuade Bulgarian and Romanian nationals from coming here? If it was sooooo good for Britain, why the campaign??? I mean surely Bulgarians coming here to work will be greatly beneficial to the UK won't it? Best tell the Conservative Government the good it will do. :doh:

Quote by Too Hot
There is nothing silly about wanting this country to generate more in tax revenues than it spends in benefits. The only way that is going to happen is through immigration. UK native residents voted on their attitude to work - you said it in another thread. 7.1% increase in population - and still it is the native Brits who are claiming all the benefits!

Sorry TH but utter twaddle. Do you employ foreign workers by any chance on the minimum wages? I bloody bet you do.

Quote by Too Hot
Let's make the whole point very clear. You own a Company that hand makes umbrella's and each umbrella sells for £5. You need every employee to make three umbrella's an hour to cover their wages and on going costs. You find that 80% of your employees can make two to three an hour but 20% struggle to make one an hour and this means that you are paying them more than they are giving back. Is this sustainable? Would you bring in more people who make three an hour or do you get rid of them and concentrate on the 20% that make one an hour?

Are you trying to explain the workings of the United Kingdom? You should have put yourself down for PM, as I am sure DC would love to give you a call.

Quote by Too Hot
It is very, very simple and the problem that you have is the problem that this country generally has. The level of expectations of ordinary people vastly outweighs the reality of what the country can afford to give them. As JFK famously said - ask not what your country can do for you, ask yourself what can you do for your country.

I give up, I really do. If ever I want to look at what is wrong with this country and why we are in the mess we are, I shall look at your comments and all will become clear. banghead

28 Jan 2013

Quote by flower411
I certainly wouldn't want to be paying 31% income tax.

I think they are proposing to get rid of national insurance contributions and VAT ...
My "limited" understanding of taxataion has always led me to believe that I am taxed directly at approximately 30% and the UKIP idea is to get rid of the complcated ways of collecting this 30% ... seems a pretty logical idea when taken at face value.
Even if they just got rid of National Insurance 31% income tax would be a damn good deal. Aside from the employees contributions which are certainly over 10% pretty well every employer could afford to give every employee a 10% pay rise as well.

28 Jan 2013

Quote by Too Hot
I certainly wouldn't want to be paying 31% income tax.

Mmmmmmm..........
Reducing top rate income tax AND reducing CGT will have appeal to some.
Some, but not all. 31% income tax would be a right kick in the balls for many, myself included. I didn't realise that they planned to reduce CGT as well, I can see some benefit from that to me, but not enough to cover the increase in income tax I wouldn't have thought.

Quote by flower411
I think they are proposing to get rid of national insurance contributions and VAT ...
My "limited" understanding of taxataion has always led me to believe that I am taxed directly at approximately 30% and the UKIP idea is to get rid of the complcated ways of collecting this 30% ... seems a pretty logical idea when taken at face value.

Now this idea seems more appealing at face value.

28 Jan 2013

it does beg the question........could they really make a worse hash of things than the last 3 decades of government??

28 Jan 2013

Quote by Lizaleanrob
it does beg the question........could they really make a worse hash of things than the last 3 decades of government??

Its taken over 3 decades since Charles de Gaulle said he never wanted Great Britain in the common market for Nigel Farage to get the politicians in government to realise that europe is not working. So how long will it take to fix???

28 Jan 2013

Quote by Paul80
it does beg the question........could they really make a worse hash of things than the last 3 decades of government??

Its taken over 3 decades since Charles de Gaulle said he never wanted Great Britain in the common market for Nigel Farage to get the politicians in government to realise that europe is not working. So how long will it take to fix???
More like 5 decades:

28 Jan 2013

In fairness, Charles de Gaulle didn't want Britain to be part of Europe only because he felt it was a backdoor route for America to interfere in European politics.

29 Jan 2013

Quote by GnV
it does beg the question........could they really make a worse hash of things than the last 3 decades of government??

Its taken over 3 decades since Charles de Gaulle said he never wanted Great Britain in the common market for Nigel Farage to get the politicians in government to realise that europe is not working. So how long will it take to fix???
More like 5 decades:

A decade or six makes no difference when you are now skint yourself.

29 Jan 2013

Well star, in another thread you briefed against reading such material wink

However, in the case of François Hollande you are correct.
I suggested when he became president that it would be an interesting time watching his austerity with investment plan develop.
Seems however that his traditionalist socialist inclinations (and those of his long time friend and Prime Minister) have overtaken the rhetoric and he is bound headlong into a high tax strategy which is turning away the very people he needs in France to aid the recovery. The same would be the case in the UK if the 'Band 'n 'Balls double act were in charge of the economy.
BTW, there is apparently no truth in the suggestion that Sarky is looking to set up home in The UK as reported by The Daily Wail.
Like the US, ex-presidents of France are very looked after by the State :wink:

29 Jan 2013

Good comments GnV but France it seems is still skint. flipa

Do you worry at all about owning a property there in the current climate? I mean in Spain ex pats from the UK were targeted by the Spanish on so many levels, are you not worried something similar could happen in France?

29 Jan 2013

Quote by starlightcouple
Good comments GnV but France it seems is still skint.
Do you worry at all about owning a property there in the current climate? I mean in Spain ex pats from the UK were targeted by the Spanish on so many levels, are you not worried something similar could happen in France?

Nope.
The bit that's hurting most at the moment is the decline of the pound against the Euro.
The UK economy is in a worse state than that of France it seems wink

29 Jan 2013

Quote by GnV
Good comments GnV but France it seems is still skint.
Do you worry at all about owning a property there in the current climate? I mean in Spain ex pats from the UK were targeted by the Spanish on so many levels, are you not worried something similar could happen in France?

Nope.
The bit that's hurting most at the moment is the decline of the pound against the Euro.
The UK economy is in a worse state than that of France it seems wink

Once again I would not believe all you read GnV, but I do agree that France is in trouble but the UK seems to have a few billion a year to spare, as to send to foreign countries. Our aid to other countries is surely something to be proud of, seeing as we are funding it with the saved money we have made from the benefit claimants eh?
Stopping the elderly from free travel and cutting back on winter fuel payments, should help to fund another aid scheme in India. :twisted:

29 Jan 2013

Quote by starlightcouple
Good comments GnV but France it seems is still skint.
Do you worry at all about owning a property there in the current climate? I mean in Spain ex pats from the UK were targeted by the Spanish on so many levels, are you not worried something similar could happen in France?

Nope.
The bit that's hurting most at the moment is the decline of the pound against the Euro.
The UK economy is in a worse state than that of France it seems wink

Once again I would not believe all you read GnV, but I do agree that France is in trouble but the UK seems to have a few billion a year to spare, as to send to foreign countries. Our aid to other countries is surely something to be proud of, seeing as we are funding it with the saved money we have made from the benefit claimants eh?
Stopping the elderly from free travel and cutting back on winter fuel payments, should help to fund another aid scheme in India. :twisted:
It's not about what I've read but a statement of fact star.
The pound is at a 13 month low against the Euro.
An extract from currency traders' take on the current situation:
"Sterling was sold against the single currency in response to a tripartite of economic news that damaged the UK's reputation as a safe haven from the global financial crisis. The combination of weak domestic data, improving sentiment in Germany, and an encouraging report from the European Central Bank's Long Term Refinancing Operation, caused traders to re-evaluate the pros of investing in Sterling and reconsider the plusses of holding assets denominated in the Euro."
Seems the UK economy is seen by the money markets to be heading into an unprecedented triple dip recession.
If the UK economy is so strong (so as to be ale to afford a few 'spare' £billion) why is the currency so weak? Petrol/fuel prices are set to rise in the UK to unprecedented levels, if it hasn't already done so. That alone will hurt those who are paid in sterling and buy in sterling such as little englanders like yourself.
Your understanding of the economy seems to be the wrong way round just now.

29 Jan 2013

Quote by GnV
The pound is at a 13 month low against the Euro.

It was not that long ago that £1 would get you Euros. Now £1 gets you Euros. Seems the Euro has lost value against the pound from what it was.
Anyway does the UK buy it's money in Euros? And seeing as I am not looking to go anywhere in Europe in the next 5 years at least, I do not give a shit how many Euros I may or may not get to my one English pound. :bounce:
No I may be worried about my holiday this year to America or my Christmas trip to Sharm later in the year, if those currencies were in Euros. lol

29 Jan 2013

Quote by star
It was not that long ago that £1 would get you Euros. Now £1 gets you Euros. Seems the Euro has lost value against the pound from what it was.

See what I mean?
You have it the wrong way round star rolleyes

It's the £ that is losing value. It's just not buying very much just now.

29 Jan 2013

Quote by GnV
It was not that long ago that £1 would get you Euros. Now £1 gets you Euros. Seems the Euro has lost value against the pound from what it was.

See what I mean?
You have it the wrong way round star rolleyes

It's the £ that is losing value.It's just not buying very much just now.
Well it is buying my American trip, and my holiday to Sharme in December. Seems to be buying rather a lot for me. :thumbup: drinkies

29 Jan 2013

For reference star.
Indexes Difference
Consumer Prices in United Kingdom are % higher than in United States
Consumer Prices Including Rent in United Kingdom are % higher than in United States
Rent Prices in United Kingdom are % higher than in United States
Restaurant Prices in United Kingdom are % higher than in United States
Groceries Prices in United Kingdom are % higher than in United States
Local Purchasing Power in United Kingdom is % lower than in United States
Hardly surprising that you seem to get more bang for your buck stateside since the UK is said to have the worst quality of life in Europe.
One U$D buys more Euro than it does GBP (as if you are able to understand the significance).

29 Jan 2013

Quote by GnV
For reference star.
Indexes Difference
Consumer Prices in United Kingdom are % higher than in United States
Consumer Prices Including Rent in United Kingdom are % higher than in United States
Rent Prices in United Kingdom are % higher than in United States
Restaurant Prices in United Kingdom are % higher than in United States
Groceries Prices in United Kingdom are % higher than in United States
Local Purchasing Power in United Kingdom is % lower than in United States
Hardly surprising that you seem to get more bang for your buck stateside since the UK is said to have the worst quality of life in Europe.
One U$D buys more Euro than it does GBP (as if you are able to understand the significance).

Blimey GnV will have to tell my Wife and see if we can go for a month, instead of just the two weeks.

:rotflmao::rotflmao:

29 Jan 2013

Why not go the whole hog and stay for the whole of your 3 months visa?
I think you can get an extension for a further 6 months if you 'hail to the chief' lol

Don't expect free healthcare and unemployment benefit though...

29 Jan 2013

Quote by GnV
Good comments GnV but France it seems is still skint.
Do you worry at all about owning a property there in the current climate? I mean in Spain ex pats from the UK were targeted by the Spanish on so many levels, are you not worried something similar could happen in France?

Nope.
The bit that's hurting most at the moment is the decline of the pound against the Euro.
The UK economy is in a worse state than that of France it seems wink

that's beauty of being out of the euro G we are still able to devalue the pound which can bring in much needed investment at times, the euro being a one currency does not have the same effect Spain and Portugal are unable to do this, so much needed investment would go to more affluent places like Germany and France