Sexual Deviancy, or the Hidden Norm?

25 May 2006

Hello peeps wave

I have been thinking about this for some time and just wondered what others take on it was.
Over the last few years I have taken to deliberately steering general vanilla conversation towards the subject of swinging.
Now this has been down the pub, at bbqâ€™s / parties, online, pretty much anywhere really where there has been social interaction.
I have been careful not to show my cards (at first) and have just been chatting in general terms and I find that there is a pattern emerging, which goes something like this:
Initial reaction:
:shock: one of slight distaste, possibly even fear, but most often the cavalier â€œyeah, dirty feckersâ€ kind of response.
Half way into the conversation reaction:
Amused but rising interest, open curiosity, or suppressed excitement. â€œreally? Well I didnâ€™t know that, I thought
Some of the misconceptions I have encountered are quite staggering, i.e. â€œ I thought it was just for the rich and famousâ€ rolleyes

â€œ oh I wouldnâ€™t fit in, its only for the â€˜body beautifulâ€™ and Iâ€™m a size 16â€ :shock: â€œI couldnâ€™t afford the feesâ€ :rotflmaoâ€
By the end of the conversation:
:bounce: extreme curiosity, pmâ€™s / emails / phone calls with the â€œIâ€™d love to know more but didnâ€˜t like to ask in company / open forum etcâ€ theme, or Rampant enthusiasm, i.e. â€œwhere do I sign upâ€
Never, not once have I encountered a completely negative response.
So my question is, if the press were less Victorian in their attitude towards the lifestyle (as seems slowly to be happening) and swinging became more socially acceptable, what percentage of the population do you think would find the lifestyle to their taste?
Going on my experiences over the past year or so, I would go as far as to say I think perhaps as high as 70%.
Alternatively, is the secrecy a factor? The other thing that has come across very strongly in my conversations is that the lifestyle exudes an air of mystery and adventure, of secret societies and clandestine groups, could this also be a big attraction to those on the outside?
I would be very interested to hear your views.
(I am now going to get some work done :roll: )

25 May 2006

Quote by Pete_sw
Alternatively, is the secrecy a factor? The other thing that has come across very strongly in my conversations is that the lifestyle exudes an air of mystery and adventure, of secret societies and clandestine groups, could this also be a big attraction to those on the outside?

Bit like the Masons then. Does that mean we can have a secret handshake too? :giggle:
I see what you mean though Pete. I reckon most of my friends would be horrified if they knew of my 'alternate' lifestyle but I think it's more through ignorance of the whole subject of swinging than of the act of swinging itself. Ask people what they think it's all about and the majority will envision a large group of people throwing car keys into the middle of the room and take your pick! As we all know nothing could be further from the truth ( unless that's what you're into )
I think if 'normal' people were given the chance to find out for themselves, without obligation to try it, they would be pleasantly surprised by the manner by which we all go about our swinging business. Yes, it's all about sex at the end of the day but to me, it goes much deeper than that. It's about making new friends and being able to talk about this side of me with like minded pervs.....I mean people :giggle:
:swingingchair:

25 May 2006

I know that I have met virtually and in "real life" loads of people off here and really enjoyed the experience.
when talking to friends I have been quite open and positive about swinging and the people that I have met. and they have certainly expressed an interest too....
I think there are more of us than we know..... ! lol

25 May 2006

SPOT ON PETE
EXACTLY MY RESPONSES TO START
THATS HOW WE GOT HERE
I DO THINK THOUGH THAT MORE PEOPLE ARE BEGINNING TO REALISE THAT WE DONT HAVE TWO HEADS AND FORKED TAIL(MORES THE PITY)
THINK WHAT U COULD DO WITH TWO HEADS
silly

hwoar: CHESTY

25 May 2006

Quote by Pete_sw
...Over the last few years I have taken to deliberately steering general vanilla conversation towards the subject of swinging.

Pete
My FB has enough problems with my Sexual Perversions... chuck swinging into the pot & god knows :shock:
I try to be as honest as I can with the vanillas I do meet, most of my mates know I'm 'on the net' but right now I'm in that twilight zone where I enjoy this persons company so much I'm not sure how the reaction will be If I was to drop the bomb & tell her "Oh, by the way do you remember the time I had to 'help out' Mr & Mrs Jo Blogs?"
I dont want to turn ova my hand just yet...
like you I'm still chatting in general terms untill I can see which way the land lies...
Until then It's not a nice feeling not being the real 'me'
But I do wear my Swinging Heaven badge everywhere I go & had some good conversations when someone has asked about it :twisted:

25 May 2006

Quote by Pete_sw
...Over the last few years I have taken to deliberately steering general vanilla conversation towards the subject of swinging.

Pete
My FB has enough problems with my Sexual Perversions... chuck swinging into the pot & god knows :shock:
I try to be as honest as I can with the vanillas I do meet, most of my mates know I'm 'on the net' but right now I'm in that twilight zone where I enjoy this persons company so much I'm not sure how the reaction will be If I was to drop the bomb & tell her "Oh, by the way do you remember the time I had to 'help out' Mr & Mrs Jo Blogs?"
I dont want to turn ova my hand just yet...
like you I'm still chatting in general terms untill I can see which way the land lies...
Until then It's not a nice feeling not being the real 'me'
But I do wear my Swinging Heaven badge everywhere I go & had some good conversations when someone has asked about it :twisted:

25 May 2006

Quote by Pete_sw
...Over the last few years I have taken to deliberately steering general vanilla conversation towards the subject of swinging.

Pete
My FB has enough problems with my Sexual Perversions... chuck swinging into the pot & god only knows :shock:
I try to be as honest as I can with the vanillas I do meet, most of my mates know I'm 'on the net'
Right now I'm in that twilight zone where I enjoy this persons company so much I'm not sure how the reaction will be If I was to drop the bomb & tell her "Oh, by the way do you remember the time I had to 'help out' Mr & Mrs Jo Blogs?"
I dont want to turn ova my hand just yet...
like you I'm still chatting in general terms until I can see which way the land lies...
Until then It's not a nice feeling not being the real 'me'
But I do wear my Swinging Heaven badge everywhere I go & had some good conversations when someone has asked about it :twisted:

25 May 2006

Quote by Pete_sw
...Over the last few years I have taken to deliberately steering general vanilla conversation towards the subject of swinging.

Pete
My FB has enough problems with my Sexual Perversions... chuck swinging into the pot & god only knows :shock:
I try to be as honest as I can with the vanillas I do meet, most of my mates know I'm 'on the net'
Right now I'm in that twilight zone where I enjoy this persons company so much I'm not sure how the reaction will be If I was to drop the bomb & tell her "Oh, by the way do you remember the time I had to 'help out' Mr & Mrs Jo Blogs?"
I dont want to turn ova my hand just yet...
like you I'm still chatting in general terms until I can see which way the land lies...
Until then It's not a nice feeling not being the real 'me'
But I do wear my Swinging Heaven badge everywhere I go & had some good conversations when someone has asked about it :twisted:

25 May 2006

I want a SH badge! is it like a blue peter badge?
where do i get one?
ps i know the secret hand shake!
maz xx

25 May 2006

Quote by Pete_sw
...Over the last few years I have taken to deliberately steering general vanilla conversation towards the subject of swinging.

Pete
My FB has enough problems with my Sexual Perversions... chuck swinging into the pot & god only knows :shock:
I try to be as honest as I can with the vanillas I do meet, most of my mates know I'm 'on the net'
Right now I'm in that twilight zone where I enjoy this persons company so much I'm not sure how the reaction will be If I was to drop the bomb & tell her "Oh, by the way do you remember the time I had to 'help out' Mr & Mrs Jo Blogs?"
I dont want to turn ova my hand just yet...
like you I'm still chatting in general terms until I can see which way the land lies...
Until then It's not a nice feeling not being the real 'me'
But I do wear my Swinging Heaven badge everywhere I go & had some good conversations when someone has asked about it :twisted:

25 May 2006

RPM, we heard you the first time!! :shock: confused

25 May 2006

heheh, but really, the few friends that we have chatted about it have had varying reactions, no one has been bothered, the general seemed to be, 'good on you, but I'd get to jealous letting my partner do that'
That seemed to be the reaction from those perhaps weren't that comfortable in their own relationship, ie hadn't built up enough trust, so is understandable.
An ex of maz recently tried to braoch the subject of swinging (we think he has or someone he knows has seen our profile) and tried to make out that it was 'fithly, for people who weren;t in a proper relationship, how could the guy love a girl like that, the girl is only doing it to please the guy and doesn't really want to, he didnt understand why anyone would do it etc....'
He was clearly trying to see what I would say to it - if I would rise to the bait and reveal my 'dirty secret'!
How den and I laughed!
It was his attempt at a dig at D and didn't go down well! hehehehe, I can't wait to tell him i'm having the time of my life and he couldn't be further from the truth :-)
I

25 May 2006

Quote by BiWelshMinx
RPM, we heard you the first time!! :shock:

FFS!!! Get that stammer sorted! smackbottom

25 May 2006

:doh: :crazy: :eeek: OMG... is that a record?
five numpty same posts in a thread...
Someone told me I was a quick repeater but this takes the :fuckinghell:
bet I do this five time as well ffs!

25 May 2006

:doh: :crazy: :eeek: OMG... is that a record?
five numpty same posts in a thread...
Someone told me I was a quick repeter but this takes the :fuckinghell:
bet I do this five time as well ffs!

25 May 2006

RPM :lol2: :lol2: :lol2: :lol2:

25 May 2006

Quote by redpantherman
:doh: :crazy: :eeek: OMG... is that a record?
five numpty same posts in a thread...
Someone told me I was a quick repeter but this takes the :fuckinghell:
bet I do this five time as well ffs!

PARDON... could you *repeat* that again please?
xanaisx

25 May 2006

Its an interesting point.
to be honest, if I get chatting to virtual vanilla friends, i always tell them that I am a member here.
And yes, the responses are what you have said. However, that said, the peeps that that I have told that actually come and pay a visit to the cafe do see a different side and some have actually stayed.
Just goes to show, that old adage happens time and time again - Never judge a book by its cover ....................... (or what the press insinuate)

26 May 2006

OK, lets take a look from another direction. When someone says they are interested in swinging, do they mean they are interested in swinging or spreading it about? Is there a difference?
Would a person be as keen on going swinging if their partner was going to the same place or would they stop their partner going? Is the difference, real swinging encourage their life partners to enjoy swinging and other swingers are out for sex?
In other words can a 'rake' be called a swinger? That depends on the definition of swinging, and that changes from person to person.
Am I going to answer any of the questions? No! On the other hand, someone who shares, in my view a better person than someone who does not.

26 May 2006

'kin ell red......how many fb's have you got ???? :shock:

26 May 2006

Quote by DeviousLiasons
Hidden Norm? Don't be daft... he's just over there at the bar!!

:shock:
Blimey, that takes me back, just as I was oiling me zimmer too rotflmao

26 May 2006

Quote by
OK, lets take a look from another direction. When someone says they are interested in swinging, do they mean they are interested in swinging or spreading it about? Is there a difference?
Would a person be as keen on going swinging if their partner was going to the same place or would they stop their partner going? Is the difference, real swinging encourage their life partners to enjoy swinging and other swingers are out for sex?
In other words can a 'rake' be called a swinger? That depends on the definition of swinging, and that changes from person to person.
Am I going to answer any of the questions? No! On the other hand, someone who shares, in my view a better person than someone who does not.

Beat me to it.....
Pete.... so much depends on how you veiw and describe swinging. What is swinging to you and your experience of swinging will more than likey not be the same as mine or then next persons.
If you are asking if vanilla people have ever entertained the thought of having sex with other people - I would find it hard to believe that the majority have not thought about it for a few minutes at some point - even though that is all it was - a thought.
Do you beleive you would get the same reaction from your friends if you had said...
"Oh yes it is quite a regular thing for some swinging-wifes to be spunked on by up to 20 guys who she doesn't know from Adam, whilst swinging-hubby sucks a few of them off"
dunno

26 May 2006

Quote by PoloLady
OK, lets take a look from another direction. When someone says they are interested in swinging, do they mean they are interested in swinging or spreading it about? Is there a difference?
Would a person be as keen on going swinging if their partner was going to the same place or would they stop their partner going? Is the difference, real swinging encourage their life partners to enjoy swinging and other swingers are out for sex?
In other words can a 'rake' be called a swinger? That depends on the definition of swinging, and that changes from person to person.
Am I going to answer any of the questions? No! On the other hand, someone who shares, in my view a better person than someone who does not.

Beat me to it.....
Pete.... so much depends on how you veiw and describe swinging. What is swinging to you and your experience of swinging will more than likey not be the same as mine or then next persons.
If you are asking if vanilla people have ever entertained the thought of having sex with other people - I would find it hard to believe that the majority have not thought about it for a few minutes at some point - even though that is all it was - a thought.
Do you beleive you would get the same reaction from your friends if you had said...
"Oh yes it is quite a regular thing for some swinging-wifes to be spunked on by up to 20 guys who she doesn't know from Adam, whilst swinging-hubby sucks a few of them off"
dunno

Beat you no not me.
........

26 May 2006

Quote by PoloLady
Pete.... so much depends on how you veiw and describe swinging. What is swinging to you and your experience of swinging will more than likey not be the same as mine or then next persons.
If you are asking if vanilla people have ever entertained the thought of having sex with other people - I would find it hard to believe that the majority have not thought about it for a few minutes at some point - even though that is all it was - a thought.
Do you beleive you would get the same reaction from your friends if you had said...
"Oh yes it is quite a regular thing for some swinging-wifes to be spunked on by up to 20 guys who she doesn't know from Adam, whilst swinging-hubby sucks a few of them off"

Hi Polo
A very valid and interesting point, and to be honest, my vanilla discussions have never really got into the nitty-gritty of the countless variables of swinging behaviour / sexual preferences, but dealt more with the ethos of the lifestyle and the idea of open minded sexual sharing within a relationship.
I must confess that the majority of vanilla friends and acquaintances that I have discussed this with are couples and women usually within the 30 to 50 age group, so maybe demographics also have their role to play in this discussion, which was partly the reason for this thread in the first place, i.e. to get a broader view.
Now I understand that there are many who will avoid the subject of swinging when talking to vanillas simply because of the real, or imagined threat of outing themselves, and this of course is understandable, however I can only speak from my own experience and so far, my experiments have had very positive results, from one end of the spectrum of spending an entire evening sitting in a pub beer garden talking to a couple (who until that night were total strangers to us) talking about our experiences of the lifestyle, the other of having a couple in their late 40â€™s almost beg us to introduce them into the scene.
Bearing in mind that we live in a rural area consisting of a small market town surrounded by very small villages where around 40% of the population is transient, and the other 60% probably havenâ€™t travelled further than the county borders, the above is not a bad batting average. It would be interesting to do a similar, and probably far more extensive survey of suburbia and the cities.
The other interesting thing that I neglected to say in my last post, is that the vast majority of people I have talked to seemed genuinely interested in the mechanics of the lifestyle, rather that lighting up with the â€œoh feck this is so horny ravish me nowâ€ attitude rolleyes

So there you have it, I still personally think if you had the technology to read the nations minds, the vast majority would at least show a passing interest in our way of life.
IMHO :dunno:

27 May 2006

so why`s your mouse buttton all sticky????? biggrin

27 May 2006

Quote by twos_company
so why`s your mouse buttton all sticky?????

:wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker:

27 May 2006

It always amuses me when you see an article in the gutter press and it states they were doing something "obsene and not fit to be described in a family newspaper"
If it's not suitable material for the paper, then why the hell are they writing about it?
The answer being "sex sells". People read it because they are interested/curious.
Those that can do and those that can't talk/read about it lol

27 May 2006

Quote by Pete_sw
Going on my experiences over the past year or so, I would go as far as to say I think perhaps as high as 70%.

Yeah, but did you ever pull?

28 May 2006

So my question is, if the press were less Victorian in their attitude towards the lifestyle (as seems slowly to be happening) and swinging became more socially acceptable, what percentage of the population do you think would find the lifestyle to their taste?
Going on my experiences over the past year or so, I would go as far as to say I think perhaps as high as 70%.
Alternatively, is the secrecy a factor? The other thing that has come across very strongly in my conversations is that the lifestyle exudes an air of mystery and adventure, of secret societies and clandestine groups, could this also be a big attraction to those on the outside?
I would be very interested to hear your views.
I think if you consider the overall content in all the press it usually reflects what various people want in our country. So the continuation of 'older' values and morals is reflected in certain types of newspaper, whereas 'newer' attitudes are promoted in those papers which consider themselves 'new', and which sometimes results in a new magazine.
Publications are big business so they usually get it more or less right, when pitching the overall attitudes, because people will only buy publications if they get to read or see the world in the way they want to perceive it.
So as far as swinging goes in the UK, in terms of public acceptance, its unlikely to be given acceptance as it represents an 'older' idea. However the promotion of adult and 'health' clubs achieves more or less the same thing as swinging and will replace the legacy of 'wife swapping'. And its more likely that your estimated figure could be achieveable. smile

Secrecy and such like can draw people into all sorts of things. Everyone likes to unravel a mystery. But I think there's probably more depth to discovering the inner sanctums of various established societies which exist, but its a life long commitment, and not without responsibilities.
It may be secrecy, discretion or the pursuit of sexual experience, but our legacy of attitudes and morals in the UK forces many sexual adventurers abroad. Which is why it seems okay to do anything on a package trip to Ibiza or take a gap year out and shag the world.

28 May 2006

An interesting point Duncan.
I certainly think the Victorian attitudes and opinions in the press give a biased view of swinging.
I do think attitudes of sexual liberation are changing - My friends don't know that I'm a swinger and some of them would be horrified, yet I know many of them in the past (at college or whilst on holiday etc) have had threesomes/foursomes.
However although I'm sure many people are curious about swinging, a lot wouldn't be able to deal with issues of jealousy if swinging with a spouse or long term partner.