condom wake up call!

4 Aug 2007

Quote by Dave__Notts
Having sex with any people outside of a monogamous relationship, where both have clear test results, is a risk to your health.
1 To lower the risk you use a condom for penetrative sex.
2 To lower it further you use a condom or dam for oral sex.
3 To lower it further you use a condom on any toys.
4 To lower it further you do not kiss the other people.
5 To lower it further you do not kiss or lick any other part of the other people.
6 To lower it further you use surgical gloves to touch other people.
7 To lower it further you don't swing.
Between 1-7 and depending on what you expect the others to do or not do is your risk factor. That is your acceptance of that risk. For those that do 1-6 any other type of play is irresponsible, those that do 1 only believe those that do none of them irresponsible.
So where is the line drawn to make a person or couple not irresponsible. That is down to the individuals who will be playing. It is their life. They know the risks that are acceptable to them. It shouldn't be down to others to condemn them.
Individuals can only look after themselves not others.
As for tests.......I have been told by many people "we have had tests and we are clear"......but never once have they shown me the test results. People fib, tell porkies or damn well lie........whatever way you look at it, it is down to your own evaluation of the risk to you that will govern the way you want or not want to play.
For penetrative sex to be seen as the "bigger" problem or more risky is starting to sound like Tony Blairs speach before going to war. HIV can be contracted by a variety of sources, some more risky than others, but the risk will be irrelevant if you were the person who contracted it by a lower risk activity. So to condemn only those that did not use condoms for penetrative sex is proverbial person throwing stones in a greenhouse.
The only way to be safe is to have sex with your own partner and give up swinging. If people carry on swinging......then as adults they accept a risk, at whatever level they wish. But if it goes tits up for them then they only have themselves to blame, not others.
Dave_Notts

8. do not have sex
9. do not touch anyone
10. do not touch anything that someone has touched.
It gets silly in the end, does it not? We all live with risk!
PS I am still using condoms.

5 Aug 2007

I once went with a couple where just as things got to the point where it was clear that she wanted me to enter her there and then they both said no as I reached to put on a condom.
They said its ok, we can do it without, we don't like using them.
For the record I insisted I did use one.
But afterwards they seemed a bit put out like I'd mistrusted them.I realise in one sense it was their way of totally accepting me as a sexual partner.
I even said my reason for condoms, it wasn't just them, it was me and my sexual history and the fact that we would all each have sex with other new partners in the future.
My main point is though this was a "heat of the moment" situation where all we'd discussed previously seemed to go out of the window.
All three of us naked on a bed together, foreplaying and all highly aroused - it just wasn't the moment for a rational debate on this topic!
I do have to say though that if we take it so far that we're afraid to touch or kiss whoever wherever then it all but ruins it surely.I'm not denying the seriousness of HIV/AIDS and other STDS but you can catch something nasty from a door handle or a phone or food touched by someone who didn't wash their hands after they went to the loo!
We must play safe, true, but not wrapped head to toe in cling film surely!

5 Aug 2007

Quote by
Having sex with any people outside of a monogamous relationship, where both have clear test results, is a risk to your health.
1 To lower the risk you use a condom for penetrative sex.
2 To lower it further you use a condom or dam for oral sex.
3 To lower it further you use a condom on any toys.
4 To lower it further you do not kiss the other people.
5 To lower it further you do not kiss or lick any other part of the other people.
6 To lower it further you use surgical gloves to touch other people.
7 To lower it further you don't swing.
Between 1-7 and depending on what you expect the others to do or not do is your risk factor. That is your acceptance of that risk. For those that do 1-6 any other type of play is irresponsible, those that do 1 only believe those that do none of them irresponsible.
So where is the line drawn to make a person or couple not irresponsible. That is down to the individuals who will be playing. It is their life. They know the risks that are acceptable to them. It shouldn't be down to others to condemn them.
Individuals can only look after themselves not others.
As for tests.......I have been told by many people "we have had tests and we are clear"......but never once have they shown me the test results. People fib, tell porkies or damn well lie........whatever way you look at it, it is down to your own evaluation of the risk to you that will govern the way you want or not want to play.
For penetrative sex to be seen as the "bigger" problem or more risky is starting to sound like Tony Blairs speach before going to war. HIV can be contracted by a variety of sources, some more risky than others, but the risk will be irrelevant if you were the person who contracted it by a lower risk activity. So to condemn only those that did not use condoms for penetrative sex is proverbial person throwing stones in a greenhouse.
The only way to be safe is to have sex with your own partner and give up swinging. If people carry on swinging......then as adults they accept a risk, at whatever level they wish. But if it goes tits up for them then they only have themselves to blame, not others.
Dave_Notts

8. do not have sex
9. do not touch anyone
10. do not touch anything that someone has touched.
It gets silly in the end, does it not? We all live with risk!
PS I am still using condoms.
So by saying that we all live with risk that you are accepting that people are free to choose their own risk level?
Or are you saying that it is only silly when they do not agree that penetrative sex is the only protection you need?
Number ten is a condition that some people use to protect themselves. Michael Jackson is a clasiic example of this. He will say everyone who has contributed to this thread is irresponsible.
Your acceptance for your risk is whatever you decide. It is not up to others to decide it for you.
I do not think anyone on this whole thread has justified or even tried to justify not using condoms. The debate at present is whether people have a right to condone someone for doing something that is "more risky" in their eyes. IMO they do not have that right. At whatever level you set your opinion, there will always be someone who is more safety conscious than you and do or not do something. These people would be condemning of your actions and your stance on this subject.
So what is your answer to their accusation that you are irresponsible for only using condoms for penetrative sex? Would you say you are irresponsible for not looking after their health or not? This is the essence of the authors post when he started the thread, IMO.

5 Aug 2007

Quote by niceandgentle
I do have to say though that if we take it so far that we're afraid to touch or kiss whoever wherever then it all but ruins it surely.I'm not denying the seriousness of HIV/AIDS and other STDS but you can catch something nasty from a door handle or a phone or food touched by someone who didn't wash their hands after they went to the loo!
We must play safe, true, but not wrapped head to toe in cling film surely!

This will be your acceptance of your risk factor. No one is saying sex without condoms is right. The opposing views in here is when people try to put their options as the only option. What you accept for your own risk is your choice. So what gives someone the right to question others choices. You are not being affected by their choices.
Hypothetically, you play with someone that is HIV. They have contracted HIV by a blood transfusion and this has not yet come to light to themselves or the hospital that gave the transfusion.
By using your risk based opinion you have lowered the risk to your acceptable level. However, you have contracted HIV because you performed oral without protection. Now who is to blame? You or them?
IMO, it is yours. That was your acceptable risk. You took it and it came back to bite you on the arse. Someone who uses a dam may have not contracted HIV, someone who abstains from sex would have not contracted it, someone who does not swing would not have contracted it.
So, IMO, to condemn anybody elses actions are hypocritical because the individual has the obligation to look after their own health and not others.
Dave_Notts

5 Aug 2007

I again have to say as I have before that I have never seen dental dams used by anyone ever at a club or party or privately.
Nor have I ever seen any woman's regular partner use a condom just because her extra male / males are as they take their turns having penetrative sex with her.
In the end I will tell any potential partner who asks about my sexual past and appreciate the same in can then be decided by each party if they wish to go any further.
I've no judgemental outlook on this is humans at their most human, delighting in the wonderful pleasures of their own bodies and in the bodies of others.I personally seek to share that very joy with anybody I play with in as uninhibited a way and as safe a way as possible.

5 Aug 2007

Quote by Dave__Notts

I do have to say though that if we take it so far that we're afraid to touch or kiss whoever wherever then it all but ruins it surely.I'm not denying the seriousness of HIV/AIDS and other STDS but you can catch something nasty from a door handle or a phone or food touched by someone who didn't wash their hands after they went to the loo!
We must play safe, true, but not wrapped head to toe in cling film surely!

This will be your acceptance of your risk factor. No one is saying sex without condoms is right. The opposing views in here is when people try to put their options as the only option. What you accept for your own risk is your choice. So what gives someone the right to question others choices. You are not being affected by their choices.
Hypothetically, you play with someone that is HIV. They have contracted HIV by a blood transfusion and this has not yet come to light to themselves or the hospital that gave the transfusion.
By using your risk based opinion you have lowered the risk to your acceptable level. However, you have contracted HIV because you performed oral without protection. Now who is to blame? You or them?
IMO, it is yours. That was your acceptable risk. You took it and it came back to bite you on the arse. Someone who uses a dam may have not contracted HIV, someone who abstains from sex would have not contracted it, someone who does not swing would not have contracted it.
So, IMO, to condemn anybody elses actions are hypocritical because the individual has the obligation to look after their own health and not others.
Dave_Notts
Dave, agreed, I myself wouldn't 'blame' the person who gave HIV or any other STD to me - unless they knew about it and didn't tell me beforehand!
But because of how some of us have lived we may not even be sure which partner gave it to us or when!

5 Aug 2007

Quote by niceandgentle
In the end I will tell any potential partner who asks about my sexual past and appreciate the same in can then be decided by each party if they wish to go any further.

People lie to get what they want. People listen to lies if it is beneficial to them. This is also human behaviour.
Dave_Notts

5 Aug 2007

Quote by Dave__Notts
Having sex with any people outside of a monogamous relationship, where both have clear test results, is a risk to your health.
1 To lower the risk you use a condom for penetrative sex.
2 To lower it further you use a condom or dam for oral sex.
3 To lower it further you use a condom on any toys.
4 To lower it further you do not kiss the other people.
5 To lower it further you do not kiss or lick any other part of the other people.
6 To lower it further you use surgical gloves to touch other people.
7 To lower it further you don't swing.
Between 1-7 and depending on what you expect the others to do or not do is your risk factor. That is your acceptance of that risk. For those that do 1-6 any other type of play is irresponsible, those that do 1 only believe those that do none of them irresponsible.
So where is the line drawn to make a person or couple not irresponsible. That is down to the individuals who will be playing. It is their life. They know the risks that are acceptable to them. It shouldn't be down to others to condemn them.
Individuals can only look after themselves not others.
As for tests.......I have been told by many people "we have had tests and we are clear"......but never once have they shown me the test results. People fib, tell porkies or damn well lie........whatever way you look at it, it is down to your own evaluation of the risk to you that will govern the way you want or not want to play.
For penetrative sex to be seen as the "bigger" problem or more risky is starting to sound like Tony Blairs speach before going to war. HIV can be contracted by a variety of sources, some more risky than others, but the risk will be irrelevant if you were the person who contracted it by a lower risk activity. So to condemn only those that did not use condoms for penetrative sex is proverbial person throwing stones in a greenhouse.
The only way to be safe is to have sex with your own partner and give up swinging. If people carry on swinging......then as adults they accept a risk, at whatever level they wish. But if it goes tits up for them then they only have themselves to blame, not others.
Dave_Notts

8. do not have sex
9. do not touch anyone
10. do not touch anything that someone has touched.
It gets silly in the end, does it not? We all live with risk!
PS I am still using condoms.
So by saying that we all live with risk that you are accepting that people are free to choose their own risk level?
Or are you saying that it is only silly when they do not agree that penetrative sex is the only protection you need?
Number ten is a condition that some people use to protect themselves. Michael Jackson is a clasiic example of this. He will say everyone who has contributed to this thread is irresponsible.
Your acceptance for your risk is whatever you decide. It is not up to others to decide it for you.
I do not think anyone on this whole thread has justified or even tried to justify not using condoms. The debate at present is whether people have a right to condone someone for doing something that is "more risky" in their eyes. IMO they do not have that right. At whatever level you set your opinion, there will always be someone who is more safety conscious than you and do or not do something. These people would be condemning of your actions and your stance on this subject.
So what is your answer to their accusation that you are irresponsible for only using condoms for penetrative sex? Would you say you are irresponsible for not looking after their health or not? This is the essence of the authors post when he started the thread, IMO.
It is up to each person to except their own level of risk, but not the risk that they put others at.
ie a person who is health can chose not to use a condom, but a person who is not must state that to the partners before they can make an informed assessment of their own risk.

5 Aug 2007

Quote by
It is up to each person to except their own level of risk, but not the risk that they put others at.
ie a person who is health can chose not to use a condom, but a person who is not must state that to the partners before they can make an informed assessment of their own risk.

Bingo! :thumbup:
Now, would they tell the truth?
Tony wink

6 Aug 2007

Quote by Shaz_n_Tony
It is up to each person to except their own level of risk, but not the risk that they put others at.
ie a person who is health can chose not to use a condom, but a person who is not must state that to the partners before they can make an informed assessment of their own risk.

Bingo! :thumbup:
Now, would they tell the truth?
Tony wink

Some would, some have not!

6 Aug 2007

Quote by Dave__Notts

In the end I will tell any potential partner who asks about my sexual past and appreciate the same in can then be decided by each party if they wish to go any further.

People lie to get what they want. People listen to lies if it is beneficial to them. This is also human behaviour.
Dave_Notts
True Dave, true.
I wasn't meaning that people would say they've had sex with exactly xx number of partners or oral with xx or anal with xx or whatever.
If you say you've done things before like clubs, parties, and meeting people through ad's people may conclude you've been involved in varous sexual acts with various partners.
I supose all that I can say is that I know I am not lying! smile

25 Aug 2007

I know that at the end of the day it is totally up to no one else but me to protect myself and thats what I will do. Everyone has their own boundaries but they have to also respect those who want to practice safe sex. Strangely enough I feel the outsider on this one and that doesnt make me feel very good to be honest.

25 Aug 2007

Quote by Corrie2007
I know that at the end of the day it is totally up to no one else but me to protect myself and thats what I will do. Everyone has their own boundaries but they have to also respect those who want to practice safe sex. Strangely enough I feel the outsider on this one and that doesnt make me feel very good to be honest.

I don't think you need to feel like an outsider, regardless of your position on safe sex. kiss

25 Aug 2007

I might have missed it somewhere in a disjointed reading of this thread over a few days, however one thing has struck me about the replies...
Call me odd if you like, but there seems to be an overwhelming majority that say it's about protecting the self, ie whomever it is that's saying "I use condoms because it makes me safe from *insert whichever here*". I'm more of the view that it's "consideration for others" thing. The comment was made earlier about contracting HIV/AIDS from a transfusion patient who is unaware of their condition. If you take consideration for others into account, and knowing about blood transfusion risks with such things, would it not be prudent, as the patient, to have taken some measures to prevent any possibility of transmission?
Using condoms is just sensible as far as I can see, because out of consideration for the other person, I'm sure they don't want to catch anything that I may have lurking undetected, and the other person should feel the same, surely?
Chlamydia, ghonnorea, even herpes can lie undetected and undiagnosed for years while people are merrily passing it around without being aware. A Typhoid Mary moment if you will. A condom may not totally eradicate the risks, but it surely cuts them down dramatically?
Out of consideration for others, a condom is the only way to go.
My view and I'm sticking to it. I won't try and foist it on others that don't share it, but neither would I consider changing it to suit a situation where another person didn't want to take my health and wellbeing into consideration.

25 Aug 2007

A few months ago I wanted to get my usual std tests done. Due to various reasons, too complicated and boring to pursue, I ended up visiting 3 different clinics as well as my usual gp attempting to get a successful suite of tests. In each one I got 'the talk', the one about limiting number of partners (yeah right LOL) and using protection. On each visit they offered me a couple of bags of condoms(30-50 in total each time).
Well after the first one I had enough for a few months but I didn't want to refuse, having gone in for std tests.
I currently have a drawer full of the flaming things.
The funniest bit was, one clinic had sorted them into size and asked me what size I wanted. I said, better make it a mixture, her face was a picture. I had the choice, tell her I'm a swinger or let her think I'm a prostitute.
I told her biggrin

She was very interested so I gave her the web-site address :D She may be reading this now.

27 Aug 2007

Quote by foxylady2209
The funniest bit was, one clinic had sorted them into size and asked me what size I wanted. I said, better make it a mixture, her face was a picture. I had the choice, tell her I'm a swinger or let her think I'm a prostitute.
I told her

well, if i'd been drinking that would have been a wet keyboard moment lol

What has surprised me is the number of guys who turn up to play but don't bring their own condoms. I know we're all there to have fun, but come prepared ffs. Do they expect not to use any, for us to supply them (we did in those cases, don't want to stop the fun!) or just that weren't they expecting to need them!!!
It got so bad at one point that we decided to remind any bloke we meet to bring his own condoms.
I suppose one viewpoint might be that it's actually safer to provide our own anyway???
j

27 Aug 2007

Quote by curvynjackb
... What has surprised me is the number of guys who turn up to play but don't bring their own condoms...

Thats such a pet hate of mine!
Tantamount to turning up to a party without a bottle!
To me that shows your not making an effort or you just don't care!
What is it?
They are not that expensive ffs! :doh:
One party I went to I was such a plum handing out my condoms to others that when I wanted one I had none left! :shock:
To say I was fuckin pissed off was an understatement!
As foxy says... with regular check ups there is no reason for nothaving a fecking drawer full o the damn things... I do!

31 Jul 2008

Quote by anais
I found it hard to get dental dams from my local chemist... couldnt believe it! :? ......................
What lasts longer than Love.........
Herpes!!
xanaisx

I resurrected this thread because I came across an ad for the oral dams Anais mentioned - both latex and non-latex :-

31 Jul 2008

Quote by HJ
I found it hard to get dental dams from my local chemist... couldnt believe it! :? ......................
What lasts longer than Love.........
Herpes!!
xanaisx

I resurrected this thread because I came across an ad for the oral dams Anais mentioned - both latex and non-latex :-

Cheers John....nice to see they are getting to be more readily available! :thumbup:

4 Aug 2008

I think that people meet several times and maybe stop using condoms if they think that the other person is have met with a guy for 9 years and kind of know what he is we bareback with him. When we first meet people we always use protection,bareback is for very good friends only.
At the end of the day its personal choice,if people are really worried about infections they should wear a condom or if other peoples lack of personal responsibility worries them they should find another you wear a rubber what does it matter if others dont.

4 Aug 2008

Quote by HJ
I found it hard to get dental dams from my local chemist... couldnt believe it! :? ......................
What lasts longer than Love.........
Herpes!!
xanaisx

I resurrected this thread because I came across an ad for the oral dams Anais mentioned - both latex and non-latex :-

Got mine off ebay when I ordered the condoms etc.
Cx

5 Aug 2008

Quote by Calista
I found it hard to get dental dams from my local chemist... couldnt believe it! :? ......................
What lasts longer than Love.........
Herpes!!
xanaisx

I resurrected this thread because I came across an ad for the oral dams Anais mentioned - both latex and non-latex :-

Got mine off ebay when I ordered the condoms etc.
Cx
I didn't even realise Ebay sold condoms etc, wouldn't have thought to look... learn something new here everyday! Cheers Callie!