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Tony Blair ...Catholic !! Really ?
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Master of Sex
does anyone really believe that blair didnt get the results that he wanted ?
Sex God
It is his concealment, of his beliefs, not his beliefs.
when? when did he try to conceal it? i've known that he's been heading towards Catholicism for 4 or 5 years, so he can't have tried too hard to keep it secret? he's converted offially now it's no longer problematic, but maybe, he didn't feel ready to convert until he'd fully explored his newfound faith? the power of change is central to most religions i'd think, and what he believes today may not be what he believed this time last year, so i'm not sure what he's meant to have been hiding? ;)
does anyone really believe that blair didnt get the results that he wanted ?
possibly, on some things, but as Dean has pointed out, Tony Blair's personal, political, and religious leanings were moderated by six hundred odd MP's, seven hundred odd Lords, the Constitution and the Courts, several thousand party members and financial sponsors, the economy, our long-term strategic interests, the E.U., the U.N., International Law, Treaty obligations, and the entire adult population of this country? fair few safeguards there? ;)
i fully understand the concern that our ex-Prime Minister might have had to acknowledge the primacy of Head of State on religious matters, but i'm pretty sure he's familiar with British history, and knows full well why we divorced ourselves from the Church in Rome 500 years ago, and understands exactly why we have a three-way Seperation of Powers, and a ceremonial Head of State / Head of the Church above him. all his powers were negotiated, and subject to our consent? the man's faith is noone's concern but his. would he have acted differently if he'd remained high church C of E? i suspect not.
neil x x x ;)
Master of Sex
were you not here when he ran roughshod over international law and public opinion before the iraq war?
there is a more serious point here about church and state not being seperate in this country, as we still have bishops of the church of england in the upper house,although even in america they`ve voted in a president that god talks to oil and leaders on a crusade we`ll be lucky if all our kids aren`t fighting in the middle east in years to come
there is a more serious point here about church and state not being seperate in this country, as we still have bishops of the church of england in the upper house,although even in america they`ve voted in a president that god talks to oil and leaders on a crusade we`ll be lucky if all our kids aren`t fighting in the middle east in years to come
Sex God
were you not here when he ran roughshod over international law and public opinion before the iraq war?
the International Law thing is highly debatable. i personally believe that pre-emption in supposed self-defence was comprehensively rejected as a defence against charges of War Crimes at the Nuremberg trials that saw Nazis hanged, and the invasion of a sovereign nation looks like it violates Article 2(4) of the U.N. Charter, but then i'm not a lawyer, and better legal minds than mine have argued that a material breach of U.N. Resolution 1441 makes the war legal, which is probably a complete crock of shite, IMO, but i doubt we'll get very far on that particular argument? ;)
as to riding roughshod over public opinion, yes, thousands took to the street in opposition, but then millions stayed at home, or voted him into power in the first place, and then voted him back into power, again, for a third time, two years after the invasion? seems he took the majority of people in this country with him.
FFS, started out with religion, now we've got into politics, but Church and State are entirely seperate? deliberately so. we could probably have a better Constitution, but at least what we've got ensures they will remain so. there's round about 26 Bishops in The Lords, who are probably massively outnumbered by the Jews, and the Muslims, and the athiests in there, so they're not really all that powerful as constituents are they? there's any number of checks and balances on the Executive, the Church ((( Roman or English ))) being just one of them.
n x x x ;)
Sex God
Quote by neilinleeds
FFS, started out with religion, now we've got into politics?;)
n x x x ;)
Yes
lets not dilute the stupidy of such a post in the first place
Sex God
Quote by Suede-head
The point i was making was that he was "unable" not "unwilling" to disclose his new found faith.
In fact followers of Politics would have been aware he was converting to Catholicism ... like all men who want a quiet life he was following the lead of his wife!
In fact it was very well-established in the media that he was closely linked to the Roman Catholic church, in that his wife and children are catholics, and that he had attended Catholic church services many times, and was also reported to be taking instruction in the Catholic faith.
Like a previous poster said the Prime Minister of this country can not be a confirmed Catholic ... in todays age of multi-culturalism this seems anarchic. I for one would have admired Blair more if he had "come out" as a Catholic rather than wait till he had served his time as PM.
He did "come out", more or less - see my point above. In fact there is no constitutional barrier to the Prime Minister being a Catholic, it was just regarded as being rather odd that a Catholic Prime Minister would be appointing Church of England archbishops and bishops - a bit like Arsene Wenger picking the England cricket team!
We could of have had the debate as to whether a Prime Minister`s faith effected his policies in the Public, rather than on on a Swingers forum .. but as Mallock quite rightly puts "Does it really fukin matter ???????"
I agree with Mallock on that!
Master of Sex
twice neilinleeds you`ve mentioned our do not have a constitution.
we do have complete seperation of the catholic church and state though, but not of the e.
time we did
we do have complete seperation of the catholic church and state though, but not of the e.
time we did
The Constitution of the United Kingdom is the uncodified body of law and convention under which the United Kingdom is governed.
Because the UK has no single codified documentary constitution along the lines of the Constitution of the United States, it is often said that the country has an "unwritten constitution".However, most of the constitution does exist in the written form of statutes, court judgments and treaties. The constitution does have some unwritten sources, though, including Parliamentary conventions and the royal prerogatives.
Were we all bored at christmas when this thread was put up :lol: :lol: I really feel at this moment in time with the likelyhood of houses in negative equity next year, redundancies on the cards with less white collar jobs than in the past 10 years in this country and Pakistan in crisis there are more important debates to be had than whether Tony has become a catholic. But maybe I am in the wrong .................................
Because the UK has no single codified documentary constitution along the lines of the Constitution of the United States, it is often said that the country has an "unwritten constitution".However, most of the constitution does exist in the written form of statutes, court judgments and treaties. The constitution does have some unwritten sources, though, including Parliamentary conventions and the royal prerogatives.
Were we all bored at christmas when this thread was put up
:lol: :lol: I really feel at this moment in time with the likelyhood of houses in negative equity next year, redundancies on the cards with less white collar jobs than in the past 10 years in this country and Pakistan in crisis there are more important debates to be had than whether Tony has become a catholic. But maybe I am in the wrong ................................. 
Sex God
Is this still running 
Master of Sex
looks like it is
Orgasminator
If I became a catholic would I get an SH thread 
Sex God
Quote by Corrie2007are you taking up sewing then?????
If I became a catholic would I get an SH thread
:giggle: :giggle:
Sex God
I see Corrie is doing a bit of needling, and FB is in stitches.
Sex God
Quote by MikeNorth
I see Corrie is doing a bit of needling, and FB is in stitches.
Well, you have to laugh hmm?
Sex God
Has this turned into the jewish thread for tailors?
right, just to stick my oar in
ALL RELIGIONS ARE EVIL
catholics in history just happen to be the most evil bunch of buggers this planet has ever seen.
as a complete atheist i agree with flower lol
and if anybody cares to argue...
the bible is about two entities, one is a complete b****d, total megalomaniac, loves baby killing, mass murder, shake the world, kill is a pastime, and the other is a devil,
i defy any catholic who actually read the bible to say god is good.
ask galilileo who had the audacity to suggest the earth revolved round the sun lol
ALL RELIGIONS ARE EVIL
catholics in history just happen to be the most evil bunch of buggers this planet has ever seen.
as a complete atheist i agree with flower lol
and if anybody cares to argue...
the bible is about two entities, one is a complete b****d, total megalomaniac, loves baby killing, mass murder, shake the world, kill is a pastime, and the other is a devil,
i defy any catholic who actually read the bible to say god is good.
ask galilileo who had the audacity to suggest the earth revolved round the sun lol
Sex God
Quote by willbe_jane
If Dr Ian Paisley and Martin McGuiness can shake hands at Stormont castle and put aside past differences for the good of a country, one that has been blighted with over 300years of unrest, inequallity and war because of the attitudes above, what is more concerning is that attitudes and retoric of the shankil road of the past still persists.
I really do not think that the "Orange v Green" argument comes into this debate so can we please keep it non-political?
The point is that no-one really cares what TB has done about his religious beliefs, if that's what they are, so why make such a public song and dance about it. If not for some kind of (public / political ) gain?
lets face it, if any of us decided to turn our coats, embrace a new religion, join weightwatchers, whatever
Would it really require self invited media interest? ............... Sometimes you just have to keep your eyes on the ball Quote by Pete_sw
The point is that no-one really cares what TB has done about his religious beliefs, if that's what they are, so why make such a public song and dance about it................ Sometimes you just have to keep your eyes on the ball
Same goes to Jaq_kryps, playing at troll. No Catholics are rubbishing your belief system so why rubbish ours? Live and let live. Would people be so free and easy with words like "evil" and "papist" about any other religion?
Quote by Jaq__kryps
right, just to stick my oar in
ALL RELIGIONS ARE EVIL
catholics in history just happen to be the most evil bunch of buggers this planet has ever seen.
as a complete atheist i agree with flower lol
and if anybody cares to argue...
the bible is about two entities, one is a complete b****d, total megalomaniac, loves baby killing, mass murder, shake the world, kill is a pastime, and the other is a devil,
i defy any catholic who actually read the bible to say god is good.
ask galilileo who had the audacity to suggest the earth revolved round the sun lol
Well, you stuck ya oar in 19 days or so after the last post.... thought this thread had gone to rest for good!!
:? So if all religions are evil do you mean that those people who practice them are as well??? Cos Im met some evil non believers and some lovely peole who have faith (of any kind)... respect for whoever an whatever faith they believe in goes a long way me thinks!!
:? :? :?
Sex God
Quote by anais
right, just to stick my oar in
ALL RELIGIONS ARE EVIL
catholics in history just happen to be the most evil bunch of buggers this planet has ever seen.
as a complete atheist i agree with flower lol
and if anybody cares to argue...
the bible is about two entities, one is a complete b****d, total megalomaniac, loves baby killing, mass murder, shake the world, kill is a pastime, and the other is a devil,
i defy any catholic who actually read the bible to say god is good.
ask galilileo who had the audacity to suggest the earth revolved round the sun lol
Well, you stuck ya oar in 19 days or so after the last post.... thought this thread had gone to rest for good!!
:?So if all religions are evil do you mean that those people who practice them are as well??? Cos Im met some evil non believers and some lovely peole who have faith (of any kind)... respect for whoever an whatever faith they believe in goes a long way me thinks!!
:? :? :?
And so we also post on it again My point of view is that George Michael, no matter what your feelings are. did a fine job in 1987 (21yrs ago :cry
With his 'Faith' 
I'm just getting into all this politics marlarky, now I understand years ago the churches were the 
and they were parliament as it were.
So, call me thick but do you have to be a certain religion to serve in a certain party?
I cannot understand why Blair being what he is makes any difference?
and they were parliament as it were. So, call me thick but do you have to be a certain religion to serve in a certain party?
I cannot understand why Blair being what he is makes any difference?
