I'll be the first to add a simple and well meant reply to this Fred - as much as I totally respect your views and wishes I do have to say the place will be a poorer place for not having you around.
For those of us who support the mods and appreciate the work they do the fact that people have brought reactions like this is very, very sad. I'll say no more on the subject for fear of being repetetive but I felt saying something, and publicly, would at least show you and the other mods that some of us ARE bothered about the current feelings held by those that do the majority of the work on here.
Carpathian
Glad to hear you're feeling better Fred. And may I start by sucking up and saying that you and the other mods do a GREAT job, and I don't think you'll find any shortage of people here who feel the same way. Sure, there are a small number who disagree, but I don't think anyone can please all of the people all of the time.
There were a couple of specific points I wanted to make though... Firstly, if you really want to quit, then quit. There's probably not been a big hand emerge from the clouds and point at you while a deep sonorous voice proclaims "thou SHALL be a moderator on swingingheaven and make the Internet SAFE for nice swingers & swinger-wannabes". This isn't your sacred duty and if you don't want to do it anymore then you don't have to. I'm sure we'll all be very grateful for your efforts, and hopefully someone else will step forward to help you in the same way you've helped everyone else. I've had to make a similar decision myself in the past and to be honest, I felt much better for it.
Secondly, maybe it's because I've only been here three months, but I seem to be alone in not having noticed a huge decrease in the entertainment-value of the cafe. I'm certainly still having a ball. There have been a few things that have disturbed me, and I have raised those concerns - and I don't particularly regret doing so, because I think making this the best of all possible places should be the responsibility of all of us - not just the mods. I certainly never intended to question the fine work of the mods, however, because it really is fine work. There have been odd decisions I've disagreed with, but that's only to be expected - and I always think diversity of opinion is the spice of life. (If I only wanted to hear voices that agree with me, I'd just sit home and talk to myself all day.)
Maybe, rather than replacing the current mods, a better solution would be to supplement them with more mods so the workload isn't too obscene? (Not that I'm volunteering - I'm already an admin on another forum and with that and other stuff I do, I like to think I already do my bit to help my fellow man.)
1. Let's not be plain OTT about this
2. These are small, modest scale Fora and what they are about is UNIMPORTANT
3. The Cafe has NOT lost a sense of humour or zaniness
4. You're certainly welcome back
5. It IS worth it
I have spent a while thinking of what to say in response to this thread, but all I have to say in short is that the place would not be the same without you Fred.
The times have certainly changed, as we all know, but I think if we're all patient, VERY patient then the bad winds will eventually blow away. The influx of bad publicity and newbies that we Dont want will soon realise what this site is actually about and then take themselves elsewear. I am sure of it.
So, to all the regs, nice newbies (of which there are many... Redvelvet takes a bow!) and long suffering mods, lets just please stick together and weather this out.
Well............For my first post on the forum(the wife makes all our posts usually) I sure picked a good subject to loose my cherry with...
I am mainly a chatroom user and as some of you may or may not be aware my wife and I have just become room ops/moderators....
As Fred has stated this is a thankless task in the eyes of the numpties but to the vast majority our job is one that is needed and they appreciate what we do..
I had no idea that you had been ill Fred otherwise we WOULD have sent you a message of well wishes...
Your input to this site has been limited to the chatroom as far as my eyes were concerned because that was my pastime but I have seen the personal pages you have set up for others and I have no doubt you have input in all areas of the site..
If you want to hang up ya boots m8 then you are obviously free to do so but take it from me m8....
YOU WILL BE MISSED
I empathise with your feelings Fred. I have been a member since November, in which time I have only posted 20something posts, so I'm not exactly the most prolific user!
I would log on and have a browse around the forum, and the banter between blue, Will, KitKat, Jags, and all the rest of you (including RVM - where'd he go ?!?!) always put a smile on my face. I must be honest and say that I am not an active swinger, as I don't have a partner (!), so I never felt like I should really be getting too involved. I watched with interest as Sappho and Will set the screen alight, and always loved reading about blue's latest antics (sorry if that sounds a bit twee).
Over the last few weeks there have been lots of new members - who I'm sure are welcomed by the mods, Mark, and all the longer-serving memebrs, but people just start new threads about their favourite film (er, that's been done at least twice before), or tell Beckham jokes that I had in my Woolies christmas cracker three years ago.
As I said, I have never been very active because I don't think the genuine swingers at SH need 5000 single blokes stampeding over the forum or the chatroom, and the way I read your post is that you have just about had enough of the wankers (no pun intended) who are doing just that.
Fred, I wouldn't know you from Adam if a bumped into you in Granby Street tomorrow, but I thank you for putting a smile on my face over the last few months, and I hope you get some clarity (as the Yanks say) and, most importantly, you and the equally lovely Wilma 'Keep On Swinging' :-)
I've taken this thread and Sgt Bilko's to heart. Both have struck a chord with me and caused me to reassess how I feel about the forum and the people in it, and the ramblings below are the result, incoherent though they may be...
A few months ago I started a thread about the friends I had made on the site and what it meant to me, and those thoughts and feelings still hold true further down the line. In fact, those feelings are stronger than they were. Yes, they took a knock at the beginning of March when Mr Collymore hit the headlines and the gates of Swinging Heaven crashed open under the deluge of the interested, the curious and the sensationalists; but when all is said and done, the spirit of the Cafe in particular remains and so does my joy and delight in the Cafe and its members.
I have had the pleasure of meeting several of the moderators and sys ops - and not just in the Biblical sense - and I now count them as personal friends because they are the nicest people anyone could wish to meet, in or out of bed. They are real people with thoughts and interests outside the fora; they put such hard work into making the site what it is, and for little reward other than the adulation of their appreciators of which I am proudly one.
The loss of any of the current moderators would inflict damage on the humour, the variety, the fairness and the credibility of Swinging Heaven.
Yes, the Cafe has been changing. It changes with every newbie who posts and becomes a regular, but this is because, like the people who post, the forum is organic, not static. It is growing all the time, and in that growth it is also evolving. The moderators have to keep on top of that to ensure that the site's development does not become an uncontrolled rampage and so all members can contribute in fairness and responsibility.
Love Sappho xxx
Hi Fred and also to sarge also.
I fell that this thread also overlaps with the Sarges detection of atmosphere change.
I am a relative newbie but wish to express my gratitude to the moderators who perform heroics in keeping this site both ordered and welcoming to those who appreciate the common courtesies of life.
The most difficult life skill we encounter in our daily lives is communication....it is what makes people, armies and leaders great. We all take it for granted but we all fall foul of its subtleties how may times have we said ....sorry I didn't mean it that way. Recognising that communication is two way and listening is also part of the aquired skill ...how many times have we listened but not heard.
This site is all about communication, its continued existence is testimony to the skill of the people who founded it, nurtured it, enjoyed it and cherished it ....we are fortunate that, thanks to their efforts, we have this vehicle to express ourselves as we wish.
Fred I hope you will continue to moderate for you do it with a communicators skill. If you don't I will understand but you will be sorely missed.
I am sure all the moderators are suffering from the massive influx of curious newbies. This will pass. I hope that you all have thepatience to see it so.
A heart felt thanks once again from me .
Hi Fred,
Welcome back. I have read your thread starter three times, and have given some considerable thought to what I should write in reply. So this is more of a speech to other roomies rather that to yourself.
I don't think anyone would argue with the premise that Swinging Heaven is a great site. Those of us who do care about maintaining the high standards of simple enjoyment, fun and frivolity have volunteered to take jobs as either Forum Moderators or Chatroom System Operators. Working as either can be more than a handfull at times.
Many roomies have 'posted' their admiration for the work the Moderators do although very few realise just how much is entailed, although a look at Mal609's post in this thread might enlighten them.
Similarly in The Chatroom, most members are totally unaware of what a lot of work goes on behind the scenes. Some people simply think SyOps are there to kick them out. They know nothing of the work that has been done just to try and make The Chatroom run smoothly. Rules and regulations don't suddenly materialise out of thin air. Even fewer people know that the SyOps have rules that they have to obey. All rules have to be formulated and that involves discussions, sometimes protracted one's at that, over every single line. For those who don't know already, Fred had a hell of a lot to do with that as well.
As far as I am aware Fred is the only person on this site who works as both a Moderator and as a senior or Super SysOp. Because of his computer expertise he has advised dozens of members, including myself, who have problems of various sorts. All this takes up time, and time is a precious comodity, especially when you have a job and a family as well.
I think I can understand where Fred is coming from. I felt something similar some ten years ago when holding a senior position in a nationally known company. It was simply too much pressure. It got to a stage where it started to affect my health, so I came to a simple solution. I said, 'Fuck It' there's more to life than this. I now work for myself for less than half what I earned then, but I am happy, and I enjoy that feeling.
So, I'm not suggesting to Fred for one moment that he ceases to be a site member, but what I would suggest is that he take a break for a while. Hang up the Moderator and SyOPs hats for a week or two. I'm sure none of us would mind him having a break. The Other Mods and SyOps will take the strain. When you feel like it Fred, pop in and post by all means and chat in the chatroom, but do it as an ordinary site member. Take some time to get your own life back. When for instance did you actually last get to chat to someone in the chatroom Fred, or better still, chat up another couple with a view to meeting? I bet it was a long, long time ago.
Swinging Heaven is very addictive, I know, just ask me who switches on his computer and logs in, before having breakfast.
I may be quite out of order in making this post, if so, I apologise wholeheartedly to all, and especially Fred. It was not made with any malice whatsoever. I know what Fred has done to help this site. Directly or indirectly, all members have benefitted greatly from his input, whether they know it or not.
Harry0
Hello ppl. This thread has really oppened my eyes as to how much work goes into keeping and controlling a web site. I have to say to all the mods and other ppl who help to run this site dont give give up on it. I can tell you all know that in my personal opinion this is the best swinging site on the www. The ppl on here are very friendlly and will bend over backwards to help anyone in need as I know for a fact. Thanks kitkat for the help with the spelling.
Please Please Please dont give up on something that you have all obviously spent a lot af time and effort on.
My turn now???
Since Monday 13 March we Mods have deleted and banned upward of 300 users from the photo ads for their arrogant flouting of the 'no telephone' rule. THREE HUNDRED PLUS... do you know why the new rule was brought in??? Cos Mark had to deal with an extremelydistressed and irrate under-age person whose phone number had been posted in a sexually explicit ad. This involved the police. This involved parents. This could have been much more shit than it was. And stll we get people trying to circumnavigate the system and putting their mobile numbers in ads in all sorts of weird ways. Roll on the Mods who work into the night and early morning dealing with this kind of stuff to keep the site safe and reponsible.
... I WAS going to rant on for ages about the work done behind the scenes but that would be counter productive.
Postings have been stifled. For my part I have held back in making many postings because of the fear of being taken the wrong way - my Mod hat must have got stuck on without me knowing. Some people who have joined up recently behave more rudely than some of my most rude Y10s, having petted lips, taking umbrage, seeing umbrage, looking for umbrage and causing ubmrage. (god, I love the word 'umbrage'!).
It is VERY OBVIOUS that those who are supportive of the work here have posted replies and those who are the cause of the upheaval, alienation and disruption are nowhere in sight!
I too have made many friends here - those I have met are, without exception, the kindest most caring and wonderful people around. When I met one person recently, for the first time and for a non-sexual reasons, the first thing he did was throw his arms around me and give me a huge hug... instant karma. Ditto with the others I met that evening - wine flowed, piss-taking took place and I felt genuinely welcome and wanted! Most I speak to on the phone frequently - Wednesday is a good day for that - some I speak to daily and others are there for me when things get tough. Fred once answered the phone to me saying 'what's wrong sweetheart'. That'swhy I'm still here, still plugging away, still dealing with the high tides and green grass.
As two others have said - if you don't like then then take your postings elsewhere. Cos I LOVE it here, even at m. when there are 15 posts all saying 'any sluts fancy a fuck' in the Cafe and when some idiot has posted 20 ads in the same section and I get a PM saying 'still love you'. 8) 8)
Now.. where did I put those fluffy pink handcuffs?????
Do the Mods do a good job....NO...they do an excellent job and help keep the site as it is meant to be. Do I know of all the unstinting work that goes on behind the scenes, YES, well actually I do, as I know the hard work and hours that the said Fred Flintstone has put in. That's one Mod, times that by the rest of them and the whole job is fu*king huge.
Do I have a problem with Mods...NO...Do I have a problem with rudeness and an arrogance (intentioned or not) by some against the posters of the "one liner fuck me now" type, YES I bloody well do.
Do I have a problem with anything else on this site NO!
I feel that I may well be one of a number to whom the snide comments etc that have crept into this thread are directed against. Well in my defence, if my concerns about the Mods posting "name and shame" were so wrong, why was the thread altered? I know the Mods discuss such things, so why such a decision. If the Mods have only acted in the best interests of the site, why did their postings, mainly in "Lets Meet" look unwelcoming and superior? I say it only from being an impartial observer.
I am a trained historian, I look at the evidence and let it tell it's own story, I felt, as is clear, a number of others did that the berating of the "lets Meeters" was at times not in the best interests of the site or its members.
If the Mods are beyond reproach (even they are human and can make a mistake....personal feelings to take over etc) then why is there such a hullabaloo and all this defence? If I was wrong about the "name and shame" just tell me so and Mod as you see fit.
I thought I was allowed to pass an opinion and open up a debate in the Forum. I thought by its very name that it was supposed to be a place to chat, discuss, debate, maybe even argue at times. Maybe I was wrong. If so, I apologise to anyone that felt my passing of an opinion was untoward.
I do not believe I actually insulted any Mod, though I did challenge the actions as an open user of the Forum. My challenge led to a change in a particular thread, hopefully for the better upon reflection, is that not good interaction between Mods and Roomies?
The Mods appear to feel under attack and I feel like a very close friend of mine may be stepping back from his role as a Mod in part due to my posts. My posts were never meant to do that to anyone, least of all someone with whom I share a close bond ( and share wives..lol).
I simply spoke as I found ( and I know Fred respects that) and maybe my challenge was too much and opened up a larger can of worms (euuuuggghhhhh) that was never meant to be opened.
My beef was with the method not the Mods, I do appreciate all that they do and I know Fran has asked Mods to act on her behalf with some numpties we have had...and all thanks and credit due for their diligence. I mean that in all sincerity.
I once said that I thought I ought to stop posting in the Forum and Mark said that I shouldn't and that the forum needed posters like me. Once again though, I feel like I should make a personal exit and will do so.
We (Fran and myself) have had the good fortune of meeting a few Mods and Sys Ops and we have thoroughly enjoyed their company and humour. I hope I caused you no offence, cos none was ever intended.
Enjoy the Forum you guys, it is still the best around and will continue to be so I am sure.
By the way...Wilma...its always Wilma....Daphne doesn't have a look in...see you soon sweetie xxxxxxxx
Fred my man, you DO NOT dare leave, the Forum needs you! (Glass of Shiraz Sir?)
Cheers
Stu...of the Fran and....well it'll just be Fran from here on in.
:) 
:D :D
.
