Right....I'm posting this cos I could do with some more takes on this.....on tuesday my sister took an overdose of paracetamol, after a row ovwer the phone with her partner over money.
I'm having a hard time getting my head round this, and a hard time trying to make sense of al sorts of jumbled thoughts going on in my head.
Thankfully, it appears it was a cry for help, she felt at the time there was no option....but once she had done it, instantly regretted what she had done and called the ambulance herself.....
She has kids, and the thought that she felt like even leaving her kids behind was better than anything else, is something that I cant make sense of.
Just wondered if anyone can help me unjumble my thoughts?
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Suicide, a cry for help or selfish act?
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It's both Boney imo. It's generally a cry for help as the person attempting it 'normally' is at the point of desperation BUT it is selfish in that they don't quite realise the impact on those around them.
As I've mentioned to you earlier, I know as I've been one on the receiving end before.
Mrs B....
As I've mentioned to you earlier, I know as I've been one on the receiving end before.
Mrs B....
Sex God
Quote by __random_orbit__
No reflection on your personal circumstances Bonie.
I feel suicide as an act can be as justifiable, selfish, brave, cowardly, noble or stupid as any other human act driven by emotion or ethic.
lp
Spot on.
Sex God
Quote by __random_orbit__
No reflection on your personal circumstances Bonie.
I feel suicide as an act can be as justifiable, selfish, brave, cowardly, noble or stupid as any other human act driven by emotion or ethic.
lp
Yep........Works for me as well.....
Whatever it is it certainly shows that your sister needs help at the moment and hopefully she is receiving some form of help from family and prefessionals....
Casanova
I think suicide is a selfish act, but at the same time we are conditioned to believe we need to be independent, insular, take the brunt of any problems with head held high, when what we really want to do is ask for help. If it was easier to admit to yourself that a situation is beyond you, then maybe it would be an option taken in preference to opting out.
Stop worrying about the fact she did it, talk to the nearest and dearest in her life and make sure she knows that you are there to listen and help where they can, look at how the situation can be used to be positive.
I'm not saying that you or anyone else have not been helpful before this happened, because as I said when you are conditioned by society not to ask, it is easy to refuse help even when it is offered.
Hope something good comes out of this bad situation and don't forget the kids xx
Stop worrying about the fact she did it, talk to the nearest and dearest in her life and make sure she knows that you are there to listen and help where they can, look at how the situation can be used to be positive.
I'm not saying that you or anyone else have not been helpful before this happened, because as I said when you are conditioned by society not to ask, it is easy to refuse help even when it is offered.
Hope something good comes out of this bad situation and don't forget the kids xx
Bonedigger,
A hard topic to approach, but one that I have dealings with myself.
My Father has tried to take his own life three times now, the first time we were all shocked we all gathered around and pulled together to help.
The first time was seen as something he felt he had no way out of so we felt sorry for him and helped to understand what drove him to such a choice.
The second time I showed him pictures of my children and asked what he expected me to tell them, I was angry and confused why he had to do it again.
The third time I realised that there is no one he thinks of but himself to me now what he has done is nothing more than a selfish act, but he has never taken enough drugs to finish the job off.
I love him to bits but feel hopeless in trying to help, one day he may well do it right and that is something I have now got my head around.
I hope your sister would be understood, we all seem to go around in a circle with all sorts of feelings when this happens. I hope she comes to realise nothing can be that serious as to do this again.
We looking on feel so helpless, anger, wonder why, how, etc it is a normal response to such a shocking discovery, and one we never really understand why.
My thoughts are with you and all your family.
I hope it all sorts its self out soon.
A hard topic to approach, but one that I have dealings with myself.
My Father has tried to take his own life three times now, the first time we were all shocked we all gathered around and pulled together to help.
The first time was seen as something he felt he had no way out of so we felt sorry for him and helped to understand what drove him to such a choice.
The second time I showed him pictures of my children and asked what he expected me to tell them, I was angry and confused why he had to do it again.
The third time I realised that there is no one he thinks of but himself to me now what he has done is nothing more than a selfish act, but he has never taken enough drugs to finish the job off.
I love him to bits but feel hopeless in trying to help, one day he may well do it right and that is something I have now got my head around.
I hope your sister would be understood, we all seem to go around in a circle with all sorts of feelings when this happens. I hope she comes to realise nothing can be that serious as to do this again.
We looking on feel so helpless, anger, wonder why, how, etc it is a normal response to such a shocking discovery, and one we never really understand why.
My thoughts are with you and all your family.
I hope it all sorts its self out soon.
people try to commit suicide for a variety of reason mainly because of the emmotional state of mind at the time either rationally or non-rationally.
some people do it as a cry for help as they have nothing else they can do or anyone they feel they can turn to and they realise what they have done and seek help, support and advice.
some are determined to kill themselves and unfortuately there is little you can do to try and help these people, but support them as they eventually will succeed.
bonedigger, your sister falls into the first catagory, all you can do is try and be there an support her if she wants it.
i hope something good comes out of the situation as some people who visit that dark deep hole do turn their life around and realise what is important to them.
some people do it as a cry for help as they have nothing else they can do or anyone they feel they can turn to and they realise what they have done and seek help, support and advice.
some are determined to kill themselves and unfortuately there is little you can do to try and help these people, but support them as they eventually will succeed.
bonedigger, your sister falls into the first catagory, all you can do is try and be there an support her if she wants it.
i hope something good comes out of the situation as some people who visit that dark deep hole do turn their life around and realise what is important to them.
Quote by Bonedigger
Just wondered if anyone can help me unjumble my thoughts?
((Hugs))
Has your sister been diagnosed with depression? If not maybe she has been suffering with it without letting on?
Depression is generally a chemical imbalance and so you have to look at it from that point of view. If this is the case then all logical thought processes will be mucked about.
Your sister may have thought at the time that it was a perfectly logical thing to do, rather than pick up the phone and tell someone how she was feeling. Other people or factors won't have come into it.
I'm guessing that she will get some help now and that needs to be your focus. You can't change the past so try not to dwell on it. (hugs)
Thanks for all your kind words and sensible suggestions....i think I am finally being able to make sense of things thanks to seeing others views.
I have spoken to my sis today and she assures me she wouldnt recommend it to anyone and will never be going to that 'place' again.
Like you say, now its out in the open, at least we can beging to help and support her.
Thank you all so much.
I have spoken to my sis today and she assures me she wouldnt recommend it to anyone and will never be going to that 'place' again.
Like you say, now its out in the open, at least we can beging to help and support her.
Thank you all so much.
Sex God
I'm sorry to hear about this Boney 
I agree wholeheartedly with LP or Random wotsit (whatever his name is lol). It's the opinion that most matches mine.
xxx
I agree wholeheartedly with LP or Random wotsit (whatever his name is lol). It's the opinion that most matches mine.
xxx
one of my friends from my teenage years committed suicide last week, leaving a 12 yr old daughter.
The worst part of it is that 6yrs ago, another mutual friend did the same thing... leaving behind a pregnant wife and a 6 yr old daughter.
In the interim, the recently departed, had become a "father figure" to those young children who had lost their father... and the 3 chiildren had become really close (like sisters).
As you might imagine, things are in total turmoil around here.... and no-one can work out how he could have done such a thing.. especially when he was so close to the situation at the time and knew exactly how bad those that had been left behind were traumatised.
It is no-doubt badly going to affect these poor innocent kids even more, together with their wider circle of friends.... who must now think that suicide is a "normal" thing to do when adults cant cope....
how shitty things have become!!!!
The worst part of it is that 6yrs ago, another mutual friend did the same thing... leaving behind a pregnant wife and a 6 yr old daughter.
In the interim, the recently departed, had become a "father figure" to those young children who had lost their father... and the 3 chiildren had become really close (like sisters).
As you might imagine, things are in total turmoil around here.... and no-one can work out how he could have done such a thing.. especially when he was so close to the situation at the time and knew exactly how bad those that had been left behind were traumatised.
It is no-doubt badly going to affect these poor innocent kids even more, together with their wider circle of friends.... who must now think that suicide is a "normal" thing to do when adults cant cope....
how shitty things have become!!!!
well..something close to my thoughts this week-end. 7 years ago on Nov 1st my brother committed suicide. Its been a difficult week-end....more trying to keep my mom occupied so it doesn't prey on her mind to much. I said at his funeral and I say now...if I could see him, I'ade give him a slap. He may well of being feel down, haveing his wife left him. But the devastion he left behind...by his actions deserve a slap. My mother haveing already lost one child, was in pieces and he also left three children, now fatherless.
haveing said that I think we may all have been to the end of that tunnel where there seems very little light. I know I have more than once thought that maybe I would be beter off out of here. Thing is I'm to much of a coward to ever carry it through.
So in conclusion, I would say that yes in my opinion it is in reality a selfish act. the person concerned is dead and out of the misery..but they do heap misery and upset onto a great many others. Please if you ever do reach that tunnel with little light...think of others, turn around and start walking in the other direction.
haveing said that I think we may all have been to the end of that tunnel where there seems very little light. I know I have more than once thought that maybe I would be beter off out of here. Thing is I'm to much of a coward to ever carry it through.
So in conclusion, I would say that yes in my opinion it is in reality a selfish act. the person concerned is dead and out of the misery..but they do heap misery and upset onto a great many others. Please if you ever do reach that tunnel with little light...think of others, turn around and start walking in the other direction.
do ya know what....i love you lot.....you have spoken the most sense without judgement or bias, and a lot of you have spoken from the heart....and for every one of your posts I thank you from the bottom of my heart.
I feel now that I can move forward and my heart can begin to heal, so I can help hers too :kiss: :kiss: to you all, and BIG :therethere: :theretheer: to all of you who have or are going through the same thing. :inlove:
I feel now that I can move forward and my heart can begin to heal, so I can help hers too
:kiss: :kiss: to you all, and BIG :therethere: :theretheer: to all of you who have or are going through the same thing. :inlove: speaking from a personal point of view... suicide for me was a final straw, i had suffered severe depression for years and at the time was very much alone, i didnt do it for attention as no one would of noticed me gone, i didnt do it to die either.. i wanted to just go to sleep.... at the time i didnt think it selfish i felt i was doing the world a favour... but now looking back i cant believe i was so low that that option was my only option.. now i believe i was being selfish and feeling sorry for myself.. the overdose was the wake up call i needed... waking up not dead three days later was the best thing ive done... some say you have to hit rock bottom before you see the light and in my case waking up was the best feeling in the world... since then i stopped taking all my anti depressants, i worked on myself and i count each day as a blessing and a gift.....
i know of people who threaten suicide as a weapon to hurt another person, and them people i feel are acting out and its not about there pain .. its about causing others pain instead.
what i learnt from it was that people who say there gonna do it generally dont... its the ones like me that told no one, and meant to do it that were doing it for real.
if shes doing this for a cry for help, then show her what the world would be like without her, get her to the docs asap and meds or councilling, but if its just to cause another person pain.. give her a good hard slap either physical or methapisyical and shake her shoulders to snap her out of it........
death is final, theres no re-runs.
i know of people who threaten suicide as a weapon to hurt another person, and them people i feel are acting out and its not about there pain .. its about causing others pain instead.
what i learnt from it was that people who say there gonna do it generally dont... its the ones like me that told no one, and meant to do it that were doing it for real.
if shes doing this for a cry for help, then show her what the world would be like without her, get her to the docs asap and meds or councilling, but if its just to cause another person pain.. give her a good hard slap either physical or methapisyical and shake her shoulders to snap her out of it........
death is final, theres no re-runs.
Sex God
and yet one of my friends died from liver failure after a paracetamol overdose.
Hugs to Mrs B and the Bone family. Keep strong.
Hugs to Mrs B and the Bone family. Keep strong.
Quote by noladreams30
and yet one of my friends died from liver failure after a paracetamol overdose.
Hugs to Mrs B and the Bone family. Keep strong.
took me 18mths to clear my liver from damage.. YES paracetamol does kill and its a very long painfull death..dont be so quick to pass it off its very very dangerous if taken silly. i still feel nervous having a paracetamol even though my liver is recovered now.... be carefull squiffs its not a nothing.
xxxx
Sex God
Quote by Bonedigger
Thanks for all your kind words and sensible suggestions....i think I am finally being able to make sense of things thanks to seeing others views.
I have spoken to my sis today and she assures me she wouldnt recommend it to anyone and will never be going to that 'place' again.
Like you say, now its out in the open, at least we can beging to help and support her.
Thank you all so much.
if it is one thing she gets out of this is that its sounds like this was her "rock bottom"... and one you hit there... it is only up from there....
An overdose of Paracetamol is one of the worst kinds of death imaginable. People think it just sends you to sleep - it doesn't it causes internal bleeding and excruciating pain. Death is slow and agonising.
My own cousin was 34 when he took his own life. He was severely depressed after the break up of his marriage and was found hanging in a Glasgow tenament.
His father, my uncle, has never recovered. He feels intense guilt because he believes he should have done more to help him.
My own cousin was 34 when he took his own life. He was severely depressed after the break up of his marriage and was found hanging in a Glasgow tenament.
His father, my uncle, has never recovered. He feels intense guilt because he believes he should have done more to help him.
Quote by Steve_zodiac
An overdose of Paracetamol is one of the worst kinds of death imaginable. People think it just sends you to sleep - it doesn't it causes internal bleeding and excruciating pain. Death is slow and agonising.
My own cousin was 34 when he took his own life. He was severely depressed after the break up of his marriage and was found hanging in a Glasgow tenament.
His father, my uncle, has never recovered. He feels intense guilt because he believes he should have done more to help him.
((((((((((((((((hugs))))))))))))))))))
Quote by Squiffs
all paracetamol does is give you liver problems in the long run. it doesn't kill you. my mum even took 30 packets (PACKETS of 16 capsules) of nurofen and the dr just said the worst she'd get was a stomach ache in the morning.
paracetamol will kill very effectively, initially through liver trauma, then eventual degradation. Nurofen is made from ibuprofen, not paracetamol.
((hugs))) steve,
thanks to everyone for sharing their stories, it makes me feel better knowing others understand.....its one of those things where you think you are the only one, but once you be brave and bring it into the open, you find out youre not alone.
apparently from talking to her more today, the hospital told her that a lot of paracetamol have a coating on thses days that if you ingest it in sufficient quantities, as you would with an overdose, it makes you vomit, this is what happened to her, and she vomited for England....
which meant she didnt have to have her stomach pumped, and hardly any paracetamol got into her system....how damn lucky is she...i imagine theres not many people get away almost physically unscathed after taking 50 paracetamol.
From spending so long working in the NHS i knew as soon as I found out that shed taken paracetamol, that it could all end in such a horrible way. I think she certainly had a guardian angel watching over her that night, who decided she wasnt for the next world just yet :inlove:
thanks to everyone for sharing their stories, it makes me feel better knowing others understand.....its one of those things where you think you are the only one, but once you be brave and bring it into the open, you find out youre not alone.
apparently from talking to her more today, the hospital told her that a lot of paracetamol have a coating on thses days that if you ingest it in sufficient quantities, as you would with an overdose, it makes you vomit, this is what happened to her, and she vomited for England....
which meant she didnt have to have her stomach pumped, and hardly any paracetamol got into her system....how damn lucky is she...i imagine theres not many people get away almost physically unscathed after taking 50 paracetamol.
From spending so long working in the NHS i knew as soon as I found out that shed taken paracetamol, that it could all end in such a horrible way. I think she certainly had a guardian angel watching over her that night, who decided she wasnt for the next world just yet :inlove:
Quote by Bonedigger
Right....I'm posting this cos I could do with some more takes on this.....on tuesday my sister took an overdose of paracetamol, after a row ovwer the phone with her partner over money.
I'm having a hard time getting my head round this, and a hard time trying to make sense of al sorts of jumbled thoughts going on in my head.
Thankfully, it appears it was a cry for help, she felt at the time there was no option....but once she had done it, instantly regretted what she had done and called the ambulance herself.....
She has kids, and the thought that she felt like even leaving her kids behind was better than anything else, is something that I cant make sense of.
Just wondered if anyone can help me unjumble my thoughts?
Bone I do not think you will ever find the answer to that one.
Sometimes you can look back and see reasons why but for me there were no reasons.
I had a friend of mine who took his own life some 13 years ago now. He had an 8 year old child and when I say he WAS the life and soul, he really was.
He had a lovely girlfriend he was living with, a good job and to everyone he had no obvious problems. He planned his death with military precision, and to this day nobody can fathom it out.
His Father I had known for years as he was a friend of my Fathers. Seeing how it destroyed him I would say it was a completly selfish act. His son had to live with that stigma for years, and his Father has never really got over it.
So sometimes the signs are never there, and for me I will never be able to understand his reasons, and I suppose nor will his close family who have had to live with the suicide stigma, plus the loss of someone they loved dearly.
Quote by Squiffs
all paracetamol does is give you liver problems in the long run. it doesn't kill you. my mum even took 30 packets (PACKETS of 16 capsules) of nurofen and the dr just said the worst she'd get was a stomach ache in the morning.
Paracetamol is extremely dangerous even in relatively small doses and long term abuse can definitely cause liver damage.
Nurofen is NOT paracetamol or even remotely like it. It is a brand name based on ibuprofen which is a non steroidal anti-inflammatory drug (NSAID) similar to aspirin (but not the same as) and can cause haematemesis (bleeding of the stomach lining and vomiting blood). It would take quite a large number of Nurofen pills to do any significant damage.
Quote by __random_orbit__It is all down to what motivated it. All human action must be judge taking into consideration the reason behind the act. Suicide is no different.
No reflection on your personal circumstances Bonie.
I feel suicide as an act can be as justifiable, selfish, brave, cowardly, noble or stupid as any other human act driven by emotion or ethic.
lp
Travis
Quote by Bonedigger
Right....I'm posting this cos I could do with some more takes on this.....on tuesday my sister took an overdose of paracetamol, after a row ovwer the phone with her partner over money.
I'm having a hard time getting my head round this, and a hard time trying to make sense of al sorts of jumbled thoughts going on in my head.
Thankfully, it appears it was a cry for help, she felt at the time there was no option....but once she had done it, instantly regretted what she had done and called the ambulance herself.....
She has kids, and the thought that she felt like even leaving her kids behind was better than anything else, is something that I cant make sense of.
Just wondered if anyone can help me unjumble my thoughts?
As you said she regretted it and hopefully wont try it again, so is very likely a cry for help.
It's a subject very much about personal opinion, eg, sefish, brave etc etc.
My personal opinion, having a little experience on the subject is that if someone really wants to commit suicide , they will. It's quite hard to stop sometimes because the person who actually succeeds in doing it sometimes never tells anyone that they are thinking of doing it and so no-one has any warning and no-one is able to help.
A 33 year old man that I know of recently commited suicide by hanging himself a couple of weeks ago in a park. No-one even had an incling that he felt this way :shock:
So what im trying to say is that at least you know now that you sister may have these thoughts and you/she can maybe be helped before it gets to that stage.
I wish her all the best.
Louise xx
Most suicide attempts are as a result of the effects of depression. This being the case then selfishness does not come into it. Depression affects your outlook on everything including your reasoning powers. It's very difficult to explain and really one can only understand if one has experienced sever depression.
Any perception of selfishness is in the eyes of the people around the person who commits suicide (or attempts to). This in turn actually makes the people who make the accusation of selfishness the selfish ones as they are not seeing the world from the eyes of the suicidee and as such are only seeing the effect it has had on them.
Depression is not an invisible illness, neither is it one that hits overnight. It's very rare that suicide is an impulsive act and invariably people see the signs in hindsight. This being the case it can be said that the true selfishness is in the minds of the people around the depressive who saw but didn't click and didn't act and didn't help. The depressive attempting/committing suicide does not consider the people around him/her simply because they no longer exist. All that exists is the negativity and despondency that brought them to the act.
Any perception of selfishness is in the eyes of the people around the person who commits suicide (or attempts to). This in turn actually makes the people who make the accusation of selfishness the selfish ones as they are not seeing the world from the eyes of the suicidee and as such are only seeing the effect it has had on them.
Depression is not an invisible illness, neither is it one that hits overnight. It's very rare that suicide is an impulsive act and invariably people see the signs in hindsight. This being the case it can be said that the true selfishness is in the minds of the people around the depressive who saw but didn't click and didn't act and didn't help. The depressive attempting/committing suicide does not consider the people around him/her simply because they no longer exist. All that exists is the negativity and despondency that brought them to the act.
