With the introduction of the new equality law 2010 coming into effect on october 1st,was wondering how it will effect swing clubs swing sites etc as it will be illegal to charge diferent prices based on gender etc. so a single guy can argue he shouldn't pay more to gain entry to a club than a couple etc.
Will clubs bring down single guys admission or charge couples more?
Also is this site breaking the new law as we have meets advertised for events after october 1st where the new law is being broken due to diferent pricing policy?
Other sites we use are telling members to alter there pricing structure for events after october 1st as they feel they can be prosecuted for advertising that event.
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good news or bad news (ARE WE BREAKING THE LAW)
Sex God
I think swing clubs have escaped so far because they are classed as private members clubs, so could have their chosen pricing structure. I would have thought that munches organised through this site would be the same - ie you have to be a member to attend. Fuzzy bits might occur where the events are classified as socials rather than munches, though.
Sex God
There's another thread about this in Club Meets:
http://www.swingingheaven.co.uk/swingers-forum/viewtopic/327794.html
http://www.swingingheaven.co.uk/swingers-forum/viewtopic/327794.html
this is the link......it is plain and clear.
You can not descriminate against anyone on age, colour, disability, or SEX.
as it states this act is specifically aimed at private members clubs and associations. They will no longer be exempt. There will be a heavy fine for those caught flaunting this law. I do thinks clubs will have to look at this and amend their stucture accordingly. Else they will find themselves the wrong side of the law !!
I can't remember properly, I wasn't interested enough to concentrate ... but, I think there was something in there about it not counting if you have "less than 25 members" OR "no formal membership policy" ... So, if you keep the membership small, or don't actually have a membership, it might not count anyway.
Just like the gaming laws, there will always be a loophole to be exploited somewhere.
Just like the gaming laws, there will always be a loophole to be exploited somewhere.
Orgasminator
Hmmm its very thought provoking is this. I've friends who vehemently object to the fact that clubs charge more for single men than for couples or single women but I also can see why the clubs do it. Without couples or women there's not much of a club and some clubs charge over the odds for single fellas to try to keep numbers down a bit.
Will clubs charge each person admission or will they be able to get away with charging a couple the same as a single person?
If we as a couple had to pay the same each it would make it cost prohibitive to go as I would imagine it would for many others. But if they lower the admission to such a level that couples are relatively unaffected (therefore keeping the club actually worth visiting) the revenue they stand to lose on dropping the singles admission is quite probably too much for some clubs to stand.
Will clubs charge each person admission or will they be able to get away with charging a couple the same as a single person?
If we as a couple had to pay the same each it would make it cost prohibitive to go as I would imagine it would for many others. But if they lower the admission to such a level that couples are relatively unaffected (therefore keeping the club actually worth visiting) the revenue they stand to lose on dropping the singles admission is quite probably too much for some clubs to stand.
Having scanned the guidance, which is effectively the law (a bit like the Highway Code I guess) the following three paragraphs stare out significantly...
What is an ‘association’?
In equality law, an ‘association’ is any group of 25 or more members which has rules to
control how someone becomes a member, involving a genuine selection process.
When is a club or society not an ‘association’?
When it has no form of selection to decide who becomes a
member
Sometimes an organisation will say you have to take out membership to use their facilities
or services or to belong to a group. If it does not have any form of selection to decide who
becomes a member, it is not an association in equality law – even if it is called ‘club’,
‘society’ or ‘association’. Usually you pay a fee either at the time you join or on an ongoing
basis or to use the services (or both).
When it has no formal rules or fewer than 25 members
Clubs which have no formal rules governing membership or whose membership is less
than 25 are not associations in equality law.
For example:
• A book-reading club run by a group of friends.
• A walking club which anyone who finds out about it can belong to.
• A choir which is open to anyone who works at a particular place but where no
approval is required to join.
This sort of informal ‘club’ is not covered by equality law at all.
Unless someone can find a reference I have missed, or I have misunderstood the situation, I would venture to suggest that the OP's concerns are unfounded - particularly in relation to SH and clubs where generally you don't have to be a member to gain admission.
IN EDIT
I've copied and pasted this to the other thread in the Forum Club Meets
What is an ‘association’?
In equality law, an ‘association’ is any group of 25 or more members which has rules to
control how someone becomes a member, involving a genuine selection process.
When is a club or society not an ‘association’?
When it has no form of selection to decide who becomes a
member
Sometimes an organisation will say you have to take out membership to use their facilities
or services or to belong to a group. If it does not have any form of selection to decide who
becomes a member, it is not an association in equality law – even if it is called ‘club’,
‘society’ or ‘association’. Usually you pay a fee either at the time you join or on an ongoing
basis or to use the services (or both).
When it has no formal rules or fewer than 25 members
Clubs which have no formal rules governing membership or whose membership is less
than 25 are not associations in equality law.
For example:
• A book-reading club run by a group of friends.
• A walking club which anyone who finds out about it can belong to.
• A choir which is open to anyone who works at a particular place but where no
approval is required to join.
This sort of informal ‘club’ is not covered by equality law at all.
Unless someone can find a reference I have missed, or I have misunderstood the situation, I would venture to suggest that the OP's concerns are unfounded - particularly in relation to SH and clubs where generally you don't have to be a member to gain admission.
IN EDIT
I've copied and pasted this to the other thread in the Forum Club Meets
Quote by deancannock
every swingers club I know......is members only !!!!
And ofacuse has to have over 25 members to run and survive....so their admission charge will be covered by this legislatiion
ah but...
Quote by the law
In equality law, an ‘association’ is any group of 25 or more members which has rules to control how someone becomes a member, involving a genuine selection process.
Are the members of your swingers clubs selected on their dick size perhaps? :silly:
Sex God
Worth 'merging' this with the other thread
http://www.swingingheaven.co.uk/swingers-forum/viewtopic/327794.html
and then only have one thread ?
http://www.swingingheaven.co.uk/swingers-forum/viewtopic/327794.html
and then only have one thread ?
Quote by deancannockI detect a loophole.
every swingers club I know......is members only !!!!
And ofacuse has to have over 25 members to run and survive....so their admission charge will be covered by this legislatiion
You create 10 clubs with limited membership, then have a weekly get together where all the different club members can meet up.
Sex God
I'd bet that enterprising people, both within and without the swinging scene, will find so many loopholes that the laws will be rarely, if ever, enforced.
John
John
Sex God
Quote by deancannock
every swingers club I know......is members only !!!!
And ofacuse has to have over 25 members to run and survive....so their admission charge will be covered by this legislatiion
That's cos you are a guy. We have never had to "join" anything but I know Clubs keep a register of single guys so they can extract annual membership AND a heavy door price.
If this law is allowed to effect clubs, i believe it will see clubs close...what makes these clubs are the women attending, and the majority of women come as a couple...if you up the prices in line with single guys, i believe it will drive away couples...if you drop the price of the single guys but still keep their numbers down this may not be cost effective for the club, so what do they do, they raise the number of single guys into the clubs...and quite possibly drive couple's away, accept maybe for the odd greedy girl and they alone can't keep a club afloat. in the end the only people in the clubs will just be single guys and the odd couple. So you do the maths and figure out why this law will be the end to swinging clubs.
Couples that generally went to mixed nights, because it was cheaper for them will probably start attending couples only nights if it turns out to be no differnce in price.
Couples that generally went to mixed nights, because it was cheaper for them will probably start attending couples only nights if it turns out to be no differnce in price.
Sex God
Quote by GnV
I honestly don't believe the change in the law will affect clubs at all (see my earlier post) so this is really a panic about nothing.
Lets hope it just one of these then
Quote by Islandcpl1
This will only be settled when it's tested in a court of law. I wonder who the 1st brave soul will be? And I bet the Briefs will be queuing up to take it on pro-bono just for the publicity. Could be interesting to see how this develops.
In my view, I think you WILL be covered by the legislation as you will no doubt be selecting members on the basis that they are not "idiots".
Quote by kentswingers777
A load of old meddling rubbish.
A club should be able to charge what they like, to who they like.....manager or owners discretion.
Powers has pretty much summed it up really.
right,......so you saying a racist club owner should be able to charge white skined person £5 entry.....but charge a black skined person £ 50 to get in.....his view being he don't won't to many blacks in.
Are you saying a club should be able to turn away someone in a wheelchair, because they say..oh you will get in the way !!
are you saying a club, should be allowed to ask if you gay or staight, as it don't want gay people in there !!!
Lets remember this legislation is about discrimination..be it on the grounds of colour, disability or sex !!! It is not aimed at swingers clubs......but all clubs of any variety. Why on earth should a swingers club, be a special case and above the law !!!
Quote by deancannock
Why on earth should a swingers club, be a special case and above the law !!!
They are not!
A swingers club is not a special case because, having scanned the guidance, the following three paragraphs stare out significantly and provide the answer.
What is an ‘association’?
In equality law, an ‘association’ is any group of 25 or more members which has rules to
control how someone becomes a member, involving a genuine selection process.
When is a club or society not an ‘association’?
When it has no form of selection to decide who becomes a member.
Sometimes an organisation will say you have to take out membership to use their facilities or services or to belong to a group. If it does not have any form of selection to decide who becomes a member, it is not an association in equality law – even if it is called ‘club’, ‘society’ or ‘association’. Usually you pay a fee either at the time you join or on an ongoing basis or to use the services (or both).
When it has no formal rules or fewer than 25 members
Clubs which have no formal rules governing membership or whose membership is less
than 25 are not associations in equality law.
For example:
• A book-reading club run by a group of friends.
• A walking club which anyone who finds out about it can belong to.
• A choir which is open to anyone who works at a particular place but where no
approval is required to join.
This sort of informal ‘club’ is not covered by equality law at all.
Unless someone can find a reference I have missed, or I have misunderstood the situation, I would venture to suggest that the OP's concerns are unfounded - particularly in relation to SH and clubs where generally you don't have to be a member to gain admission.
It can't be any clearer, surely
Read it for yourself! GnV...i was referring to kents comment on any club owner should be able to let in whoever he wants at his discretion !!!
As to is a Swingers Club.....party to this legislation or not...I'm still unsure. There is a selection process to a sort.....are you male/ female/couple. They allow alot more couples for example to become members....basically no restriction on numbers !! Is it any different to when golf clubs didn't want female members !!! As say...I'm very unsure about it and how it will effect places. For example there are female only Gyms... will they now be made to accept males. But as the orginal OP said....other sites are now advising their members about this act and asking them to take it into consideration, when planning a party or social !!
As to is a Swingers Club.....party to this legislation or not...I'm still unsure. There is a selection process to a sort.....are you male/ female/couple. They allow alot more couples for example to become members....basically no restriction on numbers !! Is it any different to when golf clubs didn't want female members !!! As say...I'm very unsure about it and how it will effect places. For example there are female only Gyms... will they now be made to accept males. But as the orginal OP said....other sites are now advising their members about this act and asking them to take it into consideration, when planning a party or social !!
Sex God
Quote by GnV
Unless someone can find a reference I have missed, or I have misunderstood the situation, I would venture to suggest that the OP's concerns are unfounded - particularly in relation to SH and clubs where generally you don't have to be a member to gain admission.
It can't be any clearer, surely
Never been to a club where I didn't have to be a member to gain entry...
Quote by deany
right,......so you saying a racist club owner should be able to charge white skined person £5 entry.....but charge a black skined person £ 50 to get in.....his view being he don't won't to many blacks in.
Nope I am not saying that.....against the law!
Quote by deany
Are you saying a club should be able to turn away someone in a wheelchair, because they say..oh you will get in the way !!
Nope I am not saying that.....against the law!!
Quote by deany
are you saying a club, should be allowed to ask if you gay or staight, as it don't want gay people in there !!!
Nope I am not saying that.....against the law!!
Quote by deany
Lets remember this legislation is about discrimination..be it on the grounds of colour, disability or sex !!! It is not aimed at swingers clubs......but all clubs of any variety. Why on earth should a swingers club, be a special case and above the law !!!
So as a lot of swingers parties are held at peoples homes, are you telling me that the house owner cannot pick or choose who comes into their home? How silly would that be.
Clubs are a different matter. But as a private party they can I would presume be entitled to let in or not, at their total discretion?
So as a scenario a club owner has 30 couples.....5 single ladies and 300 single guys, are you really telling me on that balance that he cannot turn anyone away for fear of discriminating someone?
Can you imagine a scene where there are hundreds of single guys wanting to get in? We and I know of others who would walk right out of the door, if we felt the ammount of single guys there was over the top....are we wrong as well for thinking that? Would we be acting against the law by having our views?
What the fuck is this country coming too ffs?
In many restaurants and clubs you will find a sign stating entry is at the owners/managements discretion.....how is one to presume why they did not want a particular person in? Or will the old race card or discrimination against sex card come into play?
My business partner is a DJ at weekends and three weeks ago two black guys were refused entry, and they screamed the race card, of course it had nothing to do with race, but purely they had been ejected previously for trouble, but scream the card they still did.
Now just an excuse to throw around and this new law will be no different, and I believe it will be unworkable in the REAL world.
Warming the Bed
Quote by GnV
Unless someone can find a reference I have missed, or I have misunderstood the situation, I would venture to suggest that the OP's concerns are unfounded - particularly in relation to SH and clubs where generally you don't have to be a member to gain admission.
It can't be any clearer, surely
What you have missed entirely is that swingers clubs will more often fall under the Service Provider, rather than Clubs and Associations category. The same restrictions will affect them however, and I believe Mr Powers is spot on with his post.
Quote by Unc
Unless someone can find a reference I have missed, or I have misunderstood the situation, I would venture to suggest that the OP's concerns are unfounded - particularly in relation to SH and clubs where generally you don't have to be a member to gain admission.
It can't be any clearer, surely
What you have missed entirely is that swingers clubs will more often fall under the Service Provider, rather than Clubs and Associations category. The same restrictions will affect them however, and I believe Mr Powers is spot on with his post.
What services are you getting from the clubs you visit then Unc? Not naughty ones, surely :rascal:
Sex God
At a swimming pool near to me, they have a women only swimming session, which is basically when about 40 asian women swim, with the blinds drawn at the windows. Will they still be able to do that, or will men have to be allowed? Say, a white christian male?
Quote by Kaznkev
That would be fine as they are a " minority "....cannot upset them now....can we? :twisted:
There are more men than women in the country,so no they arent.
What has that got to do with what I was replying too?
Re read FB's post............Asian is a bit of a clue. :twisted:
Quote by kentswingers777
That would be fine as they are a " minority "....cannot upset them now....can we? :twisted:
There are more men than women in the country,so no they arent.
What has that got to do with what I was replying too?
Re read FB's post............Asian is a bit of a clue. :twisted:
For crying out loud...not again!
