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Censorship. A rock or a hard place?

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Before I start.....Yes I know that involves a time paradox but...Censorship can be thought of as a restriction of free speech, which I think is a bad thing. On the other hand it can be a tool used to uphold the law, which I think is a good thing.
Now, I have no idea what went on with gman and I'm not requesting details but I read a thead where it was said that all his posts are being deleted. This started me thinking about history.....Does the panel think that because a person has been banned from this site all their posts should be removed?
I would say no. What do you think? confused:
If I read that right then you're asking that without being judgemental either way, and merely talking about the historical nature of where a persons posts fit in after the event ? I'd hope thats the case, anyway - but even then I'd hope people step back from recent events and answer based on the broader question........
I'd say that if a number of the posts form part of the reason for the person going then obviously at least some of them must be removed. Leaving some then makes it harder as judgement has to be made on every single one outside of the ones causing offence.
Please folks - think before you open your mouth to answer BikerGuys question !!!
Carpathian, hoping this isn't the next thread to go tits up !
I have to agree with what Carpy wrote -
there are currently
293 matches

of gmanxx postings - go to 'search' and put in his name'
Did I run out of fingers????
Sorry Fred.... must have confused this with the Rugby score!!
Sorry Bikerguy... my PC malfunctioned...
Quote by Jags
my PC malfunctioned...

As if...
Cant expect to type straight while tying me to the bedposts lol :lol: :lol:
Hang on....Lets not get carried away with the gman issue. I don't know what happened but I trust the mods here to have done the right thing. It was just the point about wiping out history. Infact it was you Fred who said "all of his posts are being deleted" that got me thinking. Look at the wider issue, what if we erased from history all the bad things that have happned. We would never have the chance to learn about the past or to get an insight into how we could make things better.
I'm not having a go at anyone......Just though it might be an interesting topic.
I once did an OU course on childcare...
A lot of the course work involved audio tapes of matterial being read by a certain professor of child psycology. Specifically, it included case histories of child abuse.
Midway through the course, the professor was the subject of a down raid by police and evidence came to light that he had personally been involved with the abuse of children... Now, we had to make a decision to make... Did we want to continue with the course knowing that the person behind a lot of it had been abusing children?
Some could have argued that we might have gone on, through our careers, to benefit children and that it was important that we don't be put off this goal because ot this man's actions. Some would argue that to hear information being presented by this person was an insult to those he had abused.
Now THAT it a dilemma...
As far as Gman is concerned.... nothing he said here is of great importance. Nothing ANYONE says here is of great importance. But he did manage to cause great offence and was universally judged by many Mods to be developing into someone we ddn't want around.
So why should the words of someone who has caused offence be allowed to stand in a forum such as this?
I don't see a dilemma here...
Hxx
If you're down the pub with your mates and someone says something out of line, it can't be "unsaid".
If a thread has gone nasty, it can be closed.
If someone persists in causing offence they can be silenced, and leaving their offensive posts in place would serve as a reminder and a warning to others as to why they have been prevented from making any more.
In my opinion, and I can be completely objective about this because I haven't been on all day and have no idea what has occurred so I am talking generally rather than about a specific case, if allowing an offensive post to remain is not going to cause further disruption, the only person to be adversely affected by it would be the person who posted it because everyone would see what they had done. Any resulting loss of respect for that person would then be self-inflicted.
In any event, if it is deemed necessary by mods, either individually or collectively, to remove any post for any reason, then my opinion based on experience is that even if they are inclined to explain privately to the person concerned, they should not attempt to justify it to anyone else.
Ice
I have no idea what Gman did either, but I just wanted to chip in...
Quote by Heather
So why should the words of someone who has caused offence be allowed to stand in a forum such as this?

I'd be asking the inverse question myself, but to answer the question you asked... because his words provide context in which the words of others can be understood. Most postings in the cafe are replies to things other people have said, and most don't quote the specific thing they're replying to. Some of the replies can indeed stand on their own, but many do not; they only make sense viewed in the context of what the author was responding to.
For example: if you remove non-offensive post ABC by Gmanxxx, you may be left with a reply DEF by Alexandra (to pick a name at random) which doesn't make sense on its own. Should Alex's post be removed too, even though she isn't the one who sinned? And maybe there's other postings GHI and JKL that are replies to DEF and make no sense without it... quickly this could become a huge exercise in editing the past and if the Mods really don't have anything better to do then I suggest they come and weed my garden for me. wink The alternative is to leave DEF there, and just accept that some of these old threads will no longer make sense. I'm not really one for going back and re-reading old topics myself, but I know some other people here do enjoy that. And newbies are sometimes referred to discussions from long past. Clearly, at least some parts of the community consider these old threads to be worthwhile. And in the absence of reasons not to, maybe that should be an argument for preserving them?
Let's make one thing clear.... Gman has himself requested all posts by him be removed. wink
Aside to this, and irrespective of what he wants, it's unfair to him personally to keep on discussing him while he has no access to this board. And also aside to that... many of Gman's 'sins' relate to PMs - which are not seen onlist. So those that ponder the question posed by this thread are pondering whilst not in full command of the facts.
And as yet a further aside, many other users have ignored the AUP and or pissed us off through their actions and we have wiped off all trace of them. The fact that Gman had such a high profile seems to be attracting disproportionate interest.
The Mods have seen a great deal of Gman's activity onlist and offlist and we really can't go over and over what he said to whom and when. We really don't think Gman and SH belong in the same bed and that's that.
So... in fairness to those he upset - and to Gman - his posts will be removed and anyone wishing to see the full adjudication should send a S.A.E. to:- Mods, Swinging Heaven, Third Cublicle from the left, Victoria Coach Station shithouse...
Quote by Heather
We really don't think Gman and SH belong in the same bed and that's that.

And that is, of course, the important thing. Now who's got a "mods rule" graphic I can borrow... smile
Can I just say again....This has nothing to do with gman.
I opened this thread to talk about censorship and changing the way we see history. I don't want it to decend into a slanging match so can a mod please lock it now before it gets nasty.
Next time I will be more careful how I open a thread. mad
Quote by Heather
Let's make one thing clear.... Gman has himself requested all posts by him be removed. wink

That's not what the thread is about.
Quote by Bikerguy82
can a mod please lock it now before it gets nasty

Done